Greetings, dear Voices, and peace to you! A dear one informed me of this thread and so I decided I'd better check it out. I'm not sure if you ARE asking me, but since you kind of generalize who it is you're asking, I will respond/explain, as my Lord permits me.
We are fleshly, and love our flesh...
Partly, yes... and no, not everyone.
'no man has hated his own flesh...he feeds it etc..' (i'm probably misquoting).
Close enough... but you do remember that this is a quote from Paul... and not Christ, right? And you do recall that Christ said, "If you eye is causing you to sin... pluck it out"? One who loves his flesh most likely wouldn't do that. One who believed ALL loved their flesh more than they loved him... wouldn't have given such an exhortation. Indeed, HE is recorded to have said, "The flesh... is of NO USE at all." Yes?
Maybe some more than others.
Most certainly.
Now when it comes to pleasure ...taste, sight, hearing, touch, smell...those are all fleshly things.
If you are speaking of the empirical... the "sensual"... meaning, of the physical senses... yes. But the flesh isn't the only part of us that experiences pleasure, dear one.
(there probably is the same thing in the spirit sense...but lets just talk about the physical)
Yes, and okay.
how do you allow yourself to transcend that?
Well, you first have to realize that you CAN, yes? And that is what really gets in most folks' way - they don't believe they CAN... and so they never bother trying. Second, you have to realize... KNOW... that you are not solely flesh... that there is another "part" to "you"... and it is that part that you are working with.
do you cut off your desire from Tasting something delicious like the monks do?
That's not really necessary. What IS necessary is for you to realize... KNOW... that that "delicious" taste is not as delicious as you think it is, that it is only as delicious as you think it is because you're only experiencing "part" of what you are capable of. If you can REALIZE, however, that such deliciousness is actually lacking... and allow yourself to reach BEYOND that... then you exist with both: the ability to "taste" physically... as well as to "taste" spiritually. Thus, the Most Holy One of Israel says, "Taste... and see that I am good." So, although one has learned to taste spiritually, one does not need to lose the ability to taste physically. They are not one and same... and they don't necessarily cancel one another out.
I say "don't necessarily" because focusing on the physical CAN stand in the way of experiencing the spiritual... and attaining to the spiritual CAN change one's... ummmm... focus and perception of the physical.
Do you cut off your desire to be intimate sexually as married couples do?
Why do that? Sexual intimacy is for the flesh. And you're partly flesh. BUT... not only is it not the be-all/end-all of intimacy, it actually falls short. Because its primary focus is exciting the flesh. But the flesh... is VERY limited in what it can experience. Spiritual intimacy (i.e., union with Christ, which is compared to the union between a man and woman), however, takes the experience to unfathomably greater heights. It is something your flesh cannot compare with. No, it is not like the ultimate orgasm, per se (please pardon my candor, Ms. Sylvie), at least as such pertains to what is experienced through the flesh. It is, however... okay, let me think. I want to explain this in a way that makes sense: it is like literally receiving the "oneness" that every intimate married couple is seeking to obtain by BEING physical with one another... but throughout one's entire being... excluding the physical. While one may feel it in one's blood stream (through the rush of blood, etc.) when having the physical experience... one feels it all the way into one's BLOOD... with the spiritual. And, the latter is constant, virtually 24/7, while the former is only when engaging in some kind of physical act.
Is it wrong to prefer a rose over a trash can?
How could that be wrong? I don't understand the comparison...
or hear classical music compared to death metal? or seeing something beautiful versus ugly.
Beauty... in all things... including music... is in the eye... or ear... of the beholder, yes? To some, classical music is beautiful. For others, it puts them to sleep (I personally prefer strings over horns). And what is the definition of "ugly"? Who defines it?? I mean, a trash can is a beautiful thing to a scavenging racoon... or a just hired garbageman.
What is it that is required to do?
To start, having FAITH... that you AREN'T the sum total of your flesh... but much, much more... so as to even ALLOW yourself to learn how to see, hear, taste, touch, and smell with THAT other part of "you."
I understand communion...and obeying the voice when it's heard,
Excellent! But you have to believe there IS a voice, yes? And that the voice isn't some disembodied will-o-the-wisp... or your own "thoughts"... but an actual "someone"... who is actually SPEAKING... to YOU. Yes?
But if you've got the curtain between you and God (flesh) how do you transcend that flesh? It is done in spirit and Truth, but how does one get there?
By HEARING AND GETTING THE SENSE OF THE TRUTH... that CHRIST is the DOOR through which you MUST go. Your flesh IS a curtain, yes. BUT... if you GO THROUGH CHRIST, the DOOR... you can transcend YOUR flesh. You enter in SPIRIT, not flesh... THROUGH the Truth. That is what is meant by "worshipping GOD... in spirit AND [the] Truth." Truly, dear one... there is NO OTHER WAY.
(Forgive me, please - I am not yelling, not at all, but simply emphasizing, because this is a VERY important truth, that you MUST get and understand if you are to understand this matter).
what kind of mentality is required for you to 'put off your flesh'
First, we're not talking about putting off of the flesh, but transcending it, which is not the same thing. As to transcending, truly, one must have the mentality of a "young child." One is not so sure of himself/herself... that they become like a mule that has to be goaded to go anywhere. Ask a young child what color the sky is and they will answer, immediately, without hesitation... "blue." Ask an "adult" and, after looking at the sky, considering all the color options... then consideration WHY you asked and want to know... and whether perhaps it's actually a "trick" question (because it's such a simple question)... in which case, what's YOUR true agenda... and do I really want to answer, anyway... and if so, do I want to be general or precise... well, you get the picture. I mean, I HOPE you get the picture.
Point is, children keep it simple. They don't give or NEED "rocket science" answers. Adults, on the other hand, always cynical, skeptical, suspicious... and possession a need to be "right" as well as show others up... NEED it to be "rocket science." But the Most Holy One of Israel, His Son the Holy One of Israel... and transcending the flesh... is simple. It is NOT rocket science. Unfortunately, that is why it escapes the "microscopes" of the rocket scientists.
...cause the monks, nuns, and all the others do it. Monks use to put ashes on their food so that they wouldn't enjoy it and would force themselves to put off their taste by this method...
Yet, the Most Holy One of Israel NEVER called for the afflicting of the flesh in this way. Israel created a fast to JAH; however, they turned it into a reason to burden themselves and others. Why? Because they wanted to show how much they "suffered" for God... because they believed it made them appear "righteous." These you've named do the same thing. But it is not the outward appearance of righteousness that is anything: it is what a man is on the INSIDE. The SPIRIT... and UNSEEN person... that he is. Which is why Christ called some "Whitewashed graves, full of dead men's bones." They look all that on the outside... but what's in them is ugly, unclean, even evil.
what does it mean to put off the flesh...exactly and how is it done?
Again, putting off the flesh is NOT the same thing as transcending the flesh, dear one. One is literal (i.e., those angels who still have the ability can put on flesh... which is what is meant when it says they appeared as "ABLE-BODIED" men. Because they are not human, however, they can also put it back off again, so as to reenter the spirit realm. There are only two (2) ways for a human to put off his/her flesh: die... or be changed (as will occur when Christ gathers his chosen ones and changes those who have not died immediately to spirit bodies (i.e., white robes/white outer garments)... and when the same is done for the sheep who did good to his brothers. There is no other way for us but these two.
One who transcends the flesh, however, maintains a body of flesh. They are just able to see, hear, taste, touch, and smell... beyond it. Its limitations do not enslave them... because, by means of holy spirit, they have received a "token" of the freedom that awaits them.
I hope this helps, dear Voices, and, again, peace to you!
A slave of Christ,
SA
