by Mickey mouse 7 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
...standing in a holy place.
I am sure this must have been discussed before but I can't find it in a search. So if the disgusting thing is the UN I think I can think of a time when it has stood in a place JW's consider "holy".
I never bought that the "holy place" was Christendom when it has supposedly been denounced by God already. Of course I don't think the WT is holy either now...
Well, one disgusting thing for sure is that they have usurped Christ with the FDS.
Tula beat me to it, my thought exactly!
There were many things but that was clear to me in the scriptures. When I learned that, I "BOUNCED". (slang for left)
The scripture directs us to use discernment. I do not thnk that the early Christians knew in advance what the disgusting thing would be. Rather they had to use discernment when they actually saw it happening. Likewise, I think we will know when we see it.
If one believes the claims of persons such as Alex Jones, it is possible that the disgusting thing could occur during the attempt to set up a one world government which will claim to be backed by God. Jones tells of holagraphic images that will be projected into the sky appearing as Jesus and other revered persons around the world. These images are supposed to give authority to this one world government. To me, such an incident would be a disgusting thing standing in a holy place.
I think the early Christians knew all too well that the Roman government was disgusting and a threat to them. It's when the jws try to create double fullfillments of prophecies that their reasoning or outright guessing becomes tortured thinking.
When you catch sight of the disgusting thing...standing where it
ought not...then know that the desolating of her has drawn
near...Get out of her my people if you do not want to share with
her in her sins, and if you do not want to receive part of her
plagues.
If you have a JW background you will notice that I have mixed four
scriptures here. Matt 24:15;Mark 13:14;Luke 21:20;Revelation 18:4
I mix these two prophecies because they both require EXTREME action
on the part of those who "discern" the identity of the foretold
signal. Jehovah's Witnesses have not yet come to a proper
understanding of these scriptures. Instead they have been side-
tracked by two false assumptions. They have believed that 1. Flight
is symbolic and 2. Babylon the Great is the world empire of false
religion.
First let's consider their problem with understanding the nature of
the "flight" and whether it is literal or merely symbolic.
FLIGHT - GEOGRAPHICAL OR SYMBOLIC
The May 1 1999 Watchtower came out with some "new light" on the
scripture at Matthew 24:15,16 Unfortunately this was a patchwork
change that created more questions than it answers.
First let's look at the text under discussion.
Matthew 24:15,16 "Therefore, when you catch sight of the disgusting
thing that causes desolation, as spoken of through Daniel the
prophet, standing in a holy place, (let the reader use discernment)
then let those in Judea begin fleeing to the mountains."
For years the Watchtower has said that this scripture has
application in our day and that it is necessary for individuals to
flee from false religion to the true religion. In other words they
used to claim that this is not a literal flight but a symbolic
flight. Now they are saying in paragraph 19 on page 18 of
Watchtower May 1, 1999 that "Jesus' disciples certainly need no
warning about fleeing from one religion to another; they had
already become true Christians."
I guess this straightens out what they said previously in the
Watchtower of June 1st 1996 "This flight to safety is NOT a
geographic move, such as Jewish Christians made when abandoning
Jerusalem. It is a flight to the place of safety within Jehovah's
theocratic organization."
Basically the same thing was repeated in Aug 15 1996 "Will You Be
Saved When God Acts"
P. 20 "We can rest assured, though, that God's chosen ones and
their associates will not be in the danger zone, at risk of being
killed. Oh, they WILL NOT HAVE FLED TO ONE GEOGRAPHIC LOCATION.
First-Century Christians in Jerusalem could flee from that city to
the mountainous region, such as Pella across the Jordan. In the
future, however, God's faithful Witnesses will be located all over
the globe, so safety and protection will not be based on geographic
location."
Now that they have the correct understanding that the flight isn't
a symbolic change in religion do they now conclude that the flight,
in reaction to seeing the "disgusting thing standing in a holy
place", is going to be a geographical flight? Amidst the "new
light" is the same muddled thinking.
Here is the latest take on the type of flight meant: Paragraph 22
page 19 Watchtower May 1, 1999 "We cannot presently have full
details about the great tribulation, but we can LOGICALLY CONCLUDE
THAT FOR US THE FLIGHT JESUS SPOKE OF WILL **NOT** BE IN A
GEOGRAPHICAL SENSE."
Why do they keep insisting that the future flight will NOT be
geographical? Is there any other kind of flight than a change in
location? If you are in harms way and you flee so that you are no
longer in harms way aren't we talking about a physical-
geographical- movement away from the "dangerous place" to the "safe
place"? There are only three ways that you can conceive of flight.
(1.) You can flee symbolically which is to say you change your
mental space. (2.) You can flee spatially which means an actual
geographical flight. (3.) And you can conceptualize a temporal
flight. If the flight isn't mental or symbolic, and if it isn't
geographical that leaves temporal flight - flight in time. So are
they suggesting some sort of time warp?
They continue in that same Paragraph 22 "God's people are already
around the globe, virtually in every corner."
So they think this is the premise for them to "logically conclude
that for us the flight Jesus spoke of will NOT be in a geographical
sense."
The Watchtower argument can be summed up by the following
SINCE/THEREFORE format:
SINCE, "First century Christians weren't located "all over the
globe"
THEREFORE, "they could flee from that city to the mountainous
region." and
SINCE, "In the future, God's faithful Witnesses will be located all
over the globe" THEREFORE, "safety and protection will not be based
on geographic location."
The problem with the SINCE (premise) is that the only way for the
Christians in Jerusalem to survive was to physically get out of
Jerusalem. But what about the majority of early Christians. The
majority of early Christians weren't residents of Jerusalem. The
command to get out of Jerusalem was not a general command to ALL
Christians. Christians could be found in large numbers all over the
Roman Empire and beyond. In fact the Watchtower has stated many
times that the scripture at Matthew 24:14 had an early fulfillment
by the time Jerusalem was destroyed.
Likewise today true Christians might want to look for a parallel to
ancient Jerusalem from which they could literally flee. Not ALL
Christians will have to flee. Only those who dwell in some modern
day counterpart of Jerusalem will have to flee when they see their
geographical region seriously threatened by the yet to be observed
"disgusting thing".
BABYLON THE GREAT IS NOT THE WORLD EMPIRE OF FALSE RELIGION
If Babylon the Great is not World Religion what is it? It is the
wealthiest entity on the face of the earth. It is the United
States that lives in shameless luxury. It is the United States
that has committed "fornication" deals with ruling elites around
the world. It has deceived the whole world with its economic
system. It sits as a hegemon - "And the woman whom you saw means
the great city that has a kingdom over the kings of the earth."
Rev. 17:18. The United States has lived a protected life isolated
by two great "waters/oceans". It sits like ancient Babylon on a
moat-it is an island. "In her heart she keeps saying 'I sit a
queen, and I am no widow, and I shall never see mourning'. That is
why in one day her plagues will come, death and mourning and
famine, and she will be completely burned with fire, because
Jehovah God, who judge her is strong." Rev. 18:7,8.
It should be easy to see why Jehovah's Witnesses would not come to
realize the true identity of Babylon the Great until the crucial
moment when flight would be necessary. The Bible clearly says that
God's people are to get out of Babylon the Great. Let's say they
understood that 50 years ago. Jehovah's witnesses would have felt
very uncomfortable hanging around here anticipating the time when
they would have to leave.
More information on the disgusting thing can be found at this link.
http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/12/152398/1.ashx
This discusses a one world religion and the WTS participation in this.
