heaven/earth

by GramblingMan 8 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  GramblingMan

  Ok someone help me out here, from reading 1corinthians 15:35-58. it appears that Paul's letter is to the whole church. I draw the conclusion from this that the resurrected body is for everyone. Well the JW that came by says that all of the church of Corinthia was annointed so that's why they have a heavenly hope. This doesn't seem right, am I reading the letter to the corinthians wrong?

  Also he ask me what happens to the earth if we all go to heaven, I didn't have an answer for that question.

  Can some explain Isaiah 65?

  Thanks
• 

  agapa37

  Gamblingman

  One cannot assume correct understanding of the Bible by drawing conclusions from just a verse. Rules for understanding the Bible are, first Pray to Jehovah for His Spirit to guide you, next, read in content, then read in context. An example would be John 10:30 which reads: "I and the Father are one." Jesus made that statement. If you were to read that scripture and draw a conclusion from it, one would come up with the incorrect understanding of that verse. One might conclude Jesus words as a claim to be God, but when you look at that scripture in CONTENT you would see otherwise. Furthermore, if you look at it in CONTEXT, you would find more clarification on what Jesus meant by that statement. (This is not intented for a trinity debate, but soley as a good example on Content and Context)
• 

  acadian

  Welcome to the board GM.

  I draw the conclusion from this that the resurrected body is for everyone.

  It is, I havn't found anywhere yet that the anointed are only the the 144,000 and remember Rev. was given in signs and symbols. Ask yourself, who incorporate the body of christ? Scripture teaches all who follow Christ, not just a select few.

  Also he ask me what happens to the earth if we all go to heaven, I didn't have an answer for that question.

  Where is Heaven? Don't look up, because it's not there.

  Here's an article that might shed some light for you... " Heaven: a Future Hope or a Present Reality?" By Richard Anthony

  Kind regards
  Acadian
• 

  VanillaMocha73

  WT stands by the belief that the New Testament only applies to the 144,000 anointed. I cannot find the quote, but I know it was in one of the study pubs, that if you look in the front of the Greek scripture letter and it applies to "holy ones" then it is not written to the rank and file.
• 

  Leolaia

  You have not misread 1 Corinthians. There is no such distinction in the Bible between "anointed" and "non-anointed" as two classes of Christians with two different hopes. The admission that "all of the church of Corinth was anointed so that's why they have a heavenly hope" would be a warning sign that the something is not right with the Watchtower teaching. If everyone was anointed, where were all those of the "great crowd" who had an earthly hope? Why instead does one read about there being "one" hope that all Christians have (Ephesians 4:4), to be seated with God "in the heavenly realms in Christ Jesus (Ephesians 2:6)? Why does Paul instead make a blanket statement that "our citizenship is in heaven" (Philippians 3:20)? Why does the author of Hebrews refer to general to Christians as "sharing in the heavenly calling" (3:1), to the church as "the heavenly Jerusalem, the city of the living God" (12:22-23), and even describe Abraham and the patriarchs as having a heavenly hope and God as preparing a "city", i.e. heavenly Jerusalem, for them (11:15-16)? Why is there no trace of an "earthly paradise" or great crowd in these letters? And here is the big question: Why is it that anyone could have a heavenly hope in the first century (as your elders admitted by saying that "all the church of Corinth was anointed"), but strongly discouraged today by the Society with the "earthly hope" today promulgated in its place? Where does it say in the Bible that this heavenly hope ended circa 1935?
• 

  greendawn

  The earthly paradise and people living eternally confined in it is part of the JW mythology and has no biblical backing. Even the pre christian saints were looking forward to a heavenly home. They must be promoting this idea for a reason but I don't know what it is. Is an earthly paradise more alluring than a heavenly one? Or are they doing it to keep subjected most of the dubs who are of the so called earthly and far lower class? They have to obey slavishly the FDS who is of the heavenly class and far superior in status.
• 

  Leolaia

  They must be promoting this idea for a reason but I don't know what it is. Is an earthly paradise more alluring than a heavenly one?

  greendawn..... I would say so. It is the idea of utopia mingled with the dream of eternal youth. The pictures depicting "paradise earth" in the publications always emphasize the beauty and pleasures of the "earthly hope". Lots of delicious food to eat, lots of wild and exotic animals to play with, great weather every day, etc. etc. That is the sort of existence anybody can desire. Heaven however is something that "no eye has beheld" and is less alluring (i.e. sells less Watchtowers) than the religious hope of communion with Christ Jesus in heaven. The Society also has cariacatured the heavenly hope and even presented it as a perversion of God's actual plan. Check out this quote:

  *** w52 3/15 p. 164 Are You Choosing Life or Death? ***

  It is the life for man that Jehovah God originally purposed. And what is that? Bliss in heaven sprawled on a billowy cloud, twanging a harp as you float along in space and eternity? No, it is not that vain and useless existence that lazy men have conjured up as heavenly life.... As the human family increased and Eden became too small the growing population would spread beyond the garden’s bounds, taking with them the seeds of the perfect plants in Eden, planting these seeds in new territories, tilling these new areas just as the family did in Eden. Thus as humanity increased and overspread the earth they would subdue the earth by transforming it into a paradise, until Eden’s conditions had spread and the garden of God became global.... That, then, was the life Jehovah purposed for man on the earth. And if obedient, man was never to die. Earth was not merely a proving ground to be used as a springboard to heavenly existence for man. It was Satan the Devil, through the serpent, that held out a hope of promotion and exaltation, and the obtaining of godlikeness and immunity from death.

  Interestingly, the Society republished this article in the 1 June 1981 Watchtower (pp. 6-7), but the last part insinuating that the heavenly hope is a satanic plot has been edited out.
• 

  pixel

  Q: >

  A: Rutherford 12:25.

  How do you read? He (Ruther) was represented by John The Revelator, (Remember?) and then one of the 24 elders, it may be Russell, told him that.

  Never mind. This is sooo confusing.

  Pix.
• 

  pixel

  Q: Where does it say in the Bible that this heavenly hope ended circa 1935?

  A: Rutherford 12:25.

  How do you read? He (Ruther) was represented by John The Revelator, (Remember?) and then one of the 24 elders, it may be Russell, told him that.

  Never mind. This is sooo confusing.

  Pix.

  Sorry, don't know how to EDIT