Jesus Last Supper, and the true about the "Bread"

by justhuman 4 Replies latest jw friends

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  justhuman

  Watchtower holds the possition that Jesus Christ at the last supper, had the celebration of the Jewish Passover, and that the bread He shared with the disciples was unleavened bread.

  The Gospel account it might be misleading at first, and lead to a wrong conclusion like WT does. With a close examination what happened regarding Jesus Last Supper, and compare the Old Testament accounts of the Passover and the Gospels account, the outcome is completely different.

  Mark 14:12 shows that the Last Supper occured the day before the unleavened feast, and at Mark 14:22 Jesus here cut the Bread and share it. In the Bible when the bread is unleavened it is specifying this. And in this case Jesus shared a normal bread. In the Greek testament it makes it clear when it says Arton-bread and azymos artos-unleavened bread.

  Then He was arrested at the garden of Gesthemany Mark 14:26-43 early Friday(Paraskevi)morning and He was delivered by the Scribes and Pharisees to the Roman Governor.

  At the same morning the Priests did not entered at the Roman Praitory in order not to get defiled, since the celebration of the Passover was starting from Friday evening to Saturnday-or Sabath to be more correct. Friday(Parskevi)was the eve of the Jewish Passover and eating unleavened bread, lamb, before that was forbidden by the law. - Exodus 12

  So Jesus did not celebrate the Jewish Passover, but the New Govenant that He set one night before He was crucified at the beggining of the Jewish Passover.-John 18:28, 19:31. It is obvious that Apostle John give us the day Jesus celabrated the New Passover a day before the Jewish. Also Jesus had wine at the table, while the Jewish Passover did not included wine.- Exodus 12

  Simon from Kyreni was engaged to help Jesus to carry the Cross. - Mark 15:21, and he was coming from the work at the fields. So if the celebretion of the Passover has started, Simon wouldn't go and work at the fields since it was forbidden by the Mosaic Law

  Joseph of Arimathea went to the shops and bought the linen cloth for Jesus burrial - Mark 15:46. So there was NO WAY to have open shops if the Passover has began

  This is the Biblical account regarding Jesus Last Supper and the Bread. This is why the Orthodox Faith ever since the early days of the Apostolic Church has kept the faith as it was delivered by Jesus and the Apostles.

  Using unleavened bread at the Eucharist it is heretic and it goes back with the Apollinaris heretic view regarding the Bread
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  JosephMalik

  Mark 14:12 shows that the Last Supper occured the day before the unleavened feast, and at Mark 14:22 Jesus here cut the Bread and share it. In the Bible when the bread is unleavened it is specifying this. And in this case Jesus shared a normal bread. In the Greek testament it makes it clear when it says Arton-bread and azymos artos-unleavened bread.

  JH,

  No it doesn’t. 14:12 And the first day of unleavened bread, when they killed the passover, his disciples said unto him, Where wilt thou that we go and prepare that thou mayest eat the passover? What day is it already? Nisan 14. What time is it? Daytime. When will they eat this meal? In the evening. So what would be the DATE when they ate this meal that evening? Nisan 15. The Greek later in Mark did not bother to specify unleavened since verse 12 already put this bread in proper context.

  You said: Then He was arrested at the garden of Gesthemany Mark 14:26-43 early Friday(Paraskevi)morning and He was delivered by the Scribes and Pharisees to the Roman Governor. . . At the same morning the Priests did not entered at the Roman Praitory in order not to get defiled, since the celebration of the Passover was starting from Friday evening to Saturnday-or Sabath to be more correct. Friday(Parskevi)was the eve of the Jewish Passover and eating unleavened bread, lamb, before that was forbidden by the law. - Exodus 12

  Not only do you have your days wrong but you fail to understand that Passover was 7 days long and each meal during it was still called Passover and was as important since it was eaten with unleavened bread, that key and sacred ingredient during this week long festival.

  You said: So Jesus did not celebrate the Jewish Passover, but the New Govenant that He set one night before He was crucified at the beggining of the Jewish Passover.-John 18:28, 19:31. It is obvious that Apostle John give us the day Jesus celabrated the New Passover a day before the Jewish. Also Jesus had wine at the table, while the Jewish Passover did not included wine.- Exodus 12

  Jesus was not crucified until the end of this Jewish Passover week. He did not die until the day of Preparation for the 7 day of Passover which also part of a high Sabbath or a 48 hour Sabbath at that time. Since the Orthodox Church gets this wrong you should question what other errors are they making? It will turn out to be a long list.

  You said: Simon from Kyreni was engaged to help Jesus to carry the Cross. - Mark 15:21, and he was coming from the work at the fields. So if the celebretion of the Passover has started, Simon wouldn't go and work at the fields since it was forbidden by the Mosaic Law

  No it wasn’t. They had to gather the new grain to make a fresh batch of unleavened grain from their new grain harvest as part of the wave harvest that takes place during Passover week.

  You said: Joseph of Arimathea went to the shops and bought the linen cloth for Jesus burrial - Mark 15:46. So there was NO WAY to have open shops if the Passover has began

  Sure there was. Even in extreme cases the Law allowed for unusual circumstances and the Talmud agrees.

  You said: This is the Biblical account regarding Jesus Last Supper and the Bread. This is why the Orthodox Faith ever since the early days of the Apostolic Church has kept the faith as it was delivered by Jesus and the Apostles. . . Using unleavened bread at the Eucharist it is heretic and it goes back with the Apollinaris heretic view regarding the Bread

  You do not want me to comment about what I think about that comment.

  Joseph
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  justhuman

  At John 13:1 we read:

  1. And before the feast of the passover, Jesus knowing that his hour hath come, that he may remove out of this world unto the Father, having loved his own who are in the world, to the end he loved them

  2 And supper being come, the devil already having put it into the heart of Judas of Simon, Iscariot, that he may deliver him up

  So when it was the feast of passover starting?

  You also wrote:

  ---

  Jesus was not crucified until the end of this Jewish Passover week. He did not die until the day of Preparation for the 7 day of Passover which also part of a high Sabbath or a 48 hour Sabbath at that time. Since the Orthodox Church gets this wrong you should question what other errors are they making? It will turn out to be a long list.

  ---

  You said: This is the Biblical account regarding Jesus Last Supper and the Bread. This is why the Orthodox Faith ever since the early days of the Apostolic Church has kept the faith as it was delivered by Jesus and the Apostles. . . Using unleavened bread at the Eucharist it is heretic and it goes back with the Apollinaris heretic view regarding the Bread

  You do not want me to comment about what I think about that comment.

  ---

  I'm an open minded person and willing to discuss ALL MATERS without prejudice, and to hear comments based on logic and facts. At least I can prove the Apostolic Succesion of the Orthodox Church that goes back from the days of James the first Bishop of Jerusalim, that is 2000 years. As for the wrong things that the Orthodox Church gets them wrong, again I'm willing to point me out the wrong things as you said.
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  BurnTheShips

  This is the Biblical account regarding Jesus Last Supper and the Bread. This is why the Orthodox Faith ever since the early days of the Apostolic Church has kept the faith as it was delivered by Jesus and the Apostles.

  Using unleavened bread at the Eucharist it is heretic and it goes back with the Apollinaris heretic view regarding the Bread

  Not all Catholics use unleavened bread. The Latin Rite is the only one that does, the Eastern Catholic Rites do not. They are in full communion with each other. So really, Catholics use leavened or unleavened bread. This should not be a matter that divides the particular churches.

  You quote Mark and John. Here is Luke's account at chapter 22:

  Then came the day of Unleavened Bread on which the Passover lamb had to be sacrificed. Jesus sent Peter and John, saying, "Go and make preparations for us to eat the Passover."

  "Where do you want us to prepare for it?" they asked.

  He replied, "As you enter the city, a man carrying a jar of water will meet you. Follow him to the house that he enters, and say to the owner of the house, 'The Teacher asks: Where is the guest room, where I may eat the Passover with my disciples?' He will show you a large upper room, all furnished. Make preparations there."
  They left and found things just as Jesus had told them. So they prepared the Passover.

  When the hour came, Jesus and his apostles reclined at the table. And he said to them, "I have eagerly desired to eat this Passover with you before I suffer. For I tell you, I will not eat it again until it finds fulfillment in the kingdom of God."

  Here is Matthew's account at chapter 26:

  On the first day of the Feast of Unleavened Bread, the disciples came to Jesus and asked, "Where do you want us to make preparations for you to eat the Passover?"
  He replied, "Go into the city to a certain man and tell him, 'The Teacher says: My appointed time is near. I am going to celebrate the Passover with my disciples at your house.' " So the disciples did as Jesus had directed them and prepared the Passover. When evening came, Jesus was reclining at the table with the Twelve. And while they were eating.............
  While they were eating, Jesus took bread, gave thanks and broke it, and gave it to his disciples, saying, "Take and eat; this is my body."
  Then he took the cup, gave thanks and offered it to them, saying, "Drink from it, all of you. This is my blood of the[b] covenant, which is poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins. I tell you, I will not drink of this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it anew with you in my Father's kingdom."

  Burn
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  lawrence

  Artos, azymos, Apollinaris heretics, and the Cross;

  And why does a rolling stone then, not gather moss?

  Floss the dross, and the theology gets mighty sauced.

  Pause, caress, and take deep breath; celebrate loss.