What Would Jesus Say to You and the Governing Body?

by AllTimeJeff 9 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • AllTimeJeff
    AllTimeJeff

    Would you be a Jehovah's Witness if you just read the bible by itself? For that matter, without the aid of any religious influence, would one be apart of any religious group or body because of a specific mandate within the bible?

    I realize this is at least a tricky and controversial question, best answered by the individual doing the reading of the bible.

    The reason why it is so relevant is because of the claims that Jehovah's Witnesses (JW) make regarding their view and use of the bible. It would be hard for JW's to be viewed as relevant if they didn't represent themselves as guardians of the bible. Fair enough. They do that. They say, "We have it right, you don't." And that includes accepting the direction of the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses, a group of self appointed men who claim that they alone have been given authority to administer to the congregation. They claim that this is for the benefit of all, and leads to unity and gods approval.

    But does the evidence match that kind of claim?

    Consider the facts:

    Does the bible teach about the existence of a central group of men administering to all the Christian congregations? No. Other then a group meeting in Acts 15 to discuss the controversial (back then anyway) subject of circumcision, we find no other faint resemblance to a meeting of the "big wigs". Decisions were made by each congregation. And if the Pauline letters are any indication, few if any of these congregations were smooth running machines, largely because of the great variety of people and personalities within them, and I would include Paul in that myself.

    In fact, it is fair to note that in the bible, we find two main components to the New Testament. The Gospels, and the Pauline letters. It has been commented by many of the inconsistencies that exist in tone at least, if not content, between these two main parts.

    The reason I bring this up isn't to draw conclusions per se, but to highlight the clear lack of mandate, as well as a seeming ambivalence the NT has toward centralized authority. Whereas Jesus frequently spoke of personal salvation through faith and grace, Paul stressed that this was to be done through the congregation the Christian found themselves in. Jehovah's Witnesses have taken this even further, in that the group is more important then the individual desiring to follow Christ. The Governing Body supersedes all else, especially you.

    It isn't my purpose or intent to direct your thoughts on this matter, as we all differ greatly on the matter of who to worship, or if we should worship at all. The point is, the bible doesn't point to any one religious tradition at all, with its various hierarchy. That goes for any Christian group today that tries to claim it as such. Especially Jehovah's Witnesses.

    Why is this relevant? For me, I have rejected most of the bible, but not all of it. I still value the four Gospels, Proverbs and Ecclesiastes. I find great wisdom there, and I view these books especially as valuable literature. And while I don't try to interpret, I don't mind telling you the straight forward truth either. And that is, Jesus wouldn't have anything to do with the business that Christian religion has become.

    It seems to me that Jesus, (if he as he is portrayed in the gospels) was way more about you then any church that ever followed. In that, there is great benefit to be derived.

    Jesus condemned the business that the Jews created for religious purposes. It was precisely because the needs of the religious leaders became paramount over the poor flock they were supposed to be taking care of. Instead, they were fleecing the flock, and Jesus wasted no opportunity to point this out.

    Do I believe that Jesus existed? (or someone like him) Sure. I don't worship him, but its hard to think that a movement that lasted 2000 years plus started as a figment of someones imagination. Is there any indication that the "historic" Jesus would take part in a meeting of the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses? Maybe, if only to tell this group of gas bags to repent. In fact, I have little doubt that he would give some highlights from his famous Sermon on the Mount. These are from the infamous JW version of the bible, the New World Translation:

    (Matthew 5:43-48) 43 "YOU heard that it was said, 'You must love your neighbor and hate your enemy.' 44 However, I say to YOU: Continue to love YOUR enemies and to pray for those persecuting YOU; 45 that YOU may prove yourselves sons of YOUR Father who is in the heavens, since he makes his sun rise upon wicked people and good and makes it rain upon righteous people and unrighteous. 46 For if YOU love those loving YOU, what reward do YOU have? Are not also the tax collectors doing the same thing? 47 And if YOU greet YOUR brothers only, what extraordinary thing are YOU doing? Are not also the people of the nations doing the same thing?

    (Matthew 7:1-5) 7 "Stop judging that YOU may not be judged; 2 for with what judgment YOU are judging, YOU will be judged; and with the measure that YOU are measuring out, they will measure out to YOU. 3 Why, then, do you look at the straw in your brother's eye, but do not consider the rafter in your own eye? 4 Or how can you say to your brother, 'Allow me to extract the straw from your eye'; when, look! a rafter is in your own eye? 5 Hypocrite! First extract the rafter from your own eye, and then you will see clearly how to extract the straw from your brother's eye.


    This last scripture I will let stand as my concluding thought. And I would point out that as you read it, note that Jesus didn't give this responsibility to a religion or a group of men, he gave it to you.

    (Matthew 7:15-20) 15 "Be on the watch for the false prophets that come to YOU in sheep's covering, but inside they are ravenous wolves. 16 By their fruits YOU will recognize them. Never do people gather grapes from thorns or figs from thistles, do they? 17 Likewise every good tree produces fine fruit, but every rotten tree produces worthless fruit; 18 a good tree cannot bear worthless fruit, neither can a rotten tree produce fine fruit. 19 Every tree not producing fine fruit gets cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Really, then, by their fruits YOU will recognize those [men].

  • Joe Grundy
    Joe Grundy

    I have never been a JW, so please feel free to disregard my opinion.

    I live in Pahos, Cyprus, which is where Paul (allegedly) changed his name from Saul. Coincidentally or not the Roman governor here at that time was Paulus Serginus (I think). This was also where Saul/Paul had that curious showdown with 'Jesus bar-abbas' and blinded him to show that Paul was top-dog. (Covered in Acts, I think, but my knowledge is hazy).

    I have stood on the mosaic floors where all this is supposed to have happened, and I have been to the 'whipping post' where Paul/Saul is alleged to have been whipped (also in Acts), about 5 minutes walk away.

    My irreverent reply to the question in your post title is: 'Whatever Paul/Saul later thought would best fit in with his new religion'.

    But, as I said, please feel free to disregard my opinion.

  • aniron
    aniron

    As Augustine said:

    "If keep the parts of the Gospel you like and reject the parts of the Gospel you don't like.

    Then its not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."

  • AllTimeJeff
    AllTimeJeff

    "If keep the parts of the Gospel you like and reject the parts of the Gospel you don't like.

    Then its not the Gospel you believe, but yourself."

    Considering all of organized religions efforts for the group to not believe in themselves at the expense of the group, I would suggest strongly that one of the most spiritual things you can do is to build up yourself, and belief in yourself.

  • yknot
    yknot

    Jeff

    I love your posts....

  • WTWizard
    WTWizard

    If I could somehow fix all the memory and transcription errors and editings found in the Gospels, Jesus would have some rather shocking things to say to all of us. Pretty much, once all the confusion and memory errors are factored out, Jesus wanted us to be our own Gods.

  • villabolo
    villabolo

    "Then you will say, 'we ate and we drank with you, and you taught in our streets.' But he will reply, "I don't know you or where you come from. Away from me, all you evildoers." Luke 13:26,27

    That is what Jesus would say to the Governing Body.

  • stillajwexelder
    stillajwexelder

    'Whatever Paul/Saul later thought would best fit in with his new religion'.

    PAULIANITY not Christianity?

  • sir82
    sir82

    Matthew chapter 23.

    The whole thing.

    Verbatim.

  • Doubting Bro
    Doubting Bro

    Sir82 beat me to it! The JW organization really makes the Pharisees of Jesus day jealous with their efficiency in being self-righteous.

    I saw others comment about how Jesus teachings really fit in well with Eastern philosophy and Solomon's writings seem to as well. There's some valuable life advice there whether you chose to think of it as divinely inspired or just wise words.

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