Underage Membership - Legal Defense Against DF

obiefernandez

This topic was inspired by the Can You Sue the Watchtower... http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=21122&site=3

It appears that the legal defense of the Society is based on voluntary association, and based on that membership a person is by law subject to the eclessiastical tribunals (Judicial committees) of Jehovah's Witnesses. It immediately brings to mind the fact that many of us began association or were baptized while still minors. It seems to me that one could argue whether the membership is valid or not if we baptized early or were coerced into baptism.

For instance, I got baptized at 16 due to pressure from my parents. If I was to be charged with wrongdoing and the congregation wanted to disfellowship or disassociate me, could I claim defamation based on the fact that my membership was invalid. That I did not voluntarily submit myself to the religious organization of Jehovah's Witnesses. I imagine this defense would be even easier for those of you that got baptized earlier, especially younger than 10-12 years old.

What do you think? Is it a loophole?

Pathofthorns

It would be an interesting question to pursue.

There was a push in the '80s for kids to get baptized before highschool as it would be a "protection".

Many got baptized around 12-15 years of age, hardly old enough to really make such an "important decision", at least not an informed one.

I hate the line that "we don't force our children to become JWs". Its just that if u choose otherwise, the treatment kind of sucks.

Path

David Gladden

Bastards!

They crank out kids (such as myself), raise them in the cult, and restrict their association. Then our only way out is to be shunned by our families and friends and be tossed out and treated like last weeks trash.

And people keep wondering why so many of us are bitter.

Bastards!

NeonMadman

What do you think? Is it a loophole?

Maybe, but only if you annul your membership immediately after reaching the age of majority.

Under normal contract law (if I remember correctly from Business Law 101 and 102), a minor who enters into a contract can annul that contract. However, if he continues to act under that contract after attaining the age of majority (say, by making payments on an installment purchase), then he has affirmed the contract as an adult, and is bound by it just as if he had been an adult when he entered into it.

So, applying this to the JW thing, it is conceivable that one baptized as a minor might be able to annul his baptism up to the time of his reaching majority. For example, if you were baptized at 12, and 18 is the age of majority in your area, you could annul your baptism under this theory up until your 18th birthday, or within a reasonable time thereafter, provided you had not acted as one of Jehovah's Witnesses after turning 18.

What might constitute "acting as one of Jehovah's Witnesses"? I suspect that one could make the argument that attending meetings is not sufficient in itself, since meeting attendance is essentially a passive pursuit, but engaging in and reporting field service almost certainly would. Likewise giving parts on a meeting or helping out at a quick-build project.

The problem with all this is that these are procedures that might reasonably be expected to be followed in a court of law. The JW's have their own law, and any legal argument you might make of this sort isn't likely to affect their shunning policy toward you. It might, however, help to use this sort of reasoning if you were actually involved in litigation over a disfellowshipping.

But then, I'm not a lawyer; I could be wrong...

Tom
"The truth was obscure, too profound and too pure; to live it you had to explode." ---Bob Dylan

Smoldering Wick

I was baptized @ age 9.

Jourles

We have all heard about your baptism as being "the most important day in your life," "a day more important than even your wedding day." Those statements are factual and true - in everyone's case. I am willing to wager that every single baptised JW has heard these words in one form or another during their lifetime.

If one is able to make such an important life altering decision, from any age such as 8 or 9 years old, then by using sound reason, it is also acceptable for an 8 or 9 year old to get married is it not? If not, why not? How would a judge view this? Does a youngster under the age of 10 really have the mental facilities to make this choice on their own without coercion from family members? When I was 10, I do not believe I actually knew what it meant to be baptised. In my mind then, what purpose did it serve?

Taking your scenario to court would be a difficult task. If anything, the responsibility lies with the parents. They are the ones responsible for the upbringing of their child and the molding thereof. You said that you were baptised at the age of 16 due to pressure from your parents. What would have happened if you did not comply? Would you have been kicked out of the house? Looked upon as 'worldly' by the other kids in the hall? Who cares what the other kids think. If your parents would have kicked you out, what recourse could you get if you took your own parents to court? Can you imagine the stink that it would cause locally in the press if you leaked it to reporters? I'm sure the elders and your parents would love that kind of recognition. Here's you, kicked out, living on the streets, simply because you do not want to be baptised into your parents religion? Man, if I were a reporter, that would make first page news in my paper.

Come to think of it, that would be a great scenario for any youth today. Do you think your parents would truly love you if they kicked you out because you did not get baptised? That is one of the most conditional cases of love there is.

Jourles, blabbing on and on
(I guess because it hits too close to home for me)

thinker

obiefernandez,
The WT said this:
"As regards the alleged involvement of children, the [WatchTower Bible and tract Society] submits that children cannot become members of the association but only participate, together with their parents, in the religious activities of the community."
{Sworn testimony submitted by the Society in evidence before the European Human Rights Commission Jul 3 1997}

It seems then that baptism as a minor does not consistute membership.