Recent JW Question

Uboat_Ninja

Seeing as I have'nt been to a Kingdom hall since at least 3 years ago's Memorial, can anyone explain a couple things to me.

1. I always was under the impression that the WTS interpreted the bible as to say that BEFORE the generation that saw 1914 pass away, the end will come. Am I crazy?

2. I heard they've shy'd away from this in the last few years, true?

3. As a kid I remember looking in the yearbooks and seeing the number of partakers in the memorial INCREASE. They explained to me that, awww forget it, theyll explain that the sky is purple to you, that still doesnt explain it to me.

finally
4. I also vaguely remember that the number of active JW's was in fact DECREASING, is this true?

Set me straight ;)

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dmouse

Welcome Uboat.

Yes, the Society did teach that the end would come before those born in 1914 passed away entirely:

*** Awake 1993 3/22 11 Why Such Eager Expectation of the New World? ***
Jesus also indicated that this composite sign would be completed during the life of the generation that saw it begin in 1914. At Matthew 24:32-34, he said: “Now learn from the fig tree as an illustration this point: Just as soon as its young branch grows tender and it puts forth leaves, you know that summer is near. Likewise also you, when you see all these things, know that he is near at the doors. Truly I say to you that this generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur.”

Then, in 1995, came a dramatic change (new light). The term ‘generation’ was re-interpreted to mean all the wicked people living since 1914, even those born recently.

*** Watchtower 1995 11/1 19 A Time to Keep Awake ***
12 Therefore, in the final fulfillment of Jesus’ prophecy today, “this generation” apparently refers to the peoples of earth who see the sign of Christ’s presence but fail to mend their ways.

See also: Watchtowers 1997 - May 1st p29; June 1st p28; Sept 1st p19.

Suddenly Jehovah’s Witnesses, who had been convinced that the end was near because the generation born in 1914 were so old, were faced with the prospect of a generation which could last indefinitely. Obviously, the removal of this time limit (lifespan of humans since 1914) meant that all the people born in 1914 could now pass away. It logically follows that the ‘end’ might be further away than they first thought. This makes the comment in paragraph 15 of the 1995 Watchtower all the more bizarre, it is in fact dishonest:

*** Watchtower 1995 11/1 19 A Time to Keep Awake ***
15 Does our more precise viewpoint on “this generation” mean that Armageddon is further away than we had thought? Not at all!

Official figures for memorial partakers worldwide:
10,523 -- -- -- 1973 (!)
10,723 -- -- -- 1974 (!)

10,080 -- -- -- 1977

8,795………1997
8,756 -- -- -- 1998
8,755………1999
8,661………2000
8,730………2001 (!)
Bear in mind that these people were supposed to have been born before 1935 when the door was closed for being anointed (bar the odd falling away) so they will be very old now and statistically should be passing away a lot faster than this, NOT increasing like they did last year!

Many countries, especially in the developed nations, are showing zero or negative growth, the most notable of which is the USA, Japan and England. However last year overall growth was 1.7% (still a big drop on last year’s 2.3%, 2% in the year before that and 3.6% in 1998) This growth is being generated solely by third world countries where the Internet has yet to make an impact.

Uboat_Ninja

OMG. How convenient. Now another generation will be enslaved. I am enraged. I swear I feel ice run thru me when I hear what this organisation is leading people to. And I feel anger towards all active members (children aside). Stupidity is not an excuse for ignorance, and I know many JW's tend to be less than bright. And if they were bright before , theyll get dull quickly retreading the same boring lectures time and again. I literally feel cold inside. Thanks for the info and for reafirming my attitude.

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rnovello

i became a withness over 25 years ago. believed every thing they told me. now almost all my family died believing the new system was to be here in 1975-76 every day i fight off committing suicide because of this.

Uboat_Ninja

rnovello, I feel for you. What a shame.
My mom is getting old and I've often thought how I'll react when she passes. Truth is I have no clue. I wish the idea of having a mom, but the way she raised me, its too late for us to have any type of relationship. I miss my mom, but to pretend to not feel hatred for a sin she won't acknowledge is futile. The sin was raising me in the WTS.
rnovello, don't let your sadness and anger go unchallenged. Confront JW's if it'll help. But get the rage out somehow man. Email if ya wanna talk about anything.

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jerome

The above quotations you have may not convince some jws that they the watchtower obliged its members to warn the world of the short time before the end of this wicked system of things. That the watchtower vigoursly thought the world/wicked system would end before the end of this generation. This went on for 81 years!

[ 1995-1914=81 ] I doubt that they even started preaching this from so early.

But i'll give them some lead way.

The quotations you show them have to be irrefutable. Withall the silly excuses they make you need a very strong argument.

You know how they like to make excuses for the watchtowers mistakes/false prophecies.

Here is a better one:

If jesus used 'generation' in the sense and we apply it to 1914, then the babies of that generation are now 70 years or older. And others alive in 1914 are in their 80's or 90's.,a few having reached a hundred. There are still many millions of that generation alive. Some of them will by no means pass away untill all things occur.- luke' 21:32."
*****WT 5/15/84******

They may want to make the silly excuse that the word generation is not directly given the meaning life span of humans so that they merly inferred it.

Let them continue for a while. Ok tell them ok i see your point they only inferred it but i havea point too.

Well then you start to chuckel and then pull this one out.

"Jesus Christ indicated these "last days" would not extend beyont the LIFE SPAN of the generation seeing the start (Matt. 24:34)
hence at least some PEOPLE WHO WITNESSES the horrors of World War I will see the COMPLETE END of government by imperfect men and the begining of prosperity under Gods kingdom."

******WT magazine page 583 [or mabe 582 but its there!]*******

OMG did i just read that. Life span. Complete end. People who witnessed. Before the end...

Wow.

Do you not you know that your not supposed to believe this anymore.

Then they might want to say that it is not a false statementyet because some people that were born in 1914 are still alive today.

Ok you can just smile be polite you dont have to laugh.

Please then remind them that the Lord gave them some new light after 81 years of darkness. This happened in 1995 with very little notice to new members who would have been unaware of the importance of this change.

Why does the lord give you this new light only apparently their were apparently about to be proven bluntly incorrect about this prophecy.

How can you expect me to trust Gods organisation when even its members are unaware of changes as big as this.

I dont think this change was even mentioned in their book Insight into the scriptures.
Why would they leave out something as important as this.

[please correct me if i am wrong about this.]

Now you can watch them get upset and make more of their silly excuses.

the bible is a two edged sword
wield it the wrong way and it you WILL cut yourself!

belbab

dmouse,

Do you have the figures for memorial partakers, for 1967 and 1968. I believe the numbers took a big jump upwards at that time. It has been a long time since I have been out. I don't have access to these figures anymore.

belbab

dmouse

Sorry, I only have the figure for 1965 which was 11,550 and
1968 which was 10,619.

Interestingly the figure for 1935 (when the calling ended) was 52,465

I would be interested if anyone else had the figures for 1936 -1967 but they seem impossible to come by.

wokeup

Uboat,according to the Divine Purpose publication, published in 1959 These are the stated memorial partakers between 1938-58
1938: 36,732
1939: 29,385
1940: 27,620
1941: 23,989
1942: 24,035
1943: 23,577
1944: 22,684
1945: 22,324
1946: 27,587
1947: 26,449
1948; 25,395
1949: 24,312
1950: 22,723
1951: 21,619
1952: 20,221
1953: 19,108
1954: 17,884
1955: 16,815
1956: 16,302
1957: 15,628
1958: 15,037

Hope you find this useful. I found it interesting there was over a 5263 increase postWW2 in those claiming to be "annointed".Following that there was a loss of several hundred a year. The number of partakers dropping in half in less than 20 years. Now they have practically quit dying for the last 2 decades.

Allen

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