Speaking their native language...

by Chalam 4 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Chalam
    Chalam

    Hello JWNers,

    It's been a while!

    I noticed there were a large number of people dressed in black making their way up the street where I live this morning.

    Either there was a funeral or else it was our turn to receive field service? I guessed probably the latter. A pre-Christmas campaign beginning this Dec 1st.

    I said a quick prayer and left it in the hands of Dad to see if I should speak to them. I have wasted enough time and effort in the past trying on my own and I can do nothing by myself. As it is, the JWs often pass my door as they do not like my message.

    As it was, the door bell did rang and sure enough, two older gentlemen were smartly dressed in their grey and black attire with broad smiles.

    They asked me about eternal life and I soon noted the familiar print of the WT in hand.

    He took me to Ephesians 2 and started speaking about having been dead in our sins and made alive.

    We soon started a discussion regarding the Holy Spirit and being "born from above, born again, a new creation" and such.

    He told me all this happens at the moment of belief. I was a little suprised as JWs do not believe in being born again and having the Spirit come and live inside them. I asked them to clarify exactly what happens when one believes? Once again, I was suprised what I was hearing and thus I genuinely because confused as to where these evangelists had come from. Momentarily, forgetting the WT print I seen I started to think maybe they we Mormons or something else?

    However, I soon remembered and I took them to John 6, verses 53 and 54 where Jesus taks about the life in you. He agreed with the scriptures and told me they had life?! However, I pointed out that clearly Jesus said unless you drink the wine and eat the break you have no life. I told them they had no life according to Jesus' words as they pass the emblems on. They told me it was for the annointed and they were "other sheep". I told them clearly Paul went to the other sheep, the Gentiles "first the Jew and then the Gentile".

    They soon left to "save" some others. I warned them to make sure they preach the correct gospel, and that according to Gal 1 Paul says anyone preaching another gospel is doubly cursed :(

    So, all in all, familiar well trod paths.

    As I contemplated this after they left, I remembered that when I woke up I was praying about an issue and the Spirit said Ephesians 2:18. I looked it up

    Ephesians 2:18

    English Standard Version (ESV)

    18 For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father.

    It made no sense at the time regarding what I was asking. However, it makes complete sense now and I totally missed it! It answers every question that was raised and speaks on each topic of discussion, as does the whole chapter.

    We both (Jew and Gentile) access the Father through the Spirit. No other access!

    We are made alive with Christ.

    We (the Gentiles) were formerly separated but now we are brought near through the blood of Christ.

    Jesus breaks down the wall between Jew and Gentile and brings us both peace. We access the Father throught the Spirit, not an orginisation, or by association with any other believer.

    Anyhow, I am sure they had something to talk about and I had left them with food for thought. However, I should have been more attentive and gone straight to verse 18.

    Hope you are all doing well :)

    Blessings,

    Stephen

  • designs
    designs

    Nice to see you and Perry are back counting your preaching time, must be the Christmas Season.

    Always fascinating on the approaches the two of you take. You usually include some threat as you did above- 'I warned them' 'doubly cursed'. Perry is more into the 'it happened to me therefore its true' experiential thingy.

  • Chariklo
    Chariklo

    Interesting post, Chalam!

    I enjoyed reading your encounter with the JW's.

    About accessing the Father through the Spirit...how would you feel if I suggested we pray to the Father through Christ, in the Spirit?

    Does that sit well with you?

  • Chalam
    Chalam

    Thanks Chariklo :)

    " About accessing the Father through the Spirit...how would you feel if I suggested we pray to the Father through Christ, in the Spirit?

    Does that sit well with you?"

    Yes, of course, no problem! In one sense, the Holy Spirit is Jesus. See John 14 for example.

    John 14:15-20

    English Standard Version (ESV)

    Jesus Promises the Holy Spirit

    15 “If you love me, you will keep my commandments. 16 And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Helper, to be with you forever, 17 even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him. You know him, for he dwells with you and will be in you.

    18 “I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19 Yet a little while and the world will see me no more, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20 In that day you will know that I am in my Father, and you in me, and I in you.

    Also here

    Galatians 4:6

    English Standard Version (ESV)

    6 And because you are sons, God has sent the Spirit of his Son into our hearts, crying, “Abba! Father!”

    Or indeed, Ephesians 2. We enter into the presence of the Father through Christ and the Holy Spirit, same difference.

    Here's the finaly thing to note, the Spirit of the Son is one and the same Spirit of the Father :)

    Romans 8:14-16

    English Standard Version (ESV)

    14 For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God. 15 For you did not receive the spirit of slavery to fall back into fear, but you have received the Spirit of adoption as sons, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!” 16 The Spirit himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,

    Blessings in Christ,

    Stephen

  • designs
    designs

    Its pack mentality and goes back to the earliest human communites (humans pre-date Adam and Eve by thousands of years). Want to feel special get a special moniker ie 'Born Again''sons of God' funny the NT does not say 'daughters of God'..

    'Religiosity confers benefits by riding on cultural values' Journal of Psychological Science.

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