Ok, so quotes.watchtower.ca is down, but I had did have a question for you Watchtower Historians out there. Here goes:
Was the 7 times prophecy from Daniel used before or after the Watchtower used the pyramids to predict 1914/1915?
When was the date first mentioned, where, and in what matter?
When was the "invisible return of Christ" first mentioned in reference to 1914?
Anyone know these answers, or where I can find them?
Thanks...
Which came first? (Prediction of 1914/1915 question)
by FaithfulDoubter 7 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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FaithfulDoubter
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VM44
hi FaithfulDoubter,
Russell obtained his chronology first through his study of the Bible.
Then he found books on The Great Pyramid and how its measurements predicted future events in history.
Russell wanted the Great Pyramid measurements to collaborate the dates (such as 1874 as the "beginning of the time of troubles") he had already determined.
Russell wrote about The Great Pyramid in Chapter 10 of his Studies in the Scriptures (Vol. 3).
However, Russell did not give complete details as to where he obtained the numbers used to obtain the year 1874. It appears that he "snuck" in an additional value of 41 so that he could make the calculation give the desired year.
In 1905, he changed the measurements given in vol 3 so as to give the year 1914. Only in 1909, five years afterwards, did a notice appear in The Watchtower giving notice that the numbers had been changed!
Russell was very aware of the weakness in his pyramid calculations and, other than the chapter 10 in SiS3, did not write very much about pyramids in The Watchtower magazine.
Russell simply wanted to get in on the "Great Pyramid" fad that was going on at the time.
--VM44
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peacebaby
Might try Googling 'millenarianism'?
I'm pretty sure I came by this info on this board... but now don't know where...
Edward Bishop Elliot [1793-1875] England, was probably the first one to mention the date 1914 vin his treatise "Hours with the Apocalypse", first published in 1844.
John Aquila Brown, England - in 1823, in his book "The Even-Tide", for the first time explained the 'seven times' of Daniel 4 to mean 2,520 years.
James Hatley Frere[1813] - was first to write on the 2,520 years, but did not conclude the times of the Gentiles(or the 'seven times') to be a period of 2,520 years.
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cabasilas
Try this link:
Historical Publications
Relating to Jehovah’s Witnesses
Links to Sources & Articles Relating to Watchtower History
http://www.catholic-forum.com/members/popestleo/jwhistory.html
It links a lot of WT publications which are online and explains the evolution of the chronological understandings.
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TD
Was the 7 times prophecy from Daniel used before or after the Watchtower used the pyramids to predict 1914/1915?
John Aquila Brown wrote a two volume work in 1823 entitled The Even-Tide; or, Last Triumph of the Blessed and Only Potentate, the King of Kings, and Lord of Lords. Brown predicted that "The full glory of the kingdom of Israel shall be perfected" based upon a period of 2520 years. This is the first known record of an expositor claiming that the "seven times" of Nebuchadnezzar were a prophetic 2,520 year period.
Around 1818, another gentleman by the name of William Miller had became convinced that he could calculate the date for Christ's return. Miller initially based his calculation upon the 2300 days of Daniel 8:14. Eventually Miller's scriptural reckoning was expanded to fifteen separate proofs that Christ’s return and the start of the millennium or 7th "day" would occur sometime between March 21, 1843 and March 21, 1844. These included such things as counting 2520 years from the year 677 BC, which he believed to be the year when Jerusalem fell. Miller recorded his interpretation in a sixty-four page pamphlet published in 1833 entitled Evidence from Scripture and History of the Second Coming of Christ About the Year AD 1843.
Nelson H. Barbour joined the Millerite movement in 1843 at the age of 19, but in his own words, "…lost his religion completely after the Great Disappointment." He subsequently became a miner during the Australian gold rush and did not return home until some years later in 1859. It was during his voyage home that Barbour discovered what he believed to be the critical error in Miller's reckoning. While Miller had started his count of the 1260, 1290, and 1335 "year days" of Revelation 11 and Daniel 12 at different points in the past, Barbour decided that all three periods should be counted from a common starting point --- 538 CE. Soon an eschatological picture every bit as complex as Miller's emerged based upon additional concepts such as "Israel's double," the "Jubilee cycle," "Parallel dispensations" and Brown’s 2520 years derived from the seven times of Daniel chapter four. Barbour located the latter between the years 606 BC and 1914 AD. Barbour subsequently published specific details as to the end of the Gentile Times in his monthly periodical, which now carried the abbreviated title Herald Of The Morning.
Charles Taze Russell first came into contact with Barbour's research in January of 1876. Although Russell had been intrigued by some aspects of Adventism since about 1869, he had previously rejected Adventist chronology and date setting. However he was so impressed with Barbour's work that he paid his expenses to come to Philadelphia to meet with him. Russell was convinced by Barbour and this is the origin of the JW 1914 date.
It definitely precedes the pyramid calculations.
When was the date first mentioned, where, and in what matter?
If you mean specifically with regard to the Bible Students / Jehovah's Witnesses, the 1914 date is first mentioned in the December 1879 issue of Zion's Watch Tower on page 3. If your question is general, then I've given some background above.When was the "invisible return of Christ" first mentioned in reference to 1914?
The Bible Students / Jehovah's Witnesses dated the "invisible return of Christ" to 1874 clear up until the early 1930's. The last clear statement in support of 1874 appeared in the 1929 book, Prophecy. The first clear statement in support of 1914 in The Watchtower appeared in December of 1933.
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yesidid
http://www.catholic-forum.com/members/popestleo/jwhistory.html
What a great resource. Thank you cabasilas for this link.
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cabasilas
At the bottom of that page is a link to a study:
Historical Idealism and Jehovah's Witnesses
by our own Thomas Daniels:
Very well done, IMO.