Anyone knows why Matthew 11:12 is translated so differently in NWT

by never a jw 7 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  never a jw

  New World Translation Version II:

  "From the days of John the Baptist until now, the Kingdom of the heavens is the goal toward which men press, and those pressing forward are seizing it"

  New International Version:

  From the days of John the Baptist until now, the kingdom of heaven has been subjected to violence, [ d ] and violent people have been raiding it.

  Who is wrong? I think I can guess the answer to this question based on their record, but is there a person here that can offer some light on the subject. Thanks!
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  KateWild

  That's interesting-completely different meanings.

  JWs are always told to put God's Kingdom first in their lives. Using this scripture in the NNWT, will help the GB emphasize the urgency and seriousness of going door knocking instead of filling spare time with fun and rest. IMO

  Kate xx
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  mind blown

  bookmarked and interesting
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  RobCrompton

  Which edition of NIV are you using? Mine (1985 study edition) has "... kingdom of heaven has been forcefully advancing and forceful men lay hold of it."

  Zerwickand Grosvenor's "Grammatical Analysis of the Greek NT" (a must-have for wannabe translators) gives this note on the verse: "Biazomai... use force, force one's way... suffer violence, here as in (Luke 16:16) it isdisputed whether this force is to be understood as hostile or praiseworthy."

  This is one of those instances where the translator has to make a judgement about the likely intended meaning. So I don't think the NWT can be criticised for their rendering. Other translations give the same sense to the verse.
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  never a jw

  Thanks Rob. I am using the Bible translation in jw.org

  At least there is no flagrant mistranslation as in 1 Samuel 28:12-20 (notice the added quotation marks around Samuel)

  When the woman saw “Samuel,”*+ she cried out at the top of her voice and said to Saul: “Why did you trick me? You are Saul!” 13 The king said to her: “Do not be afraid, but what do you see?” The woman replied to Saul: “I see one like a god coming up out of the earth.” 14 At once he asked her: “What does he look like?” to which she said: “It is an old man coming up, and he is clothed in a sleeveless coat.”+ At that Saul realized that it was “Samuel,” and he bowed low with his face to the ground and prostrated himself. 15 Then “Samuel” said to Saul: “Why have you disturbed me by having me brought up?” Saul replied: “I am in great trouble. The Phi·lis′tines are fighting against me, and God has departed from me and no longer answers me, either through the prophets or in dreams;+ so that is why I am calling on you to let me know what I should do.”+ 16 And “Samuel” said: “Why do you inquire of me now that Jehovah has departed from you+ and has become your adversary? 17 Jehovah will do for himself what he foretold through me: Jehovah will rip the kingdom out of your hands and give it to one of your fellow men, David.+ 18 Because you did not obey the voice of Jehovah and you did not execute his burning anger against the A·mal′ek·ites,+ that is why Jehovah is doing this to you this day. 19 Jehovah will also give both Israel and you into the hand of the Phi·lis′tines,+ and tomorrow you+ and your sons+ will be with me. Jehovah will also give the army of Israel into the hands of the Phi·lis′tines.”+ 20 At once Saul fell full length on the ground and became very much afraid because of “Samuel’s” words.
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  RobCrompton

  Interesting one. I can see that there could be some justification for using quotes around "Samuel" on the grouds that what is seen is a ghost, a disembodied spirit, or an apparition.

  To the ancient mind, though, the ghost or whatever is genuinely Samuel himself, whereas to the JW reader it has to be a demon in the shape of Samuel. So the quotes which the NWT use nudge the JW reader towards an interpretation of the story which would not have been in the mind of the writer. Hmmm, this could open up a long discussion about how narratives convey meaning, and convey different meanings in different contexts and cultures.
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  never a jw

  Rob,
  i just read your question again. You were asking about the version of NIV, not NWT. I am using a website (biblegateway.com), so I don't know what version it is.

  Yes I agree. I very strongly doubt that the writers of ancient times (between 2,600 and 3,000 years ago) meant anything other than what is written. Irony and sarcasm are features of much later times.
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  RobCrompton

  It appears that the version you quoted from is the 2011 edtion. I'm not sure why the translators decided to go with this very different rendering in the new edition, which doesn't seem to me to fit with the idea of "from the days of John the Baptist..." Now if it had been "from the days of John Hyrcanus..." that would be different - Hyrcanus being the Maccabean leader who established the Hasmonean dynasty. That is, the kings following the restoration of the monarchy were not legitimate heirs of the Davidic dynasty.

  Now you've set me off wondering whether there might have been an earlier, very different saying underlying what has come to us in Matthew 11:12 because the 2011 rendering would seem to reflect the attitude that the leaders of Judaism at the time of Jesus were illegitimate and due to give way to Messiah, the rightful king.