by cameo-d 6 Replies latest watchtower bible
Is there some scripture that the 144,000 must all be removed or no longer alive before Armageddon begins?
Are they supposed to be "taken out of the way" before Armageddon begins?
Can someone clarify this for me please?
Maybe cite a scripture that tells.
Are they supposed to be around during tribulation?
Are they supposed to be the number of survivors that come through Armageddon?
The Watchtower teaches that some will be alive on earth during Armageddon.
The bible (NWT) paints a different picture. Zechariah 14.3-5 describes the last days with God coming along with all the Holy ones (144,000). It does not say most or some of the Holy ones. The book of Revelation backs this up also. Chapter 14 describes the 144,000 in heaven with God then the hour of judgement arrives for those on earth. Also, how fair would it be during the marriage of the lamb,that not all the Holy ones are attending, with some still stuck on the earth? This important event depicts all holy ones there before the great day of Jehovah.
Just my thoughts on this.
Excito
Are you talking about a literal 144,000?
Well, the actual Scriptures (to the best of my knowledge) only mention 144,000 twice (or at least in two instances by actual number), both in Rev. Neither one specifically mentions "alive at Armageddon, after Armageddon, or such". IIRC, of course.
Anything else, including whether this is an ultra-rare instance of the Revalations of St. John saying anything at all in literal way (note that he simultaneously mentions "the Lamb") -
- is purely speculation.
Both the 144,000 "joint heirs with Christ" and Armageddon are products of man's imagination: they are not real. So the answer can be yes, it can be no, it can be maybe - and each answer is equally valid, depending on YOUR imagination.
It will be the final symbolic battle when all unsaved will realize the presence of God and Jesus Christ as foretold in the Bible and they will rise in their thoughts facing God the Almighty ! How ? They will know they are going to die forever so what a person condemned to such a fate will do at that time ?
God Yahweh will turn out to be an easy uncontested victor !
And note it may happen very soon - the prediction for 2011 AD is in place if you read my past posts .
Go to alt.apocalypse ( google group ).
My belief is that armageddon started whenever the appointed times of nations concluded and is a battle between the forces of darkness and the light. Jesus chose a church and is directing it whilst satan being cast to earth is fighting against it and using the worlds governments to oppose the preaching and converting work . The 144k are martyrs and are killed by the ax and are the first resurrection , the great crowd are the followers of christ that never die or know death and survive into the kingdom . armageddon ends at ,"the great fear inspiring day of God almighty," whenever the complete destruction of world powers takes place . It is an invisible spiritual battle .
