Was Jesus the Nazarene The Messiah / Promised in The Hebrew Scriptures?

by objectivetruth 6 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • objectivetruth
    objectivetruth

    In seeking Truth, and Removing Untruth, Often more is Removed then ever initially Imagined Possible.

    Christianity, Claims That Jesus Was & Is The Messiah. This claim is primarily based on the Writings of The Greek Scriptures.

    Throughout history, God has given signs to People, in order for them to Believe. Never has he become upset with an Individual asking for a Sign.. Some individuals such as Moses asked for Multiple Signs. With this in Mind, it s clear that God does not fault us for Expecting Proof.

    There is Modern Day Proof to Support the Reliability of the Hebrew Scriptures (Namely The Re-Establishment of Israel After "2,520" Years.), however where is the Proof To Support the Greek Scriptures? Outside of the Apparent Accuracy Of Matthew 24:2 and the destruction of the Temple, I am not aware of Proof, for its Trust Worthiness.

    With this in Mind..

    If someone only had the Hebrew Bible in their Posession, they would conclude that The Messiah has not yet Come.

    An Example of Individuals who only had the Hebrew Bible were Jesus' Followers.. At Acts 1:6 this is Very Clear " "Lord, are you at this time going to restore the kingdom to Israel?"

    They would have been considering a Messianic Scripture such as Jer 23:5 " Behold, the days are coming, declares the LORD, when I will raise up for David a righteous Branch, and he shall reign as king and deal wisely, and shall execute justice and righteousness in the land." - Jesus followers were expecting a King who would Establish Israel as the Kingdom of The World, which Peace and Truth would go forth From.

    Without posting all of the Scriptures Which Jesus did not Fulfill, I'm interested to hear some views on "The Second Coming" discussed in The Hebrew Scriptures.. I'm interested to hear some views on The Validity of the Greek Scriptures.

  • HowTheBibleWasCreated
    HowTheBibleWasCreated

    Since Jesus as a cosmic 'god' was preached by Philo and other in the first century and Josephus records the Ebionites as being excentric why are YOU following after myths?

    The second coming came about after the destruction of the temple in 70CE

    There never was a historical Jesus... i used to think so.. but based on Philo and Josephus I say no... ... no one knew of a Jesus.

  • Crazyguy
    Crazyguy

    The Jews never and still don't believe in Jesus was the Messiah. One major problem is his heritage, according to scripture hes was not to be from the house of David for David's ancestors were cursed. Even if one removes this curse he was supposed to come through Solomon and yet he comes through Nathan. But I agree more with the last post, there never was a Jesus and not even Josephus who many claim mentions Jesus said in his writings that Vespasian was the messiah..One last thing to think about, why is the so many discrepancies about Jesus in the 4 gospel, one example being that one gospel said he was born in Bethlehem and another said he came from Galilee?

  • Doug Mason
    Doug Mason

    If life were only so simple.

    The people who accepted that Jesus (Yeshua) was indeed the promised Messiah - people such as Peter, Paul, Matthew and John - were Jews.

    It is always so simple to lump people into pigeon-holes, making a homogenous pie when there are many many separate parts. Take the modern concept of "Christians". This term encompasses the broadest range of ideas and ideals. This was also true of Israelites in the times of the NT Scriptures that they wrote. While many were expecting a warrior-king who would destroy their enemies, others were expecting a human/divine being. There were many at the time claiming to be the promised Messiah, and the question that people asked was: "Is this One the Promised Messiah?" Some Israelites did, and through the perspective of subsequent history, notably the prism of the third century, we view some Israelites as "Jews" and some Israelites as "Christians".

    Those Israelites who did accept that the anticipated Messiah (Mesach/Christ) would be a divine/human based their beliefs on the imagery of Daniel 7.

    The following is written by a Jewish scholar.

    Doug

    ==================

    Being religiously Jewish then was a much more complicated affair than it is even now. There were no Rabbis yet, and even the priests in Jerusalem and around the countryside were divided among themselves. Not only that, but there were many Jews both in Palestine and outside of it, in places such as Alexandria in Egypt, who had very different ideas about what being a good, devout Jew meant. Some believed that in order to be a kosher Jew you had to believe in a single divine figure and any other belief was simply idol worship. Others believed that God had a divine deputy or emissary or even son, exalted above all the angels, who functioned as an intermediary between God and the world in creation, revelation, and redemption. Many Jews believed that redemption was going to be effected by a human being, an actual hidden scion of the house of David—an Anastasia—who at a certain point would take up the scepter and the sword, defeat Israel's enemies, and return her to her former glory. Others believed that the redemption was going to be effected by that same second divine figure mentioned above and not a human being at all. And still others believed that these two were one and the same, that the Messiah of David would be the divine Redeemer. As I said, a complicated affair. …

    Christ too—the divine Messiah—is a Jew. Christology, or the early ideas about Christ, is also a Jewish discourse and not—until much later—an anti-Jewish discourse at all. Many Israelites at the time of Jesus were expecting a Messiah who would be divine and come to earth in the form of a human. Thus the basic underlying thoughts from which both the Trinity and the incarnation grew are there in the very world into which Jesus was born and in which he was first written about in the Gospels of Mark and John. ...

    Almost everyone recognizes that the historical Jesus was a Jew who followed ancient Jewish ways. There is also growing recognition that the Gospels themselves and even the letters of Paul are part and parcel of the religion of the People of Israel in the first century A.D. What is less recognized is to what extent the ideas surrounding what we call Christology, the story of Jesus as the divinehuman Messiah, were also part (if not parcel) of Jewish diversity at this time.

    The Gospels themselves, when read in the context of other Jewish texts of their times, reveal this very complex diversity and attachment to other variants of "Judaism" at the time. There are traits that bind the Gospel of Matthew to one strain of first-century "Judaism" while other traits bind the Gospel of John to other strains. The same goes for Mark, and even for Luke, which is generally considered the "least Jewish" of the Gospels. (“The Jewish Gospels: The Story of the Jewish Christ”, by Daniel Boyarin, pages 5-6, 22)

  • NAVYTOWN
    NAVYTOWN

    There is no Messiah, Jewish or Christian. No Big Daddy in the Sky is going to come solve all our problems. The Hebrew and the Greek Scriptures are outdated myths. Come up to Present Time and live your life NOW. Stop obsessing about things that were written thousands of years ago by primitive people.

  • Phizzy
    Phizzy

    " I'm interested to hear some views on The Validity of the Greek Scriptures." I presume you mean as to truly identifying Jesus of Nazareth as the Messiah ?

    The Gospel of "Matthew" makes a very bad job of twisting prophecies from the Hebrew Scriptures and making them seem to fit Jesus, Luke fabricates events to make Jesus' life seem to fit, and so on, so no they are not "valid". They are 99% poor fiction.

  • Doug Mason
    Doug Mason

    Even though the myths were created by the Israelites in the distant past, they are relevant today because current communities perpetuate them and feel bound by them. Therefore understanding that past helps us as we thread our lives through modern society.

    Learn the lessons that history teaches so that its errors are not repeated. Identifying previous strategies, myths, propaganda, and such helps to prepare us for similar facets of life today.

    The lesson that history teaches is that people do not learn the lesson that history teaches.

    Understand the history that forced Christianity to become a European religion, stripped away from its Middle Eastern roots.

    Doug

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit