May Jehovah rebuke you

by Londo111 6 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • Londo111
    Londo111

    8 Despite this, these men too are indulging in dreams, defiling the flesh, despising authority, and speaking abusively of glorious ones. 9 But when Mi′cha·el the archangel had a difference with the Devil and was disputing about Moses’ body, he did not dare to bring a judgment against him in abusive terms, but said: “May Jehovah rebuke you.”

    The Watchtower uses this passage in Jude against its critics, and applies the term “glorious ones” toward those in the Watchtower Hierarchy.

    However, a little research will uncover that these “glorious ones” are as some translations say, not human religious leaders, but “angelic majesties.” The word for ‘speaking abusively’ is blasphēmeō which means to “speak reproachfully, rail at, revile, calumniate, blaspheme”.

    Similarly, “bring a judgment against him in abusive terms”, a similar word blasphēmia arises, which means slander, detraction, speech injurious, to another's good name’.

    Here Jude contrasts those who thought so much of themselves, likely Gnostics, so as to blaspheme angels, to the Archangel Michael’s approach toward the Devil. He said, “May Jehovah rebuke you.” Note that Michael’s desire that the Devil be rebuked by God, thereby not thinking the Devil above rebuke, he simply did not speak slanderously or in an uncontrolled manner. The word rebuke is epitimaō and means:

    * to adjudge, award, in the sense of merited penalty

    * to tax with fault, rate, chide, rebuke, reprove, censure severely

    * to admonish or charge sharply

    Actually, in the Greek, it is not, “MAY the Lord rebuke you”, but “The Lord rebuke you.” There is no may about it. The Devil was in the wrong and Michael called him out on it.

    Therefore, it is not wrong in pointing out the evils of a religious organization or the leadership. In fact, the Watchtower has a history of doing this themselves, condemning other religious groups in the strongest of terms and dredging up against them every fault they can find. Or take the recent District Convention where they railed against the Apostate Boogeyman. Much of this borders on hate speech if not actually is. Therefore, the Watchtower has a habit of speaking abusively on individuals who they do not agree with. They could well learn the point that Jude was trying to make.

    The Watchtower is not above criticism. An honest examination of Watchtower history and teachings reveal many points to dispute with them about, just like Michael disputed with the Devil. Obviously, we must think about our approach in such a dispute.

    However, it is not wrong for us to say, “Jehovah rebuke you, Watchtower. Jehovah rebuke you, Governing Body.”

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  • Londo111
    Londo111

    That reminds me of a joke I heard and posted on another thread:

    One day 3 people showed up at the pearly gates of heaven, a nun, a Christian and a GB member of WTBTS.

    Well, Jehovah asks each one , why do you think you should get in to heaven?

    The nun answers, well I helped the poor and served at many hospitals to help the sick. God says, ok you’r in.

    The Christian says, I help my brothers love one another and put faith in Christ’s love for us. God says , you’r in.

    The GB member says, hey, you are in my spot!

  • LongHairGal
    LongHairGal

    I remember many years ago when I was in my first congregation there was a man who, in conversation, said he uttered these words to somebody who was disagreeable to him out in service. He sounded pretty pleased with himself. Another brother present then told him he was not to use the name as a curse or threat to anybody.

    I wondered at the time if some JWs viewed Jehovah as their personal hit-man.

  • Cold Steel
    Cold Steel

    How these guys fit scripture to themselves is amazing. Also, if Michael is Jesus, he would hardly need Yahweh's assistance in rebuking Satan. Clearly the early Christians believed that Jesus is the incarnation of Yahweh, not that Jesus was the incarnation of Michael.

    So why did Michael not "dare" to bring a judgment against Satan? Because it was not his place.

    One scholar notes:

    Commentators assume, and it surely must have been so, that Jude had before him and was quoting from a then current apocryphal book, The Assumption of Moses, which has been preserved to us in fragmentary form only. This non-canonical work presents the doctrine that Moses was translated and taken up into heaven without tasting death. It appears to deal "with certain revelations made by Moses," and "with his disappearance in a cloud, so that his death was hid from human sight... Michael was commissioned to bury Moses. Satan opposed the burial on the ground (a) that he was the lord of matter and that accordingly the body should be rightfully handed over to him; (b) that Moses was a murderer, having slain the Egyptian. Michael having rebutted Satan's accusations proceeded to charge Satan with having instigated the serpent to tempt Eve. Finally, all opposition having been overcome, the assumption took place in the presence of Joshua and Caleb." Another "Hebrew Apocalypse tells of Moses' transformation into the form of a fiery angel and his ascent through the seven heavens." And yet another deals "with the temporary translation of Moses before his death into heaven... When translated into heaven the heavenly Jerusalem and the Temple were revealed to him, and he was told these would descend to earth after God had gathered Israel a second time from the ends of the earth." Included in these same works are a number of statements not found in the Bible.... "Moses was prepared from the foundation of the world to be the mediator of God's covenant with his people," and that "during his 'life Moses was Israel's intercessor with God." (R. H. Charles, The Apocrypha and Pseudepigrapha of the Old Testament, vol. 2, pp. 407-413.)

    Satan's title is that of "accuser" and if the above is true, he brought accusations against Moses and Michael defended him. His only charge against Satan was in relation to instigating the serpent into tempting Eve. But he had no part in deciding whether Moses was translated or buried. Thus, it wasn't for fear of Satan that Michael "durst" not bring judgment against him, but respect for Yahweh's position of authority in judging the matter. Satan was the prosecution and Michael was merely the defense; he was not the judge. Thus, there is quite a bit of confusion over this matter. But it's also true that the scripture in Jude clearly was in reference to those who were rebellious and accusing of church leaders at the time.

    If the Governing Body of Jehovah's Witnesses is the formal mouthpiece of God, and that they were somehow chosen and ordained by God into their present positions, then many of you, and me as well, are wrong to criticize them and to rail against them. But if they are not chosen, called and ordained by God, then GB members are false prophets, false teachers and antichrists. It's most likely better to be a false teacher than a false prophet, because the latter claims he is speaking for God, but the former only teaches what he believes, taking not the honor of representing God unto themselves.

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  • watson
    watson

    All Jehovah's Witnesses view Jehovah as their person hit man.

  • yadda yadda 2
    yadda yadda 2

    Christians follow Christ's example who denounce religious hypocrisy and religious leaders who abuse the flock.

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