Who the Great Crowd Are Baptized To

by lambsbottom 8 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • lambsbottom
    lambsbottom

    I just want to get this right:

    Great Crowd JWs are not baptized like the Annointed are. The Great Crowd's baptism does not wash them of their sins, making them sinless, until way after Armageddon (1,000 year rule). But the Annointed ARE washed of their sins being 'sinless', as the recent WT study stated. So what is the point of the Great Crowd in getting baptized? They are getting baptized, not to get salvation through Jesus, but to ally themselves with the Annointed. Remember, as the recent WT stated, supporting the Annointed is how one makes it through Armageddon.

    So, the Great Crowd is really baptized into their mediator, the Annointed JWs.

  • leaving_quietly
    leaving_quietly

    The Great Crowd only know the baptism of John, not the baptism of Christ.

    From the Insight book:

    Further understanding of the meaning of John’s baptism is gained by comparing various translations of Luke 3:3. John came “preaching baptism in symbol of repentance for forgiveness of sins” (NW); “baptism conditioned on repentance” (CB); “baptism whereby men repented, to have their sins forgiven” (Kx); “baptism in token of repentance for the forgiveness of sins” (NE); “Turn away from your sins and be baptized, and God will forgive your sins” (TEV). These renderings make plain that the baptism did not wash away their sins, but the repentance and changing of their ways did, and of this, baptism was a symbol.

    The baptism performed by John was therefore not a special cleansing from God through his servant John, but a public demonstration and symbol of the individual’s repentance over his sins against the Law, which was to lead them to Christ. (Ga 3:24) John thereby prepared a people to “see the saving means of God.” (Lu 3:6) His work served to “get ready for Jehovah a prepared people.” (Lu 1:16, 17) Such a work had been prophesied by Isaiah and Malachi.—Isa 40:3-5; Mal 4:5, 6.

    And this, regarding being baptized into Christ:

    The faithful apostles of Jesus Christ were baptized in water by John’s baptism. (Joh 1:35-37; 4:1) But they had not yet been baptized with holy spirit when Jesus pointed out that they were also to be baptized in a symbolic baptism like his, a baptism into death. (Mr 10:39) So baptism into his death is something apart from water baptism. Paul expressed himself in his letter to the Christian congregation at Rome, saying: “Do you not know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death?”—Ro 6:3.

    It is Jehovah God who is responsible for the performing of such baptism into Christ Jesus as well as baptism into his death. He anointed Jesus, making him the Christ or Anointed One. (Ac 10:38) Thus God baptized Jesus with the holy spirit in order that, through Jesus, his followers might thereafter be baptized with holy spirit. Therefore, those who become joint heirs with him, with heavenly hopes, have to be “baptized into Christ Jesus,” that is, into the Anointed Jesus who, at the time of his anointing, was also begotten to be a spiritual son of God. They thereby become united to him, their Head, and they become members of the congregation that is the body of Christ.—1Co 12:12, 13, 27; Col 1:18.

    The course of these Christian followers who are baptized into Christ Jesus is a course of integrity-keeping under test from the time they are baptized into Christ, a daily facing of death and finally a death of integrity, as described by the apostle Paul when he explained to the Roman Christians: “Therefore we were buried with him through our baptism into his death, in order that, just as Christ was raised up from the dead through the glory of the Father, we also should likewise walk in a newness of life. For if we have become united with him in the likeness of his death, we shall certainly also be united with him in the likeness of his resurrection.”—Ro 6:4, 5; 1Co 15:31-49.

    Clarifying the matter still further, Paul, in writing to the congregation at Philippi, described his own course as “a sharing in [Christ’s] sufferings, submitting myself to a death like his, to see if I may by any means attain to the earlier resurrection from the dead.” (Php 3:10, 11) Only the Almighty God the heavenly Father, who is the Baptizer of those who are baptized in union with Jesus Christ and into his death, can complete the baptism. This He does through Christ by raising them up out of death to be united with Jesus Christ in the likeness of his resurrection, which is to heavenly, immortal life.—1Co 15:53, 54.

  • lambsbottom
    lambsbottom

    Where does wt say this John baptism is only for the gc?

    Also, isn't being baptized in the name of the Holy spirit showing being spirit begotten?

  • Crazyguy
    Crazyguy

    They explain the differences between john and jesus baptisms yet there is not one example of people after christ getting baptised john's way.

  • Aroq
    Aroq

    My question is this then, at Romans 8:9-11 it states

    " 9 However, you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. But if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Him. 10 If Christ is in you, though the body is dead because of sin, yet the spirit is alive because of righteousness. 11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you "

    Ok, so if the GC is not baptized into Christ, then they do not have the Spirit of God in them and have no life in them and will NOT be given life.

    Is this what the WT is trying to say?

    It IS what the Bible says.

  • leaving_quietly
    leaving_quietly

    Where does wt say this John baptism is only for the gc?

    They don't say this. But they DO say that baptism into Christ's baptism is only for the anointed. Thus, the inference is that the GC are NOT baptized into Christ. The only other option is John's baptism.

    Ok, so if the GC is not baptized into Christ, then they do not have the Spirit of God in them and have no life in them and will NOT be given life.

    Is this what the WT is trying to say?

    Well, no... see... erm... let me explain this to you... ??? Um...

    Only those baptized into Christ are anointed. And those are only the 144,000.

    And, just you never mind what the Bible says. The Greek scriptures were primarily written only for the anointed, so what they say doesn't actually apply to the GC. So, stop asking such silly questions!

    In the decades after the first members of the congregation of anointed Christians were chosen, Jehovah saw fit to have a permanent record made of the earthly ministry of Jesus as well as His dealings with and counsel to first-century anointed Christians. Jehovah thus added the inspired Christian Greek Scriptures to the already existing inspired Hebrew Scriptures. The Hebrew Scriptures were written in the first place for the fleshly nation of Israel during the time that they had a special relationship with God. The Christian Greek Scriptures were written primarily for “the Israel of God,” those anointed as brothers of Christ and spiritual sons of God. Of course, that in no way suggests that non-Israelites could not derive great benefit from studying the Hebrew Scriptures. Similarly, Christians who are not anointed with holy spirit derive immeasurable benefits from studying and living according to the counsel found in the Christian Greek Scriptures. w08 1/15 p. 22 par. 11

  • leaving_quietly
    leaving_quietly

    BTW, all sarcasm aside, my response is the typical one JWs will give you. You have, of course, poked yet another hole in WT theology.

  • AndDontCallMeShirley
    AndDontCallMeShirley

    BTW, all sarcasm aside, my response is the typical one JWs will give you. You have, of course, poked yet another hole in WT theology.

    The holes are already there... we just shine a light on them.

  • Aroq
    Aroq

    I love this place.

    It has shown me so much, and given me much more understanding as to the JW mind.

    Thank you all.

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