How do you believe something is true - or reject it as a lie?

BonaFide

When someone told me something new, or when I heard something new, how do you decide that it is true or not? This was the way I decided to accept things or not for my entire life until a few months ago:

FIRST:

1. Does what I just heard support Jehovah's Organization?

SECOND:

2. Does it make sense? Is it logical?

If what I heard was that about some scientists who believe in creation, or Catholic pedophile priests, or global warming, or a worldly person being unkind to someone else, then I would usually accept it as truth, (unless it was a crazy urban legend), because it supports Jehovah's Organization as being right and others wrong.

I used to love to put current events in my talks, and find a way to apply them to Jehovah's Organization. I would make it fit somehow.

Now my decision on whether to believe something is:

1. Does it make sense?

2. Is there evidence to back that statement up?

I can't seem to write this logically, maybe someone on here can fix it for me. The point I am trying to make is that whenever I would hear anything, the first thing I would do is would relate it somehow to being a Witness and we have the truth.

So now when I talk to my family, and they do the same thing, it drives me crazy. They won't even consider the idea that the Organization could be wrong, THEY WONT EVEN CONSIDER IT.

Even is something is outright stupid or worse, like when we can't call 911 at the Assembly Hall unless the elders approve it, or when we can't accept our blood being stored, but we can accept blood fractions, which are processed and obviously stored. Or when an elder is unkind to someone, or when someone on the platform talks about college not being a wise choice, even though they themselves are in college. Or when a Witness is convicted of child molestation.

When I used to hear any of these things, the VERY FIRST THOUGHT in my mind was: How do I show that the Organization is right? What sentence can I say to show my loyalty to the Organization?

The frustration level gets so high now sometimes when I talk to my friends and family. They will say anything at all, absolutely anything, and allow anything at all, even death. But no way is the Organization wrong.

That is the number one thing to keep in mind as a Witness. Nothing else matters.

leftbelow

I like your new way BF it acually works when looking for real truth
Maddie

What you have now is critical thinking ability. As a JW that isn't used because of the indoctrination and strong mind control.
Maddie
yknot

You can not change a mind that is not open to change.
There is a season for all things.
I understand all too well the desire to drag out every single person you care about from the WTS.
But this is not your decision and if you push hard they will freak out!
Stratagem and patience are priceless in a theocratic warfare arsenal.
You have to achieve the person's trust & confidence. You must be willing to wait until the time is right and even then it is small tidbits at a time.
They are addicted to WTS milk, solids are introduced at a timely rate.
Right now the WTS is giving many opportunities, however most are for those who are already burdened by the strictness of the WTS.
Some of the other opportunities are found at the * mark...... *the WTS no longer publishes this publication..... yet the faithful JWs is highly curious anyways.... slipping them a copy of whatever publication is mentioned always helps to wet there desire for more.
Recently our new PO requested a publication from Atlantis...... Yea you read correctly....my PO wanted a copy from Atlantis since the publication was not found it the KH library!
So if you are going to stay 'undecover' for awhile learn patience dear Bonafide-san wax on, wax off.....
Start to build you alter-life...... start making new friends either at work or through recreation.
Hortensia

it isn't just JWs who lack critical thinking. I work in the spa industry and there are loads of people who believe stuff that just doesn't make sense and has no evidence to support it. In classes, when students make some of the really ridiculous spa claims, I ask for the evidence that supports it. For instance those damn foot pads that are supposed to remove "toxins" from the body. They are just a scam, they don't remove "toxins" and anyway, what toxins are you talking about? When I talk about toxins, I know specifically which toxins I am referring to, and I have the scientific information to back up my statements.
HB

I find this a very interesting subject as it is at the heart of everyone's philosophy of life, whether a JW or not.
Theoretically, if you were to write a long list of all the widely varying beliefs that human beings have, with the most ridiculous and crazy ideas (in your opinion) at the top and working down to what you feel are the most logical ideas at the bottom, and then ask other people to draw a line to indicate where they feel the dividing line between fact and fiction lies, no one would be able to draw a line exactly.
Some would roughly draw the line right near the bottom of the list, as they mostly only believe in things that can be proved by science or logic, but they may still hold onto one or two highly illogical belief from the top of the list. Others would roughly draw the line near the top but reject something quite logical from the bottom of the list as untrue.
A lady I know who is an intelligent and successful business woman running her own company, has rejected all religion as superstition, but nevertheless firmly believes that she has been reincarnated and that in her previous life she was an ancient egyptian Princess. (Her cat who is called Tutankhamun was apparently her cat in her previous existence and was reincarnated with her.) Her bookshelves are full of self-help books on everything from healing the soul with a fruit diet to feng shui and coping with alien visitations. And also for the past few years each week she has paid about £100 for a consultation lasting half an hour with a personal spiritual guru (a clever American) who basically tells her what he knows she wants to hear (ie how amazing she is) but he disguises his 'wisdom' in spiritual-sounding language, claiming to teach her to get in touch with her inner child etc. She believes he has special powers other humans don't have.
When I have discussions with her, asking her how she knows her beliefs are true, she first brings out a 'wonderful and enlightening' book that she has read, She dismisses my point that just becasue it's written in a book, it doesn't mean something is true but claims she "just knows in every pore of her being it's 100% true". She says I am the blind one and hopes one day I will reach her level of enlightenment and understand truth in the powerful way that she does. She is just as deluded in my opinion as JWs are.
It may be simplistic, but I see her illogical beliefs being made while her rational mind is held in suspense. She points out that my judgement of what is rational and what is not is different to hers and asks who is to judge? I counter that truth is not subjective, and the discussion twists in and out and we eventually get nowhere and have to agree to differ.
My own way of deciding if something is true or a lie, (which applies to everything including an arguement between two children over who punched whom first, or whether God exists) is to try to keep emotion out of the process. I start off with a sceptical mind, then find out as much as I can on both sides of the arguement to learn the facts, listen to as many other opionions as possible, then use logic as best I can. But in cases where this cannot prove the matter either way, I go by the "balance of probability", but keep a little bit of my mind open. Emotions can be wonderful but can also be powerful and dangerous things if not kept in control by the logical side of the brain.
still_in74

the WT is full of unsubstantiated generalities. The R&F are weened on this, educated to think that these types of statements are those of intellectials. For example:
"they say"
"one journalist stated"
"scientists today"
"many people feel that...."
This type of speaking (I believe referred to as weasal words) is for uneducated wannabees. Admitedley I myself am guilty of speaking this way because its been so ingrained into my speech. We are taught to speak this way and commended when we do.
Because JW's are commended for speaking unsubstantiated heresay, they dont need to research anything.
When the org takes words out of context or just plain creates "facts" out of the air, JW's are not likely to question these unsubstantiated statements.
No one disagrees with the orgs unsubstantiated nonsense, no one disagrees with the individuals unsubstantiated banter, so thus they are smart people!
When "worldly" people disagree with these idiots the JW's dismiss them as blind and stupid because they're worldly and all worldly people are idiots! "Except of course we love them so much and thats why we preach to those stupid morons because we have sooo much love for them!"
I was trying to have an intelligent discussion about global warming with my sister and all she wanted to talk about was "its because its the last days!" -- she was mad at me for actually presenting factual evidence and not just rolling over to the last days bull shit! "dont you go to the book studies?? " rev book at the time
a friend of mine is always presenting as fact somehting he heard an elder say. If an elder said it it must be true! same for the "society" - your not going against the "society" are you???? (i cant believe it took me 33 years to realize how unbelievabley cultish that sounds/is)
JW's get angry when you dont just go along with last days, this old system crap because that is as far as the WT ever takes them. They only have to say "this old system" or "last days" or whatever and the whole cong nods there heads and the elders pat them on the backs. When you dont pat them on the back they get defensive because either your an apostate or they are a complete brain washed idiot!
BonaFide

Thanks for giving me a lot to think about. Wow was I brainwashed.

How do you believe something is true - or reject it as a lie?

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