JW Star Chamber

by Xena 6 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  Xena

  Star Chamber

  An English court of law active in the Tudor and early Stuart periods, abolished by the Long Parliament in 1641. An outgrowth of the royal council, it was made up of privy councilors as well as judges and supplemented the activities of the common-law and equity courts in both civil and criminal matters. Initially well regarded because of its speed and flexibility, Star Chamber became unpopular as the Stuart kings used it with increasing arbitrariness to enforce the royal prerogative. Its name thus became synonymous with secret, irresponsible court proceedings. (Academic American Encyclopedia)

  secret, irresponsible court proceedings...does that sound familiar?

  My sister-in-law just got d/fed....she wasn't even there for it. She wasn't told the charges against her, she wasn't told who the witnesses against her were, she wasn't allowed to bring anyone along to represent or support her. In an age of justice it is difficult to believe that this kind of thing still goes on isn't it?

  And what can we do about it?
• 

  teejay

  Zee,

  On the "Watchtower Moves In For Kill On silentlambs" thread, critter posted something from the UN Charter of Human rights. It says that,

  Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

  ... has the right to be presumed innocent until proved guilty according to law in a public trial at which he has had all the guarantees necessary for his defence...

  The sad fact is, these internationally recognized basic human rights don't extend into the religious arena. Not in the U.S., anyway. The courts have consistently been extrememely hesitant to involve itself in religious matters unless an actual civil or criminal law has been broken.

  Put another way, there's nothing that can be done about the railroading / false df'ing of Bill (or anyone else). In the U.S., religious tribunals can do whatever it wants to its members and tend to do just that.

  --------------------

  In that same thread, I posted some quotes from the Insight Book: that the city gates was where the elders of the city held court; where the Law was read and ordinances were proclaimed; that, because of its public nature, the judges/elders would be especially careful to rule fairly.

  I also posted how in the trial of Jesus the Sanhedrin made a mockery of justice and violated every one of its own rules. Bill ain't Jesus, of course, but the gb *is* very much like the corrupt Pharisees who had a kangaroo court back then.

  When it comes to morally bankrupt men, not much has changed. Just another nail in the Watchtower coffin.
• 

  Kingpawn

  My sister-in-law just got d/fed....she wasn't even there for it. She wasn't told the charges against her, she wasn't told who the witnesses against her were, she wasn't allowed to bring anyone along to represent or support her. In an age of justice it is difficult to believe that this kind of thing still goes on isn't it?

  Of course this violates several of her rights under the Constitution, but I'm not sure a court would care on ruling as to whether the Bible trumps the Bill of Rights, but it might be worth a suit.
• 

  Gopher

  Xena,

  The elders are given cart blanche rulership over the lives of the people they serve dominate. As Teejay said, nothing can legally be done. The SOB's can do whatever they want.

  All we can do is provide support and (as desired) information.

  How is she feeling about being DF'd? Disappointed? Relieved? How are you doing with it? Has the experience changed her view of the JW's at all?

  Gopher
• 

  Seeker4

  Xena,

  Check out my letter to Newsday in Freeman's "Newsday,..." thread.

  Star Chamber is an apt description. I consider the Witness judicial meeting arrangement one of the worst violations of individual civil rights. Why?

  1. The committee of elders serves as prosecutor, judge, jury and at times even as the witnesses. That is outrageous in any normal court of law (or even an abnormal one!).

  2. The accused does not have access to defense counsel, not even in the simplest form of a fourth elder who would serve to guide them in what their rights are before a judicial committee, and prevent the judicial committee from taking any action that was not in line with the Society's instructions. I have seen a huge number of judicial committees seriously violate the Society's directions. As if it wasn't unjust enough when they FOLLOW the Society's procedures!! The typical Witness has no idea how things are supposed to be handled at a JC, and things are often handled improperly.

  3. The accused does not usually even have access to the "law books" (elders manual and WTS letters) upon which they will be judged.

  4. Judicial committee hearings are held in secret, without even ONE observer allowed. Scripturally, both in the example of Israel, and even in the 1st Century congregation, these procedures were public. That would go a long way toward preventing injustice, and was a good reason to always witnesses of some sort.

  S4
• 

  Xena

  The sad fact is, these internationally recognized basic human rights don't extend into the religious arena.

  and that is just WRONG! This just feels SO VERY WRONG....we are living in the 21st Century for God's sake.....

  She is upset about being d/fed just because it means her parents have to decide if they want to associate with her now or not. Tim's mom is dying from cancer and these elders KNEW that...she begged them to at least hold off on this...so she could still visit her mom in comparable peace...

  She moved to ANOTHER city...wasn't attending a Hall...no one knew her....BUT her Ex-hubby who is a JW needed scriptural divorce...so they hunted her down....found a couple of people who don't like her...and railroaded the d/fing...

  Personally if they EVER try to d/f me I will fight it tooth and nail...not because I want to be a JW...but because no one NO ONE has the right to JUDGE ME! Especially not them!

  I will take a look at that thread Seeker4....

  I was suprised when I heard they could not have anyone there with them...I think she would have been allowed an "observer" but that person couldn't speak in her behalf....can you believe that?

  Who the Hell DO They Think They Are???

  lol can you tell I am a bit "unhappy" about this???
• 

  minimus

  Is it illegal for elders to hold hearings and disfellowship someone? Are human rights LEGALLY abused? If not, that's why it's done.