"You will always have the poor among you, but you will not always have me." - John 12:8
How is this compatible with the notion of a future paradise on earth, [end of history] where the poverty will be eliminated forever?
Comments, anyone?
Eden
"you will always have the poor with you" - John 12:8
by EdenOne 8 Replies latest watchtower bible
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TJ Curioso
I think this don't have anything to do about the future alteration of conditions on the earth.
It was only a expression that implies that the disciples must help and do something for the poors in need.
We know that JW don't anything of this, right? ;)
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mP
As always all religions are obsessed with a figure who wants to be king or remain king. The weak and poor are by products often ignored when they really need help. jesus is just another areshole in the long line of aresholes wanting others to be his servants so he can be king and damned be all who actually need help.
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WTWizard
They will always have the poor with them as long as they prevent them from getting any money. Spending money on things that give negative value is worse than a waste of money. You are actually programming your soul that money is bad. This happens when you waste money on suit dry cleanings, gas for field circus, and Worldwide Pedophile Defense Fund donations. Keep spending money on that, and your soul will soon be programmed to shut down access to money.
Another sure way to keep them poor is to always be negative about earning money. They can't work because something is against their doctrines. They can't work late because of the boasting sessions, and must take time off for field circus or a$$emblies. They can't invest in anything--paper or hard assets. They get hounded if they try and invest in silver or gold. And what little they do manage to make is wasted in theocraptic activities or donations.
Keeping them from enjoying their wealth also prevents their souls from attracting any. They cannot buy anything nice, so they simply stagnate. They are supposed to be content with the present things, ensuring they will remain poor. No wonder they claim the poor will always be with them--they will be as long as they are programmed by joke-hova to remain that way.
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fresh prince of ohio
It is apparent, evident, and likely, that by "always" Jesus meant [insert deep-fried Watchtower BS here]
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tec
Christ is still with us also. He just is not here in the flesh, in this world. In this world, we will always have the poor with us.
But this story is about what Mary did, out of love and faith for Christ. He defended and blessed her, rather than allow her to be rebuked. Mary was doing something that she would only have this one opportunity to do, and she did it out of love for Him. He would not allow her to be rebuked for that.
It certainly does not mean that He did not want people to give to the poor; and He, Himself, served the poor. Feeding, healing, working to free them from the chains bearing them down.
Peace,
tammy
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EdenOne
Still, how is the notion that there will "always" be poor people compatible with the WT-promoted idea that there will be a PARADISE on EARTH ?
I would like to see if someone can try to reconcile both ideas.
Eden
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prologos
context seems to show that it is ok do do special favors like giving a away a year's income to a favored cause.
did the bible writer make a statement to have eternal meanings? perhaps.
Think of a paradise parasitic dweller that wants to be rich by saving.
let him put away just one penny,- or the non-monetary equivalent --, every million years, without even getting near eternity, he/she would have horded all the copper in the universe, a trace element vital for life, certainly in the tree of life.so
in paradise there will be no super rich, creating a deprived, poor class.
no under-motivated individuals either, they all died at the A for neglecting their duty ------.
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Band on the Run
I don't believe this story is about Magdalene. Altho on it surface it may appear so to unschooled readers. Jesus' response to poverty was radical. He sought out the poor over and over again. The poor did not sin and, therefore, were poor. Jesus always focused on the now and the future. I suspect that is why some of his sayings are weasal worded. To read the obvious lesson relating to Mary and the oil is to ignore the rest of the gospel.
Jesus demanded his disciples act now. They were to provide for the poor as an act of Christian commitment. Elaine Pagels reveals that one of the earliest accounts of Christians not treated as criminals against humanity was their actions during plague times. Christians voluntaril stayed and nursed all the sick, regardless of Christian religion. Romans wrote moving accounts of this heroism. It did a lot to counter the notion that eucharist was time of incest and cannibalism.
The anointing with oil is a kingship/messianic trigger. To read Jesus superficially is sad. Note the same refrains in the Sermon on the Mount.
Jesus is an equal opportunity guest. He dines with the wealthy and poor. Personally, I feel that Judas had good instincts. This anointing runs counter to most of Jesus sayings. For example, after the feeding of the multitudes he orders his disciples to gather the remaining fish and loaves so there will be no waste. This is a one time anointing. Besides, did it truly happen? It legitimizes Jesus as notable. A son of God.
It is late when the gospels are written. Theology is beginning to matter. No incident reported is casual. Do you realize that only a small fraction of what Jesus said and did could ever be in the gospels.
I find the present day "prosperity gospels" of Joyce Meyer and Joel Osteen to be totally against scripture and tradition. It might be practical advice but clothed with scriptural authority it is not.