"Look at the Fruits" Says the Watchtower

by stevieb1 4 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  stevieb1

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  We know how much in the way of doctrine is Scripturally deficient in the WatchTower organization, but they will always come back and say something on the following lines:
  * Look at the fruit of our works. Millions are coming to an accurate knowledge about Jehovah who would never get to know Him where it not for our preaching activities carried out worldwide. Which other organization does this on such a large scale? Yes some doctrines may be inaccurate, and we "wait on Jehovah" to clarify these matters, but just look at the fruitage - surely this indicates Jehovah's blessing on his organization.

  * We are the only people who truly love one another no matter where we are from. Other religionists kill one another, but we would never do that. Surely this indicates that we have the truth.

  * We are the only ones that stress the importance of God's Name

  * Who else is preaching the good news of God's Kingdom - only Jehovah's Witnesses.

  When I have voiced disagreements on matters such as the 144,000/great crowd or the 607BCE issue, JW's generally discard these things as minor matters in comparison to some of the above. Sometimes they seem so convinced that I almost find myself believing they do have the truth and they do have God's blessing. Some of the above are quite hard to refute. Has anyone else had a similar issue with the above? How have you responded when an elder or another Witness brings these things up?
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  Carmel

  Steve,

  I havn't had the dubious pleasure of engaging an elder with these inane claims but I can tell you 1. is not true, 2. is not true and 3. is not true. I happen to have left the JWs many years ago and after the decade or so of agnostacy and searching feel I not belong to a very loving group that is more widely spread around the world than the Dubs, shows more tolerance and love for each other and for the rest of humanity than the dubs could ever conceive as well as recognize that the names of God are numerous and exalted, therefor not limited to one ill-translated old testament approximation of the name of God and are eager to share the "real" good news that we are all His children and salvation is not only on a personal level but on a societal level. We not only believe that as a doctrin of faith, but are actively involved in most all aspects and features of building a new world order from the bottom up.

  If any elder ever wanted to hear what would challange his notions of what has been brainwashed into his cranium, I'd be happy to study with him/them to show the evidence of my assertions.

  have a good day Steve!

  carmel
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  Xander

  Interesting thread, but you are forgetting:

  some doctrines may be inaccurate, and we "wait on Jehovah" to clarify these matters
  That's right - you BETTER wait. 'Running ahead of the organization' gets you kicked out. Even if it saves your life. Get an organ transplant in 1960? DFed. Get an organ transplant in 1980? No problem! - BUT, do you think they re-instated everyone they DFed for accepting one? HA!

  surely this indicates Jehovah's blessing on his organization.
  What, that they regularly change their intepretation of 'key' prophetic events?

  truly love one another no matter where we are from
  Uhhh....RIIIIIIGHT...that's not even true. Let alone what happens if someone dare QUESTION the org. Suddenly they stop 'loving' you.

  we would never do that
  So, not killing others is a hallmark of the true religion? HURRAY FOR BUDDHISM!!

  are the only ones that stress the importance of God's Name
  God's name, as they interpret it and stole it for their own banner. That's like Sprint Telecom proclaiming "Only WE stress the importance of the name Sprint!". Uhhhh.....riiiiight.......

  preaching the good news of God's Kingdom
  GOOD NEWS??? That everyone alive on Earth but a select few will be annihilated? That, then, the survivors have the privelege of living imprisoned on Earth by a god who demands exlusive devotion, frequent worship, and your entire thought processes all the time? (regulating things such as your sex life, recreational substance use, hell, even what is 'okay' recreation!)

  Xander F
  (Unseen Apostate Directorate of North America - Ohio order)

  A fanatic is one who, upon losing sight of his goals, redoubles his efforts.
  --George Santayana
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  Yerusalyim

  Respond with,
  I've read of numerous cases of JW's committing Murder or rape or guilty of pedophilia. If the JW"s did not forbid military service under pain of Disfellowshipping, the JW's would be in the same boat as everyone else.

  The JW's are the only ones preaching the Gospel? Tell that to the 31 Catholic Missionaries martyred for the faith in 2001 alone.

  The importance of God's name? How about the inappropriate and vain use of God's divine name. The Commandment most properly reads "You shall not use the Name of YHWH your God for vain purposes." To use God's divine name a symbol of how spiritually fit you are is VAIN!

  Fruits? Where are the hospitals, where are the soup kitchens, where are the JW's caring for widows and orphans, where are the JW Charities.

  That is a proper response the the JW nonsense just presented.

  YERUSALYIM
  "Vanity! It's my favorite sin!"
  [Al Pacino as Satan, in "DEVIL'S ADVOCATE"]
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  jst2laws

  Stevie,
  I can remember trying to answer these questions when I ran into a locally notorious apostate in my territory a few years ago. I ran a barrage of questions by him he did not effectively answer for me. Now it is my turn to try in brief to answer them for myself.

  * Look at the fruit of our works. Millions are coming to an accurate knowledge about Jehovah who would never get to know Him where it not for our preaching activities carried out worldwide

  How can anyone speak of an ‘accurate knowledge about Jehovah’ if even the WT society can not point to any evidence that we know ‘accurately’ that his name is “Jehovah”? If God wanted us to know Him as the God of the Hebrew named “Jehovah” wouldn’t he have left us certain evidence of how to even pronounce the name? If it is ‘accurate’ why is there no evidence that ANYONE can point at to show Jesus once uttered the Hebrew divine name? Not once is the tetragramaton in any ancient copy of the Christian scriptures. Perhaps Jesus was teaching us to get to ‘know him’ as our Loving Father rather than the old revelation of a jealous, vindictive God as He appeared to the Jews?

  As to “look at the fruit”, what did they say when the numbers dropped in 2000? ‘God is not impressed with numbers’.

  * We are the only people who truly love one another no matter where we are from. Other religionists kill one another, but we would never do that. Surely this indicates that we have the truth.

  Is it true love? Unconditional love? Are we not to love ‘our enemies’. How do the witness show love for their ultimate enemies, friends and relatives who differ with their teachings? There are many other international organizations who show the same kind of support and conditional love for those who stay within the program. Like the Witnesses they are known as cults.
  

  We are the only ones that stress the importance of God's Name

  Big clue (see above). To go back to the Hebrew scriptures and try to resurrect the lost name of the God of a system that was only designed to ‘make sins manifest’ is not Christianity, its is Judaic (Gal 3:19).
  

  Who else is preaching the good news of God's Kingdom - only Jehovah's Witnesses.

  Yes, the Good News of the Kingdom must be preached according to Matt. 24:14. Why though after Philip does not one Bible writer mention the “good news of the kingdom”? They do preach a good news, mentioned over 100 times in the Christian scriptures (compared to about 9 ref to the ‘good news of the kingdom’). Whatever they preached it was the good news that fulfilled the prophesy. But it is a good news of which my witnesses brothers know nothing. That is a story of its own.
  Jst2laws