Baby Killing In The Ancient Roman Empire. Discoveries in Ashkelon

by Gros Michel no more 8 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Gros Michel no more
    Gros Michel no more

    The ancient Roman Empire practiced "infanticide", the killing of newborn babies for any cause deemed appropriate.

    Why are mass burial graves of little babies shocking to archeologist when this practice was common in the ancient Roman Empire? Newborns who displayed birth defects were taken by parents, or local authorities to a city dump, placed on top of the trash. Other methods were to leave your unwanted child outside the gates, to become food for birds or wild beast. The lucky children, if we can say that, would end up in the hands of slave traders that picked through the best which might make good prostitutes. Birth defects or another female (a son was valued highly) lot in life was not promising, early church fathers tried their best to take in as many "dumped babies" as they could affford.

    Plutarch noted that parents in Carthage, had no problem with infanticide they "offered up their own children, and those who had no children would buy little ones from poor people and cut their throats as if they were so many lambs of young birds; meanwhile the mothers stood by without a tear or moan." Moralia 2.17.

    "How and why the bones of nearly 100 infants were deposited in a late Roman-early Byzantine sewer beneath a bathhouse at Ashkelon, on the southern coast of Israel, continue to baffle scholars. An initial examination of the remains by Patricia Smith and Gila Kahila of the Hebrew University revealed that most of the bones, discovered in 1988, were intact and that all parts of the skeletons were represented, suggesting that the infants had probably been thrown into the drain soon after death. All of the bones and teeth (unerupted) are comparable to those of newborn infants. The absence of neonatal lines--prominent marks in the enamel of deciduous teeth and first permanent molars, which are considered evidence of survival for more than three days--indicates the babies died shortly after birth."

    100 baby remains found in a ancient sewer: http://www.archaeology.org/9703/newsbriefs/ashkelon.html

    Contrast the Romans with early christians who were accused of being cannibals, atheists, baby blood drinkers, harlots, witches. One example of the irrationality of the mob of Rome, comes from early writer Minucius Felix, a previous prosecutor, who converts to Christ.

    "AND NOW I WANT to turn to the person who asserts or believes that we are initiated by the murder and the blood of a little child. Can you think it possible that such a tender, tiny body should be gashed with mortal wounds, that anyone alive would slaughter a little baby hardly come into being, to spill, drain, and drink its innocent blood? Nobody can believe such a thing unless he is capable of doing it himself. But I do see people among you at times expose newly born children to wild beasts and birds you at other times put them to death by strangling or by other horrible means. Some women by taking drugs, thus committing infanticide before they are delivered.

    For us it is not permissible even to see or to hear of murder. Yes, we shrink so much from human blood that we do not even use the blood of animals in the food we eat."

    Minucius Felix, Octavius 30.1, 2, 6; 31.1, 5.

    "Among US you can find uneducated people, artisans, and dear old mothers who would not be able to put into words the usefulness of their teachings, but by their deeds they demonstrate the usefulness of their principles. They do not repeat words learned by heart, but they show good deeds: when hit they do not hit back, when robbed they do not go to court, they give to those who ask, and they love their fellowmen as themselves."

    Athenagoras, "A Plea Regarding Christians 11.

    The Christian view of infanticide, even babies born from slaves (unwanted slave babies had no rights) lingers to our day.

    http://books.google.com/books?id=cmdYNpRDo-gC&pg=PT59&lpg=PT59&dq=ancient+Christians+who+oppose+infanticide&source=bl&ots=ez2UbQEZPk&sig=ONI02JYGeFnDtfBoWPuUgEl5Ndw&hl=en&sa=X&ei=XccIUNvGA-fC2wWz18XXBw&ved=0CE4Q6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=ancient%20Christians%20who%20oppose%20infanticide&f=false

  • skeeter1
    skeeter1

    So, it's no wonder that the "God of Abraham" would order infanticide. Borrowed from other cultures.

    Skeeter

  • glenster
  • King Solomon
    King Solomon

    Some Biblical scholars suspect an earlier version of the Abraham story had him follow through on his sacrifice of Isaac to YHWH; the offering of first-borns was an early practice amongst some cults, and even seen in:

    1.Leviticus 27:28-29 (NASB)

    Nevertheless, anything which a man sets apart to the LORD out of all that he has, of man or animal or of the fields of his own property, shall not be sold or redeemed. Anything devoted to destruction is most holy to the LORD. No one who may have been set apart among men shall be ransomed; he shall surely be put to death.

    2.Exodus 22:29-30

    You must give me the firstborn of your sons. Do the same with your cattle and your sheep. Let them stay with their mothers for seven days, but give them to me on the eighth day.

    (DONCHA JUST LOVE Exodus, lumping cattle and sheep with firstborn sons? And how MERCIFUL for mother and son to be given seven whole days together! Mothers, can't you see how YHWH TRULY is a Merciful God of LOVE? He GETS women, doesn't He?)

    There's a few references in the Bible where a character asks what he needs to do to atone for God finding displeasure in him (eg losing a battle against Canaanites), and offering up his first-born to prevent future defeat.

    And of course, there's the shining example of Jephthah's daughter (an only child; hmmm, maybe she actually had an older brother who was killed after 7 days?). She was murdered because her father promised God to offer up the first living thing that emerged from the house to welcome him home, after years away in battle; out she runs to greet her daddy with her tambourine! Ooops...

    (Jephthah didn't deserve to have his genes passed on, if only for making stupid vows. Of course, his subsequent murder prosecution is not mentioned, so he seemingly got away with violating "thou shalt not murder", since, after all, a man's word IS his word.)

    However, eliminating child sacrifice was on the "phase out" list of the redactors of the Torah, along with eliminating polytheism (eliminating false Gods), idolatry, snake worship, Asherah worship, etc.

    "King Manasseh and Child Sacrifice" by Franchesca Stavrakopoulou discusses infanticide and child sacrifice to Molek, YHWH.

  • Gros Michel no more
    Gros Michel no more

    Early Christians abolished this practice when they converted from pagan religons. No man could be a Christian who abandoned this child, no woman could remain a Christian that drank a herbal concoction or killed their child. Early Christianity who practiced what they preached, pricked the consciences of baby killers.

    A art teacher who passed away had taught "that Abraham's attempt to kill Isaac was the ending of child sacrifices to God". Abraham knew God could bring Isaac back to life, this issue has been a thorn even though Jehovah never intended for Abraham to kill Isaac. Jehovah's illustration of showing humans what he was going to put himself through, is beyond words. I am beyond grateful for the love he showed humanity by allowing Jesus to suffer for our sins at Calvary.

    The Old Testament does not condone baby killing, Moses Law did not leave behind detailed instructions for the pagan custom. Christians need to embrace the efforts, love and kind behaviour left behind for us to model ourselves with. Bertrand Russell wrote his theory how India gained it's independance from the U.K.. B.R. wrote that Gandi was able to push his movement that impacted the Christian conscienes of the Western world.

  • EntirelyPossible
    EntirelyPossible

    I am beyond grateful for the love he showed humanity by allowing Jesus to suffer for our sins at Calvary.

    And for love the showed when allowing:

    - rapists to marry their victims

    - slavery

    - owners to beat their slaves to death as long as the slave lingered on the edge of death a few days before they died

    - soldiers to rip babies from mother's wombs

    - fathers to sell their daughters into slavery

    Yep, one super kind, loving God there.

  • Balaamsass
    Balaamsass

    " Early Christians abolished this practice when they converted from pagan religons. No man could be a Christian who abandoned this child, no woman could remain a Christian that drank a herbal concoction or killed their child. Early Christianity who practiced what they preached, pricked the consciences of baby killers."

    WTBTS is so progressive. Shunning of minors. Protection of Pedophile identities. Refusing medical treatment for children. Education restrictions. All to honor "the true god" (Wasn't that what the Molech worshipers thought ?).

  • mP
    mP

    @Gros:

    Contrast the Romans with early christians who were accused of being cannibals, atheists, baby blood drinkers, harlots, witches. One example of the irrationality of the mob of Rome, comes from early writer Minucius Felix, a previous prosecutor, who converts to Christ.

    mP

    Xianity was a sect of Judaism. Read the battle which resulted in the final destryction of the temple in 70AD and you will also read that the Jews did eat their children while attempting to combat the Romans.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destruction_of_Jerusalem#Destruction_of_Jerusalem

    Josephus claims that 1,100,000 people were killed during the siege, of which a majority were Jewish, and that 97,000 were captured and enslaved, including Simon bar Giora and John of Giscala . [4]

    The gospels are a cruel joke aganst the jews. This explain shte nonsense that results in Jesus telling eveyrone to pay taxes and yet somehow condones slavery. The text also blames the jews for killing gods son even though the Romans actually were in charge. Also all Romans in the text are good and honourable, eg Cornelius, the centurion witness when Jesus was onthe cross and so on. The NT always paints Jews in less than favourable light while all Romans are fair, honest and never evil. Could the apostles Peter and John be stand in for the leaders aforementioned ? Could Judas Iscariot be a code for Judas Sicarrii and so on.. ?

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sicarii

    Sicarii (Latin plural of Sicarius 'dagger-men' or later contract-killer, Hebrew ????????) is a term applied, in the decades immediately preceding the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 CE , (probably) to an extremist splinter group [1] of the Jewish Zealots , who attempted to expel the Romans and their partisans from Judea using concealed daggers ( sicae ). [2]

  • Terry
    Terry

    Each society through history has its proprietary "legal" methods of ridding itself of unwanted children.

    It varies as to "how".

    Since January of 1973 abortion has been legal in this country.

    No society is 100% FOR or AGAINST anything.

    The adoption laws in this country make it a lot more difficult to acquire an unwanted child than it was in the Roman Empire, that's for certain.

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