sheep and goats

gspradling

I am having a discussion with my jw mom on the Watchtower take on Matt 25:32. I know this has been discussed many times on here before, but I was wondering if someone had the Watchtower quotes on this topic. I was thinking the Watchtower already had decided who the goats were. Thank you in advance.

lisavegas420

I don't know the answer to your question, but the subject lined reminded me of when I was a child, my dad would say..."we going out to seperate the Sheep from the Goats"

It never was as much fun as it sounded...probable 'cause...I was thinking furry animals.

lisa

garybuss

They decided who the goats were, then they changed their minds, now they think they know again. First they said a goat was anybody who didn't accept the message (publications). Then they said the goats are not going to be identified until AFTER the great tribulation, and now they say anyone who doesn't respect Jesus' brothers, who are mostly sisters, are goats.

The terms now are goat-like and sheep-like and are in quotes. Interestingly they have not separated the co-mingling of the sheep and the great crowd. The "sheep" are not identified but the great crowd is identified and they are the same.

The component definition of "great crowd" changes every time one of them dies, or quits the group, and every time a new member joins.

The old required sheep belief was changed to a new required belief in 1995. Below is the article.

*** w95 10/15 pp. 22-23 pars. 21-27 How Will You Stand Before the Judgment Seat? ***

21 How, though, will people in those nations fare when the Son of man arrives in his glory? Let us find out from the parable of the sheep and the goats, which begins with the words: "When the Son of man arrives in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit down on his glorious throne. And all the nations will be gathered before him." Matthew 25:31,32.

22 Does this parable apply when Jesus sat down in kingly power in 1914, as we have long understood? Well, Matthew 25:34 does speak of him as King, so the parable logically finds application since Jesus became King in 1914. But what judging did he do soon thereafter? It was not a judging of "all the nations." Rather, he turned his attention to those claiming to make up "the house of God." (1Peter 4:17) In line with Malachi 3:1-3, Jesus, as Jehovah's messenger, judicially inspected the anointed Christians remaining on earth. It was also time for judicial sentence on Christendom, who falsely claimed to be "the house of God." (Revelation 17:1,2; 18:4-8) Yet nothing indicates that at that time, or for that matter since, Jesus sat to judge people of all the nations finally as sheep or goats.

23 If we analyze Jesus' activity in the parable, we observe him finally judging all the nations. The parable does not show that such judging would continue over an extended period of many years, as if every person dying during these past decades were judged worthy of everlasting death or everlasting life. It seems that the majority who have died in recent decades have gone to mankind's common grave. (Revelation 6:8; 20:13) The parable, though, depicts the time when Jesus judges the people of "all the nations" who are then alive and facing the execution of his judicial sentence.

24 In other words, the parable points to the future when the Son of man will come in his glory. He will sit down to judge people then living. His judgment will be based on what they have manifested themselves to be. At that time "the distinction between a righteous one and a wicked one" will have been clearly established. (Malachi 3:18) The actual pronouncing and executing of judgment will be carried out in a limited time. Jesus will render just decisions based on what has become evident about individuals.See also 2Corinthians 5:10.

25 This means, then, that Jesus' 'sitting down on his glorious throne' for judgment, mentioned at Matthew 25:31, applies to the future point when this powerful King will sit down to pronounce and execute judgment on the nations. Yes, the judgment scene that involves Jesus at Matthew 25:31-33,46 is comparable to the scene in Daniel chapter 7, where the reigning King, the Ancient of Days, sat down to carry out his role as Judge.

26 Understanding the parable of the sheep and the goats in this way indicates that the rendering of judgment on the sheep and the goats is future. It will take place after "the tribulation" mentioned at Matthew 24:29,30 breaks out and the Son of man 'arrives in his glory.' (Compare Mark 13:24-26.) Then, with the entire wicked system at its end, Jesus will hold court and render and execute judgment.John 5:30; 2Thessalonians 1:7-10.

27 This clarifies our understanding of the timing of Jesus' parable, which shows when the sheep and the goats will be judged. But how does it affect us who are zealously preaching the Kingdom good news? (Matthew 24:14) Does it make our work less significant, or does it bring a greater weight of responsibility? Let us see in the next article how we are affected.

gspradling

Thank you Garybuss, for your time and information.

A Paduan

It's simple.

A sheep is someone who drags their family to meetings for learning about newer light, because the old light has become incorrect thinking (lies), then they march them around on Saturday mornings finding other sheep who are willing to cotton on to that way of thinking.

A goat is someone who would think that those people must be some kind of goat to do that.

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Or in simpler terms, a goat is Them and a sheep is Us, and this seems to work well for many concerned: ie. 'the goat is Them' appears to serve one well in confidence building, whether or not one is in or out of group.

BizzyBee

Through all the flip-flopping there is only ever one constant: The WTS is the only entity that always has it right - even when they're wrong. Always.

Star Moore

Hey there:

In DC of 2004 and we had a brochere..called Keep on the Watch. In it was stated that the 'Hour of Judgement had Arrived'. I had to figure that, that meant that we had entered into the time of judgement where the sheeps and the goats were separated.

But alas, they recently changed their minds on that in 2005 WT.

What flip-floppers!!!!!!!!!

Tigerman

" . . . Let us see in the next article how we are affected." Yep, stay tuned folks.

DavidChristopher

what my definition of "sheep" and "goats" is? Or God's?

I can give you mine...but really can't comment on His...

Perhaps you need to ask someone who claims to be speaking for Him, perhaps He gave them His definitions of those words to define for you...rather than allow you access to His truth/opinion personally.

Mine is tame easy led, trusting animals...and rebelious, horned, stubborn, eat anything, four legged lawnmowers.

is that what He meant by "sheep" and "goats" as well?

plmkrzy

There is a street in my old neighborhood jws called "goat hill" that nobody wanted to be assigned.

not goat hill!...bummer

sheep and goats

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