Do you follow your " spirit directed " conscience and bible principles?

by DATA-DOG 9 Replies latest watchtower child-abuse

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  DATA-DOG

  Vincent Toole, solicitor for the Jehovah's Witnesses, said the fact that the church got working with children checks had nothing to do with Steven Unthank, whom he suggested was behind the court case. ''We find it disappointing that he continues to misrepresent our organisation.''.......

  ....''Jehovah's Witnesses abhor child abuse, and place the protection of children at the highest level,'' he said.

  http://news.ninemsn.com.au/national/2013/04/11/20/59/jehovah-s-witnesses-stay-in-line-on-abuse

  Jehovah's Witnesses say it is not their responsibility to report child sex abuse to police unless mandatory reporting legislation is in place.

  Jehovah's Witness legal counsel Rachel van Witsen said elders were not expected to know their legal obligations.

  "This is done to ensure elders fully comply with any legal requirements that may be applicable in the state in which they reside," she said.

  "In Victoria if there was mandatory reporting the immediate advice would be to report that immediately."

  The society's director Terrence O'Brien said the decision to take the allegations to police lay with the victim.

  "Without mandatory reporting we don't feel that as ministers of religion that's our obligation to do that," Mr O'Brien said.

  All of this made me think about an often used example in public talks about " Bible principles." Jehovah's Witnesses claim to be led by bible principles, and not ridgid rules, or a list of do's and dont's. This was stressed in a recent Watchtower article, as well as the Safeguard Your Conscience special assembly.

  This means that one of Jehovah's Witnesses would follow the priciples in the Bible even when no law existed, or in opposition to a law that violated Bible principles. This decision would be made by the individual's " spirit directed " conscience. Think of Joseph and Potiphar's wife. Did Joseph say, " I would gladly refrain from sleeping with Potiphar's wife if Egyptian law made it mandatory."

  Here is the often used example that I have heard in talks given by Circuit Overseers:

  You are driving through a neighborhood. The posted speed-limit is 35 mph. You have the legal right to travel at 35 mph. As you pass through the neigborhood, you see that both sides of the street have children playing. The are riding bikes, playing catch, having fun, but not really paying attention as children can fail to do. The streets are narrow, and there is not much of a shoulder for the children. Where are the parents? Why are there so many children playing near the edge of the road?

  What do you do? The speed limit is 35 mph. It is your legal right to travel at that speed. You cannot be faulted for going the speed limit. It is the parent's responsibility to look after their children.

  So, do you insist on your personal right to travel at 35 mph, insisting that the parents and children should know better, or do follow the Bible priciple of loving your fellow man, and slow down to protect the children? Bible principles are always superior to laws...

  The society's director Terrence O'Brien said the decision to take the allegations to police lay with the victim.

  "Without mandatory reporting we don't feel that as ministers of religion that's our obligation to do that," Mr O'Brien said.

  Peace,

  DD
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  thecrushed

  very good points. you have hanged them on their own words.
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  Phizzy

  It matters not what the Legal position is as regards reporting, "Bible Principles" and just plain old homespun Morals demand that you do the best for victims.

  Was there a Legal obligation on the Good Samaritan to help the Jewish victim of an attack ? no, but so the WT advice to the Samaritan would be "walk by on the other side".

  As I said on another thread, now when people ask me why I am no longer a JW, which in my locality comes up frequently because I was so well known as one, I shall reply:

  " In all conscience I could no longer belong to an Organization that has no morals".
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  DATA-DOG
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  sd-7

  The laws of the land really only matter to the Society so far as it becomes a matter of legal liability. 'Bible principles' really only means 'Watchtower law'. And since WT already had its own rules for the elders about this, they're going to stop there and not question whether it's the right thing to call the police in cases of molestation.

  I mean, we're talking about the same people who were teaching well into the 20th century that rape is fornication. How much can you really expect from them?

  --sd-7
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  villagegirl

  sd-7 You are right. The WT will lie,cheat and steal, if they think they

  can get away with it. The only time they show any moral character

  is when they are threatened with law suits. Anyone,

  a teacher, a day care provider, a neighbor, anyone who observes

  or knows of a crime, is under obligation to report the crime.

  What if your neighbor told you they murdered someone and showed

  you where they buried the body in the back yard ?

  If you do not report the crime, you are an

  accessory to the crime. You in effect give assitance

  to the perpetrator of the crime, even

  though you were not present at the crime.

  This is Basic International Law 101.
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  yadda yadda 2

  I've never heard JW's use the phrase "spirit-directed" conscience before, rather they often say "Bible-trained" conscience. But otherwise you make an excellent point - They claim to follow principles of conscience over rigid adherence to rules, but when it comes to the two-witness rule in scripture, they do it the other way around.

  Jesus himself made it clear to the Pharisees that divine principles were more important then rigid, legalistic adherence to the letter of the law. It's called squeezing out the gnat and gulping down the camel, which JW's are grossly guilty of in the matters of child abuse and blood transfusions. The apostle Paul also made a similar point, saying the spirit gives life but the letter of the law kills.
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  return of parakeet

  "'Without mandatory reporting we don't feel that as ministers of religion that's our obligation to do that,' Mr O'Brien said."

  Translation: "We'll damn you for growing a beard, but if you molest a kid, you're okay. Just be sure to terrify the kid enough so he/she won't say anything."

  Cowards, hypocrites, and liars.

  How can any dub read that and still think the dubs have the "Truth"?
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  DATA-DOG

  Yadda,Yadda said, " I've never heard JW's use the phrase "spirit-directed" conscience before, rather they often say "Bible-trained" conscience. But otherwise you make an excellent point ."

  I know " spirit directed " is odd, but that was the specific wording used many times. So if you are being led by God's Spirit, you are a son of God. I sure they writers of the outine did not think that far ahead....
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  cha ching

  (Matthew 23:23-28) 23 "Woe to YOU, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!

  because YOU give the tenth of the mint and the dill and the cumin,

  (don't chew gum, don't wear jeans to Bethel, wear your badges after assemblies)

  but YOU have disregarded the weightier matters of the Law, namely, justiceand mercy and faithfulness.

  (and children's lives)

  These things it was binding to do, yet not to disregard the other things.

  24 Blind guides, who strain out the gnat, but gulp down the camel!25 (and hurt the children)

  "Woe to YOU, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites!

  because YOU cleanse the outside of the cup and of the dish,

  but inside they are full of plunder and immoderateness. (and plenty of legalistic writing.. "It's parents that have the duty, not us")

  26 Blind Pharisee, cleanse first the inside of the cup and of the dish, that the outside of it also may become clean.

  27 "Woe to YOU, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because YOU resemble whitewashed graves, (great pressed suits and ties)

  which outwardly indeed appear beautiful (look at those beautiful assemly halls, the "Stanley Theatre")

  but inside are full of dead men’s bones and of every sort of uncleanness. (pedophiles, court cases, gag orders)

  28 In that way YOU also, outwardly indeed, appear righteous to men, ( "we hate pedophilia" )

  but inside YOU are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.... ( & lawyers, lots and lots of lawyers)

  and sad, sad, hurt children........