[We are;] for we are not peddlers of the word of God as many men are, but as out of sincerity, yes, as sent from God, under God’s view, in company with Christ, we are speaking. –2 Corinthians 2:17, New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures.
Here’s what was translated as “peddlers”: kapeleuo from kapelos (a huckster); to retail, that is, (by implication) to adulterate (figuratively): - corrupt.
Lets look at another angle:
(KJV)For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God: but as of sincerity, but as of God, in the sight of God speak we in Christ.
(ALT) adulterating; (ASV) corrupting; (Bishops) chop and change; (DRB) adulterating; (EMTV) corrupting; (GW) selling an impure word of God; (Murdock) dilute the word of God; (RV) corrupting the word of God; (Webster) corrupt; (WNT) fraudulent hucksters of God’s Message; (YLT) adulterating the word of God.
As we see, the real thought of Paul here was not merely peddling. He was inferring that the word of God was already corrupted and changed, which could very well include having crucial verses or parts of verses omitted.
It did not take long for this to occur. They not only plagued the early congregations, but are still with us today, in modern form, in many contemporary Christian cults. These false doctrines influenced the transmission of scripture and account for some of the differences in the line of manuscripts.
SATAN THE MASTER OF DECEPTION
If Satan was going to corrupt God’s Word, it stands to reason that he would have a very clever, ingenious, deceptive plan. What better way than to have Gnostic Bibles written as early as the first century, have them hidden in caves or monasteries for hundreds and hundreds of years, only to be “discovered” at a much later time, as being the oldest copies of the ancient manuscripts ever found? We will find out that is exactly what happened.
“We need to understand that many of the new translations are taken from old manuscripts. People think that these are more reliable. In actual fact they are saying that a manuscript found in a waste paper basket in a cave in Mt. Sinai and questionable manuscripts from Alexandria in Egypt, are more reliable than the Received Text.” –Les Garrett, 1982. “Which Bible can we trust?” Christian Centre Press p. 15.
“Origen, being a textual critic, is supposed to have corrected numerous portions of the sacred manuscripts. Evidence to the contrary shows he changed them to agree with his own human philosophy of mystical and allegorical ideas. Thus, through deceptive scholarship of this kind, certain manuscripts became corrupt.” –p. 16.
Origen was praised by Masonics as an insider initiate. He believed man was divine.
From the birth of Christ to 400 AD, Gnostic gospels and other writings were written. This is what Paul was referring to at 2 Corinthians 2:17.
In 331 AD, Constantine ordered that an ‘ecumenical Bible’ be written. Eusebius, a follower of Origen, was assigned to direct this task. This Gnostic Bible was written to be acceptable to Pagans and Christians, but the Christians rejected them. They went into secret libraries and stayed there for centuries, later to be dug up as ancient manuscripts. There were about 50 copies made up by Eusebius, and they were distributed and ended up in Rome and Alexandria where the esoteric studies were concentrated.
In 1481 AD, The Vatican manuscript was discovered in the Vatican Library. It is thought by some to be one of the surviving manuscripts done by Eusebius at the command of Constantine. The date of its writing coincides with the ‘ecumenical Bible’ of Constantine (just in time to counter the Reformation). Now we must believe that God kept the truth from all generations up until 1481, when the Vatican discovered the right manuscript!
In 1844 AD, the Sinaitic manuscript was discovered at Mt. Sinai in the monastery of St. Catherine, and it agrees closely with the Vatican manuscripts. These two manuscripts were probably two of the fifty that were written for Constantine.
1881 AD The Westcott and Hort Greek Text was introduced. This text departed from the Textus Recepticus and follows the Vatican and Sinaitic corruptions. The NWT based on Vatican and Sinai manuscripts, leaning heavily on the Sinai so as not to appear overly Catholic. This was in the early 1900’s and as late as 1940, Jehovah’s Witnesses were using the King James Version. According to Walter Veith, whose video, “Battle of the Bibles” can be viewed via search engine, they were told to take a pen and modify the King James, crossing out many verses, even entire chapters.
“It must be emphasized that the argument is not between an ancient text and a recent one, but between two ancient forms of the text, one of which was rejected and the other adopted and preserved by the Church as a whole and remaining in common use for more than fifteen centuries. –Les Garret 1982. “Which Bible can we trust?” Christian Centre Press p. 46
“Tyndale used the Received Text in his Bible and said to the Pope, “If God spare my life, before many years I will cause a boy that driveth a plough to know more of the Scriptures than Thou doest.” -God Wrote Only One Bible”, by Jasper James Ray
The argument is not a KJV versus other versions, it is the Received Text versus other manuscripts.
The Jesuits were called to help and they said, “We must undermine the Bible of the Protestants and destroy their teachings,”…The Queen of England realizing the damage the Jesuit Bible would do, sent to Europe for Beza, who was with John Calvin, to help….Thomas Cartwright…With one hand he took hold of all the Greek manuscripts and with the other hand he took hold of all the Latin manuscripts form the Received Text, and he hit the Jesuit Bible blow after blow….Finally the Spanish Armada came against England with 136 armed ships, some with 50 cannons…England could only gather thirty ships and these were lead by Sir Francis Drake. Freak storms came down the English channel and the Spanish ships were found wrecked right up to the Scottish coast and England became a great sea power. - Les Garrett p. 60
Jesuit view of the Bible:
Then the Bible, that serpent which with head erect and eyes flashing threatens us with its venom while it trails along the ground, shall be changed into a rod as soon as we are able to seize it….for three centuries past this cruel asp has left us no repose. You well know with what folds it entwines us and with what fangs it gnaws us.” -The Jesuits in History, Hector Macpherson, (Springfield MO: Ozark Book Publishers, 1997;originally published in 1900) Appendix I.
Jesuit Catechism:
Q. What if the Holy Scriptures command one thing, the the Pope another contrary to it?
A. The Holy Scriptures must be thrown aside.
Q. What is the Pope?
A. He is the Vicar of Christ, the King of Kings, and Lord of Lords, and there is but one Judgment-Seat belonging to God and the Pope.
(Roy Livesey, 1998, Understanding the New Age: World Government and World Religion -Chichester, England: New Wine Press, p. 104.
Freemasonry:
Regarding the Bible Pike writes:”…the absurd reading of the established Church, taking literally the figurative, allegorical, and mythical language of a collection of Oriental books of different ages…the folly of regarding the Hebrew books as if they had been written by the unimaginative, hard, practical intellect of the England of James the First and the bigoted stolidity of Scottish Presbyterianism.”
Knights Templars:
“The better to succeed and win partisans, the Templars sympathized with regrets for dethroned creeds (Pagan Religions) and encouraged the hopes of new worships, promising to all liberty of conscience and a new orthodoxy that should be the synthesis of all the persecuted creeds.: -Morals and Dogma, p. 818
Westcott & Hort:
Going back to the time of the early church we find the Coptic Versions, the Latin Versions and Syrian Versions. These Bibles were in circulation before the Vaticanus was written. It is hard to see how God would allow the true text to be hidden in the Vatican library and in a waste paper basket in a cave for one thousand five hundred years and to be brought to the light of day by two Cambridge Professors [Westcott & Hort] who did not even believe in the verbal inspiration of the Scriptures. –“Which Bible” and “True and False”, edited by David Otis Fuller.
Corrupt Manuscripts:
How could Helvidius have accused Jerome of employing corrupt Greek manuscripts, if Helvidius had not had the pure Greek manuscripts? –Les Garrett p.61
These revised versions are based on manuscripts from Egypt that were definitely corrupted. Both Augustine and Tertullion testified that the scribes in Africa corrupted and changed the manuscripts. –Christian Handbook of Manuscripts, by Peter S Ruckman, President of the Pensacola Bible Press.
The Watchtower & Egypt:
In the book “All Scripture”, Study Number 6, “The Christian Greek Text of the Holy Scriptures”, page 317, we read:
13 Great quantities of papyrus writings have been located in the province of Faiyum, in Egypt. In the late 19th century, a number of Biblical papyri were brought to light. One of the most important of all modern-day manuscript finds was a discovery made public in 1931. It consisted of parts of 11 codices, containing portions of 8 different books of the inspired Hebrew Scriptures and 15 books of the Christian Greek Scriptures, all in Greek. These papyri range in date of writing from the second century to the fourth century of the Common Era. Much of the Christian Greek Scripture portions of this find are now in the Chester Beatty Collections and are listed as P45, P46, and P47, the symbol “P” standing for “Papyrus.”
Lest we be reminded that the Apostle Paul said:
For we are not as many, which corrupt the word of God.
Hatred for Christ and the Sacred Scriptures widespread:
“No sooner,” writes Dean Burgon, “was the work of Evangelists and Apostles recognized as the necessary counterpart and complement of God’s ancient Scriptures and became the New Testament, than a reception was found to be awaiting it in the world closely resembling that which He experienced Who is the subject of its pages. Calumny and misrepresentation, persecution and murderous hate, assailed Him continually.”
“And the written Word in like manner, in the earliest age of all, was shamefully handled by mankind. Not only was it confused through human infirmity and misapprehension, but it became also the object of restless malice and unsparing assaults.” -Dean Burgon, Traditional Text p.10
The Bible was already corrupted and as we’ve seen from the book of Acts, Simon Magus already had most of the world following him as god himself, claiming to be a Christian. He was already at work poisoning the Bible with Gnostic ideas. Older is not necessarily better, and the question is, did it agree with the a. Majority Received Text, or the b. Vatican Vulgate Revised Version? As we have seen that Egypt and Rome were the main centers for occult worship, is it any surprise that they fell into category b? Are we to believe that Jehovah God waited until 1931 to release the true Bible that agrees with the codex Vaticanus? And amazingly, in the same year that the Watchtower adopted the name “Jehovah’s Witnesses”?
Now that we’ve seen that older is not necessarily better, backtracking to paragraph 11 of “Insight”, we read:
11 A Reservoir of Over 13,000 Manuscripts. A tremendous fund of manuscript copies of all 27 canonical books is available today. Some of these cover extensive portions of Scripture; others are mere fragments. According to one calculation, there are over 5,000 manuscripts in the original Greek. In addition, there are over 8,000 manuscripts in various other languages—a total exceeding 13,000 manuscripts all together. Dating from the 2nd century C.E. to the 16th century C.E., they all help in determining the true, original text. The oldest of these many manuscripts is the papyrus fragment of the Gospel of John in the John Rylands Library in Manchester, England, known by the number P52, which is dated to the first half of the second century, possibly about 125 C.E. Thus, this copy was written only a quarter of a century or so after the original. When we consider that for ascertaining the text of most classical authors, only a handful of manuscripts are available, and these are seldom within centuries of the original writings, we can appreciate what a wealth of evidence there is to assist in arriving at an authoritative text of the Christian Greek Scriptures.
Wouldn’t it stand to reason that the most reliable texts would be kept in places in and around Jerusalem, or at least in the Middle East, where the center of Christianity was? Wouldn’t it make sense to give them priority? Instead, we’re relying on texts found in Manchester England, and Egypt, the center of Alexandrian Occult worship? The Home of Horus?
The Watchtower puts its foot in it again in paragraph 15:
15 The discoveries of these papyri supply proof that the Bible canon was completed at a very early date. Among the Chester Beatty Papyri, two codices—one binding together parts of the four Gospels and Acts (P45) and another bringing within its covers 9 of the 14 letters of Paul (P46)—show that the inspired Christian Greek Scriptures were assembled shortly after the death of the apostles. Since it would have taken time for these codices to circulate widely and find their way down into Egypt, it is apparent that these Scriptures had been collected into their standard form by the second century, at the latest. Thus, by the end of the second century, there was no question but that the canon of the Christian Greek Scriptures was closed, completing the canon of the entire Bible.
How the way was opened for textual criticism, "Insight" continues:
18 Erasmus’ refined Greek text became the basis for better translations into several of the Western European languages. This made possible the production of versions superior to those that had been translated previously from the Latin Vulgate. First to use Erasmus’ text was Martin Luther of Germany, who completed his translation of the Christian Greek Scriptures into German in 1522. In the face of much persecution, William Tyndale of England followed with his English translation from Erasmus’ text, completing this while in exile on the continent of Europe in 1525. Antonio Brucioli of Italy translated Erasmus’ text into Italian in 1530. With the advent of Erasmus’ Greek text, there was now opening up an era of textual criticism. Textual criticism is the method used for reconstruction and restoration of the original Bible text.
Textual Criticism leads to the Modern Revised Version:
In connection with Westcott and Hort’s theory Dean Burgon writes: “We oppose facts to their speculation. They exalt B and Aleph and D because in their own opinions those copies are best. They weave ingenious webs and invent subtle theories, because their paradox of a few against the many requires ingenuity and subtlety for its support. Dr. Hort reveled in finespun theories and technical terms, such as “Intrinsic Probability”, “Transcriptional Probability”, “Internal Evidence of Readings”, “Internal evidence of Documents”, which of course connote a certain amount of evidence, but are weak pillars of a heavy structure…Even conjectural emendation and inconsistent decrees are not rejected. They are infected with the theorizing which spoils some of the best German work, and with the idealism which is the bane of many academic minds especially at Oxford and Cambridge.
“In contrast with this sojourn in cloudland, we are essentially of the earth though not earthy. We are nothing if we are not grounded in facts: Our appeal is to facts, our test lies in facts, so far as we can we build testimonies and pile facts on facts. We imitate the procedure of the courts of justice in decisions resulting from the converging product of all evidence, when it has been cross-examined and sifted.”
“In the balances of these seven tests of truth and speculations of the Westcott and Hort school, which have bewitched millions are “Tekel”, weighed in the balances and found wanting. “I am utterly disinclined to believe”, continues Burgon, “so grossly improbable does it seem- that at the end of 1800 years 995 copies out of every thousand, suppose, will prove untrustworthy; and that the one, two, three, four or five which remain, whose contents were till yesterday as good as unknown, will be found to have retained the secret of what the Holy Spirit originally inspired.”
“What, in the meantime, is to be thought of those blind guides – those deluded ones – who would now, if they could, persuade us to go back to those same codices of which the Church hath already purged herself?” –The Revision Revised p 334-335.
Burgon utterly rejected the claims of Tischendorf (1815-74), Tregelles (1813-75), Westcott (1825-1901), Hort (1828-92), and other contemporary scholars, who insisted that as a result of their labours the true NewTestament text had at last been discovered after having been lost for well-nigh fifteen centuries.
“Who but those with Roman Catholic sympathies could ever be pleased with the notion that God preserved the true New Testament text in secret for almost one thousand years and then finally handed it over to the Roman Pontiff for safekeeping?” -Les Garrett p 91,92.
Dr. Hoskier quotes the following from Dr. Salmon in his book “Some Thoughts on the Textual Criticism of the New Testament”- “Naturally Hort regarded those manuscripts as most trustworthy which give the readings recognized by Origen, and these no doubt were the readings which in the third century were most preferred at Alexandria. Thus Hort’s method inevitably led to the exclusive adoption of the Alexandrian text.”
“You will always be my friend but I can no longer ignore the criticisms. I cannot refute them, and dear brother I have not a thing against you, but the only thing I can do under God is to renounce every attachment to the New American Standard Bible.”
-Dr. Frank Logsdon to F. Lockman -quoted in Les Garrett p. 236.
The Bible- Index of prohibited books-Pope Paul IV 1599
The early church at Antioch used the Syrian Bible translated from the Hebrew and Greek and is older than the Masoretic text. The Waldenses had access to these writings and in 1453, when the Turks captured Constantinople, Greek scholars brought their manuscripts to the West. – Septuagint made for Alexandria library in 285 BC, Vulgate 383-405.
The Vulgate- Council of Trent (1545-1563) proposed the Vulgate Latin Bible as the only authentic translation. Pope Sixtus V declared the Vulgate infallible but Clement III in 1592 ordered a better edition and 2000 changes were made.
Now we can understand how Latin words like “Lucifer” got into the Hebrew text!
THE ASSAULT ON GOD’S WORD TAKES ANOTHER UPTURN IN THE 19TH CENTURY
1851 Dec 20th- Hort to John Ellerton: “I had no idea till the last few weeks of the importance of texts, having read so little Greek Testament, and dragged on with the villainous Textus Receptus leaning entirely on late MSS.; it is a blessing there are such early ones.” –Life, Vol. I, p. 211).
Apri. 19th- Hort to Rev. John Ellerton: “One result of our talk I may as well tell you. He (Westcott) and I are going to edit a Greek text of the New Testament some two or three years hence, if possible. Lachmann and Tischendorf will supply rich materials, but not nearly enough; and we hope to do a good deal with Oriental versions. Our object is to supply clergymen generally, schools, etc., with a portable Greek text which shall not be disfigured with Byzantine corruptions.” -Life, Vol. I., p. 250).
Sept. 29th- Westcott to Hort: “As to our proposed recension of the New Testament text, our object would be, I suppose, to prepare a text for common and general use…With such an end in view, would it not be best to introduce only certain emendations into the received text, and to note in the margin such as seem likely or noticeable- after Griesbach’s manner?…I feel most keenly the disgrace of circulating what I feel to be falsified copies of Holy Scripture (a reference to the A. V.?) and am most anxious to provide something to replace them. This cannot be any text resting solely on our own judgment, even if we were not too inexperienced to make one; but it must be supported by a clear and obvious preponderance of evidence. The margin will give ample scope for our own integrity or principles…my wish would be to leave the popular received text except where it is clearly wrong.” –Life, Vol.I, p. 228,229.
The statement which immediately follows Hort’s describing the sacred text as “Vile” is most revealing:
“Westcott, Gorham, C. B. Scott, Benson, Bradshaw, Laurd, etc. and I have started a society for the investigation of ghosts and all supernatural appearances, and effects, being all disposed to believe that such things really exist, and ought to be discriminated from hoaxes and mere subjective delusions; we shall be happy to obtain any good accounts well authenticated with names. Westcott is drawing up a schedule of questions. Cope calls us the ‘Cock and Bull Club;’ our own temporary name is the ‘Ghostly Guild’” (Ibid.,Vol 1, p. 211.)
“The evolution from traditional medium ship to contemporary channeling has been gradual. The original spiritualism had it’s start in 1848…Organizations like the Society for Psychical Research in Britain were formed…When Russian-born Helena Petrovna Blavatsky founded theosophy in 1875, the slow transition toward modern channeling began…her two chief works, Isis Unveiled, and the Secret Doctrine laid the foundation for the modern New Age belief system.” (Elliot Miller, 1989. Crash Course on the New Age, Baker Book House.)
Hort a member of a SECRET SOCIETY
Yet he found time to attend the meeting of various societies, and in June joined the mysterious company of the ‘Apostles.’ He remained always a grateful and loyal member of the secret Club, which has now [ca. 1896] become famous for the number of distinguished men who have belonged to it. In his time the Club was in a manner reinvigorated, and he was mainly responsible for the wording of the oath which binds the members to a conspiracy of silence…” -The Life and Letters of Fenton John Anthony Hort vol. 1 p.170-171.
Finally, let’s let the Watchtower have the last word, “Insight”, pages 318-319:
21 Refined Greek Texts. Later, Greek scholars produced increasingly refined texts. Outstanding was that produced by J. J. Griesbach, who had access to the hundreds of Greek manuscripts that had become available toward the end of the 18th century. The best edition of Griesbach’s entire Greek text was published 1796-1806. His master text was the basis for Sharpe’s English translation in 1840 and is the Greek text printed in The Emphatic Diaglott, first published complete in 1864. Other excellent texts were produced by Konstantin von Tischendorf (1872) and Hermann von Soden (1910), the latter serving as the basis for Moffatt’s English version of 1913.
22 Westcott and Hort Text. A Greek master text that has attained wide acceptance is that produced by the Cambridge University scholars B. F. Westcott and F. J. A. Hort, in 1881. Proofs of Westcott and Hort’s Greek text were consulted by the British Revision Committee, of which Westcott and Hort were members, for their revision of the “New Testament” of 1881. This master text is the one that was used principally in translating the Christian Greek Scriptures into English in the New World Translation. This text is also the foundation for the following translations into English: The Emphasised Bible, the American Standard Version, An American Translation (Smith-Goodspeed), and the Revised Standard Version. This last translation also used Nestle’s text.
23 Nestle’s Greek text (the 18th edition, 1948) was also used by the New World Bible Translation Committee for the purpose of comparison. The committee also referred to those by Catholic Jesuit scholars José M. Bover (1943) and Augustinus Merk (1948). The United Bible Societies text of 1975 and the Nestle-Aland text of 1979 were consulted to update the footnotes of the 1984 Reference Edition.
The Two Bibles
by ProdigalSon 9 Replies latest watchtower bible
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ProdigalSon
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Carl_Hernz
Hello, ProdigalSon. While your post seems quite detailed and I gather you adamantly believe in what you posted, I am not sure where you gathered your information from.
While Gnostic writings were circulating quite early in the church’s history, Gnostic gospels were not a main source of reading for the early Christians as literacy is a modern phenomenon. You also speak of “Gnostic Bibles written as early as the first century” and hidden away to be later discovered and hailed as accurate renditions of the texts we have today.
No copies of the New Testament were written at any time during the first century because the early church opposed adding any texts to the Hebrew Scriptures in the Greek Septuagint. The early church was primarily taught orally. It was not until the end of the first century and into the beginning of the second century did all the books we have in the New Testament , and still there was no move to lift them up to inspiration status. The most popular books for reading for Christians around this time were The Shepherd of Hermas and The Apocalypse of Peter, among those who could read.
In the second century, the Gnostic reformer Marcion arose and developed the first “canon” of Scripture. He rejected all of the Hebrew canon and used portions of the gospel of Luke and some of the epistles of Paul to support his views as proof texts to his teachings. While there were other gospels that today we consider “Gnostic,” none of these were chose by Marcion for his canon. This new form of Gnostic thought grew rapidly and threatened the early church.
The response was to officiate a canon in the face of Marcion claims (Marcion had the nerve to be “surprised” to be excommunicated for his actions), but it was not met with enthusiasm as oral tradition was view as superior by many. It is believed that the reason for Luke’s gospel being chosen despite his not being an apostle, and for Paul’s letters to make up the largest portion of the Christian canon was partially to show that Marcion’s teachings were false and could not be substantiated.
Some of the statements you make are correct, but others are very incorrect and out of line with historical accuracy.
Also, your post seems to be one of many that seem to be flooding in here with a “bone to pick” with somebody or some religious ideology. While I am not sure what is causing this, I think that some are writing out of reaction instead of response, so to speak. This is a forum for discussing Jehovah’s Witness related information. Many on here have left that judgmental religion behind and now have various beliefs and ideologies differing from one another. It is important that we not try to stay balanced in our comments as to show respect for the newly adopted beliefs of others who are trying to make their way after having had their lives shaken up by an unreasonable religious machine.
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Leolaia
I have to agree with Carl....this essay is long on (misplaced) polemic, short on substance, and filled with historical errors. The attempt to discredit the early codices as "gnostic" corruptions is particularly misguided (not to even mention the interpretation of 2 Corinthians 2:17), and the allusions to Masons and the Knights Templar stick out very conspicuously. Some questions:
What specifically in the variants of the early codices reflect a "gnostic" Tendenz? Please elaborate.
What of the corruptions of the Textus Receptus?
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James Free
Why should any writings of Paul be taken as 'inspired'? For all anyone knows, the corruption that Jesus warned about began as soon as he died. Paul was a Jew who saw a religious vacuum in a new religion, much like Rutherford did. He became a celebrity and peppered (to borrow a n analogy from Haszard LOL) his writings with personal opinion - he did not even hide this. He was quickly able to establish rules where there were none before and went far beyond what Jesus had to say. If disfellowshipping,homosexuality, and the role of womwn etc really mattered to Jesus, he had ample opportunity to discuss it when his words were being documented.
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JosephMalik
He became a celebrity and peppered (to borrow an analogy from Haszard LOL) his writings with personal opinion - he did not even hide this. He was quickly able to establish rules where there were none before and went far beyond what Jesus had to say. If disfellowshipping, homosexuality, and the role of women etc really mattered to Jesus, he had ample opportunity to discuss it when his words were being documented.
James Free.
So what? Jesus appointed him personally as His apostle (something He did not do for Matthias) as the other apostles and disciples were not doing their jobs regarding such matters. He received revelations from our Lord which easily qualified him to go far beyond what Jesus had to say and proved to them he had our Lord’s support by raising the dead and healing the sick. Are we to now disqualify John because his revelation went far beyond what Jesus taught? They needed this discipline just like they needed Hebrews and other information not discussed by our Lord. He rounded out our knowledge of the Kingdom and what it would accomplish. What amazes me is how many do not like him and distort what he actually taught. Are they still doing things he taught against?
Joseph
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JosephMalik
It is important that we not try to stay balanced in our comments as to show respect for the newly adopted beliefs of others who are trying to make their way after having had their lives shaken up by an unreasonable religious machine.
Say Carl,
I am sure you meant to say: It is important that we now try to stay balanced in our comments .... I do this all the time and sometimes miss them myself? Still time to correct?
Joseph
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zack
Maybe this is off point, but the NWT says : All scripture IS inspired.....
Many other translations say: All scripture THAT IS inspired is beneficial...etc...
It seems to me that Paul himself was telling Timothy to be wary of "Holy Writings."
My question, and not to hijack the thread, what is the correct rendering of what Paul said?
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JosephMalik
2Ti 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
2Pe 3:16 He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.
Zack
All scripture is inspired, but not every word found in scripture bears the same weight. Some are essential for salvation, while others for reproof, for correction, for instruction and such. The overall content and purpose is inspired but not each word. If this was not so then we could never show what the falsehood was. So Paul is now breaking it down for us. For example the letter that the Corinthians wrote to Paul was not inspired and while Paul used the information contained in it and corrects it, their words and thoughts derived from their letter should not have been taken as inspired. Peter supported Paul’s letters as part of the sacred text but all this still applies as Peter shows us that his texts were abused even then. Misuse of such texts existed then as it does today with those that still follow the Corinthians and their doctrinal views found in Paul’s letters. It is not a small matter but as Peter stated they do this to their own destruction. You may be aware that the WT still follows what the Corinthians taught. And today we must also compensate for error that has crept in by copyists, deterioration, deliberate tampering and translation as well. All this is manageable if we use care when we study it.
Joseph
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Carl_Hernz
Thanks, Joseph. I have tried countless times to correct it, but I just get an ERROR message.
But that is indeed what I meant to say. Please refer to Joseph's correction, everybody. Thanks.
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James Free
Jesus appointed him personally as His apostle
Jesus was dead and long gone when, ACCORDING TO SAUL, he was personally appointed as he walked along a quiet stretch of road on the way to Damascus. LOL. Anyway, I don't know why I am running with this really except that it reminds me of the GB, who claim they too are appointed by Jesus and others must take their word for it. Personally. I now doubt everything, even what I read in the Bible. There are not two Bibles, there are an infinite number of them in that whomever reads it seems to read something different to everyone else.