Could someone help me with a couple of watchtower quotes.

by mtbatoon 9 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • mtbatoon
    mtbatoon

    Could someone help me with a couple of watchtower quotes I'd like to have as a standby should I need them.

    The situation is that my mother recently sent me a copy of the watchtower as it had a family reference. Though I have summed up all my thoughts on the subject as a non committal grunt, if the subject reoccurs I would like to be better prepared. I'm sure I read them here but there are two that I'm looking for, one is regarding the children of exJW's and referring to them as “dross and scum”. The other is a bit older I think, it was about how the bible recommends honour killings and though I can't remember it verbatim it went along the lines of “thought we may feel this way, the law restricts us on acting”.

    My line of argument is “please don't send any more publications as I wouldn't want my children reading anything that might make them think their nana sees them as dross and scum”.

    If anyone has more quotes regarding how JW's should treat non believing grandchildren I would be very much obliged if you could pass them on.

    I have tried looking for that excellent “quotes” website but have been unable to find it, I know there was some legal wrangling regarding it some time ago, I hope it's not been forced down.

    Thanks in advance.

  • Elsewhere
    Elsewhere


    The WTS took legal action against the Quotes site and since he could not afford a defence in court he took it down.

    However these fine sites were able to preserve his work: www.watchtower.cc www.reexamine.org http://www.watchtowerinformationservice.org/index.php/watchtower_quotes/

  • Dr Jekyll
    Dr Jekyll

    I looked throught the WT 2005 cd but couldn't find any reference to Dross and Scum in relation to children

  • Honesty
    Honesty

    Is this what you are looking for?

    *** w05 4/15 p. 17 Let God’s Word Light Your Roadway ***

    Sustained by God’s Word

    11 If we never stray from his regulations, God will sustain us. (Psalm 119:113-120) We do not approve of “halfhearted ones,” even as Jesus disapproves of lukewarm professing Christians today. (Psalm 119:113; Revelation 3:16) Because we wholeheartedly serve Jehovah, he is ‘our place of concealment’ and will sustain us. He will ‘toss away all those straying from his regulations’ by resorting to trickiness and falsehood. (Psalm 119:114, 117, 118; Proverbs 3:32) He views such wicked ones as “scummy dross”—impurities removed from such valuable metals as silver and gold. (Psalm 119:119; Proverbs 17:3) May we always display love for God’s reminders, for we surely do not want to join the wicked on the slag heap of destruction!

  • mtbatoon
    mtbatoon

    Elsewhere: Thanks for the links, sad to hear that they played the big bully boy game and forced him down, maybe they'll extend the rule to their flock and not allow quotes of their publications in any way verbally, electronically or chemically.

    Dr Jekyll: thanks for looking.

    Honesty: That looks like the one, now how do I work it so a 10 and 14 year old would read that as “nana don't like you s'much as them god fearing cusins o' yours”?

  • rebel8
    rebel8

    There are some pretty bizarre quotes in the Youth book, available at reexamine. Also, the first 2 printable brochures on this page may be of assistance: http://jwinfo.8m.com/activism.htm

  • mtbatoon
    mtbatoon

    Finally got the nugget I was after:

    “Being limited by the laws of the worldly nation in which we live and also by the laws of God through Jesus Christ, we can take action against apostates only to a certain extent, that is, consistent with both sets of laws. The law of the land and God's law through Christ forbid us to kill apostates, even though they be members of our own flesh-and-blood family relationship. However, God's law requires us to recognize their being disfellowshiped from his congregation, and this despite the fact that the law of the land in which we live requires us under some natural obligation to live with and have dealings with such apostates under the same roof.”

    It was quite dated, Nov 15, 1952 Watchtower pp.703-704 Questions from Readers.

    Good job that they took the trouble to remind people of the “don't kill the unbeliever” law. After all that's going to be the first thing someone's going to consider isn't it.

    I'm thinking now there might have been another quote directly relating to grandchildren.

    Now I'm not suggesting that it's a conspiracy or divine intervention but has anyone else noticed the amount of JW related sites where the search feature doesn't work? I'm just saying.

    Rebel8: though the Youth Book has been firmly banished to my subconscious I'll have to have a trawl through when I have and a therapist on speed dial.

  • Leolaia
    Leolaia

    I think this is the passage you are referring to. Children of apostates are definitely included:

    *** kj chap. 14 p. 264 par. 1 Hypocritical Religionists Stunned at the News ***

    With stunning impact will the news of Christendom’s destruction strike hypocritical religionists who are related to her. They will feel it when the foretold "great tribulation" begins upon her. Yet they may hope that because of her former ability to endure she will survive the tribulation, contrary to Bible prophecy.... Sometime earlier Jehovah had given a scathing denunciation of Jerusalem, addressing her as a "city that is shedding blood in her midst till her time comes," and detailing the reasons why she has shed so much blood. (Ezekiel 22:3-12) The moral scum and filth within her could not be washed out but clung to her sides, causing a rust to the sides of her as a symbolic cooking pot. She had a low regard for human blood, the blood of her victims, not even pouring it out on the ground and covering it over with dust, as God’s law commanded to be done in the case of the blood of a hunted animal. (Leviticus 17:13, 14) No, but, shamelessly, Jerusalem poured out the violently shed blood upon the shining, bare surface of a crag for it to be openly exposed as a testimony to her criminality. This contempt for human blood stirred up Jehovah’s rage, inducing him to execute vengeance upon the wanton shedder of blood....

    Jehovah saw what the gory, scummy city deserved. It must be enveloped in a big blaze as from a great pile of logs. Due to the long-continued cooking at the boiling point her military commanders and officers must get unbearably hot with the increasing intensity of the Babylonian siege, and the other inhabitants, like overcooked flesh, must be reduced to a state like broth with no texture or stability. Out with all of them! Empty out the city completely when it falls to the Babylonian besiegers! Put it like an emptied cooking pot of copper upon the fire of destruction, because of the scum-covered rust that still clings to its sides. Since the filthy rust cannot be washed off, burn it off! Yes, melt down the whole symbolic cooking pot (Jerusalem), to separate the dross from it. Let the fire of the destruction of the bloodguilty city also completely destroy her moral filth, scum and rust. And that goes for her modern-day counterpart, Christendom, too!... Her uncleanness was like the scum and filth that created rust on the sides of a copper pot and that could not be scoured away but that had to be destroyed by melting down the cooking pot itself.

    "O, have a heart!" a person might be inclined to say to God at this point. Why? Because Jerusalem then contained the magnificent temple that had been built by King Solomon, and so the wrecking of Jerusalem meant the wrecking of the sacred temple that the Jews regarded as a charm against disaster. (Jeremiah 7:1-11) And another thing: The older Jews who had been carried off into exile in Babylon had left behind sons and daughters in Jerusalem and Judah, and, if Jerusalem were destroyed, it would mean death for those sons and daughters. Were not these things precious to these Jews who were involved? Would not the violent taking away of these things be a jarring shock to their sensibilities, stunning them? Would not a corresponding disaster today have the like effect upon those who are sympathetically involved with Christendom? That it would do so, the prophet Ezekiel was called upon to dramatize in a prophetic manner. How he did so he describes in these words:

    22 ...."And I proceeded to speak to the people in the morning, and my wife gradually died in the evening. So I did in the morning just as I had been commanded. And the people kept saying to me: ‘Will you not tell us what these things have to do with us, that you are doing?’ Then I said to them: ‘The very word of Jehovah has occurred to me, saying, "Say to the house of Israel: ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord Jehovah has said, "Here I am profaning my sanctuary, the pride of your strength, the thing desirable to your eyes and the object of your soul’s compassion, and your sons and your daughters whom you people have left behind -- by the sword they will fall. And you will have to do just as I have done. Mustaches you will not cover over, and the bread of men you will not eat. And your headdress will be on your heads, and your sandals be upon your feet. You will not beat yourselves nor will you weep, and you will have to rot away in your errors, and you will actually groan over one another. And Ezekiel has become for you a portent. In accord with all that he has done, you will do. When it comes, you will also have to know that I am the Sovereign Lord Jehovah." ’ " ’ " -- Ezekiel 24:18-24.

    23 Years later, in 33 C.E. Jesus Christ foretold and contemplated the destruction that was to come upon the then Jerusalem in the year 70 C.E. with all its horrors. He "wept over it." In tears he said: "If you, even you, had discerned in this day the things having to do with peace—but now they have been hid from your eyes. Because the days will come upon you when your enemies will build around you a fortification with pointed stakes and will encircle you and distress you from every side, and they will dash you and your children within you to the ground, and they will not leave a stone upon a stone in you, because you did not discern the time of your being inspected." (Luke 19:41-44; 21:20-24) But Jesus Christ as an unmarried man was not called upon to enact a prophetic scene as Ezekiel was commanded to do.

    24 Obediently, Ezekiel did not mourn over the death of his wife, "the thing desirable to your eyes." (Ezekiel 24:16) In the year 607 B.C.E. the prophet Jeremiah did mourn and lament over the destruction of Jerusalem and her temple. (Lamentations 1:1 to 5:22) When that calamity actually occurred, Ezekiel himself was not commanded to refrain from doing as Jeremiah did. When the news of the destruction of Jerusalem and her temple reached Ezekiel in Babylon it did not stun and benumb him.

    25 It did not require the destruction of Jerusalem, her precious temple and her sons and daughters for Ezekiel to know, as God said, "that I am the Sovereign Lord Jehovah." But as for the people of Israel, who did not know the identity of their God, either in Judah or in Babylon, they did have to be made to know that fact by a stunning blow delivered in the form of the destruction of holy city, temple, children. ....In the approaching "great tribulation" upon Christendom Jehovah’s true sanctuary is not what he will profane. "The God that made the world and all the things in it, being, as this One is, Lord of heaven and earth, does not dwell in handmade temples [or, sanctuaries]." (Acts 17:24, NW; AS, margin) Jehovah will not profane the antitypical spiritual "temple" in which his High Priest, Jesus Christ, presented to Him the merit of a perfect, human sacrifice in the year 33 C.E., this one appearing in the heavens before the very person of God to do so. (Hebrews 9:24-26) Nor will he profane the temple or sanctuary that He is now building and which is made up of "living stones"; this is his congregation of faithful anointed followers of his Son Jesus Christ, the chief "living stone." (1 Peter 2:4-6) The apostle Paul when writing to those of this sanctuary class says: "For we are a temple of a living God; just as God said: ‘I shall reside among them and walk among them, and I shall be their God, and they will be my people.’" (2 Corinthians 6:16) "In union with him you, too, are being built up together into a place for God to inhabit by spirit." (Ephesians 2:22) The anointed remnant of this sanctuary class make up the modern-day Ezekiel class used by Jehovah....More and more they appreciate what this annihilation of Christendom will mean in the way of destruction of human lives and material properties considered sacred by religionists. But this Ezekiel class of Christians does not mourn and lament because of what all this "great tribulation" upon Christendom will mean. They know that it will never mean the destruction of Jehovah’s true sanctuary, the spiritual temple in which Jesus Christ presented the merit of his ransom sacrifice back in 33 C.E. Nor will it mean the destruction of the temple of "living stones" that Jehovah is now building. So the actual occurrence of this predicted disaster to Christendom will not stun them. They do not need this to occur for them to "know that I am the Sovereign Lord Jehovah." The hypocritical religionists who ignore Jehovah and trust in things sacred to them are the ones destined to be stunned. They will have to know who Jehovah is.

  • KW13
    KW13

    look at that, how could 'Gods organization' or anyone condemn kids like that. bunch of low lifes.

  • mtbatoon
    mtbatoon

    Thanks Leolaia. That'll be a big help

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