Jews VS Mormons

by Adam 9 Replies latest jw friends

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  Adam

  This week on the radio, I heard that the Jewish higherarchy is all full of piss and vinigar because the Mormons apparently aren't holding up their end of a bargan reached several years ago. Seems that mormons believe that posthumus baptizing (I think it's just a verbal thing, I doubt they pour water over corpses) allows the individual the choice of chosing the right faith (theirs of course) after mortal death. Because of this belief, they were posthumusly baptizing Jews who died in the Holocost. This pissed the Jews off something feirce. They hammered out a deal and the Mormons said they'd stop saving the souls of the dead Jews. Well I guess someone recently caught an over-zealous Mormon reading holocost victems' names at the baptizmal roll call (or whatever they call it) and the Jews are pissed again.

  The mormons were simply trying to be nice. According to them, if you're never baptized as a mormon you don't have the option of choosing the only religion of the one true god. They were simply allowing these poor misguided jews the posthumus opportunity to pick the right religion instead of the wrong one that they were in when they died. Quite curtious of them if you ask me. Oh, and god bless.
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  Makena1

  That sounds very familiar.

  I guess I do not have a problem with it either way. Question: do the Mormons count field service time when doing the posthumous baptisms.????

  Mak

  Gimme that ol' timey religion

  ;)
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  Farkel

  : Seems that mormons believe that posthumus baptizing (I think it's just a verbal thing, I doubt they pour water over corpses) allows the individual the choice of chosing the right faith (theirs of course) after mortal death.

  No. Living Mormons in good standing allow themselves to get baptized over and over for dead people. Mormons believe that baptism for themselves or for dead folks must be a complete water immersion, not just a sprinking of water on your nose like Catholics do. Mormons, like JWs is a "works-based" Cult. And like all religions, "faith" only enters the picture when they are out of arguments and/or all of their arguments have been defeated.

  Farkel
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  Utopian_Raindrops

  I was engaged to a Mormon guy once and of course became Momon at the time to suit him

  Anyway...they have this ritual practice of Baptising the dead...a live person stands in for them and gets dunked over and over...and others take turns being dunked over and over ...as the names of dead persons are read off. This is done in The Temples that only Mormons in good standing and having been baptised at least one year can enter into.

  Did you know even after you die...they can disfellowship/excomunicate you??

  Seems from an Ensign I read.....it is considered scripture and more acurate then the bible(go figure a magazine! More acurate then the word of God) Dead persons are disembodied and waiting in great discumfort to be reunited with thier perfect Celestual Bodies on a Celestial Earth!

  If they find out you did something bad b4 you died they can then take action and remove you from the flock! I mean now that your dead and gone your the worst association of all!! LOL

  bye 4 now

  agape,

  Utopian_Raindrops
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  Bendrr

  Ridiculous! Absolutely absurd! I could understand if they were to make a blanket prayer for "the jews" or "the [non-mormom group]" but to read a list of names? That's a little over the top.

  Mike.
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  Crazy151drinker

  Have they found those plates yet........????
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  DevonMcBride

  This baptism of the Jews shows disrespect toward the victims living families. How is this a nice gesture? I think other religions would get angry too.

  Edited by - devonmcbride on 12 December 2002 19:40:34
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  Adam

  Just a note: My closing comments were completely fecetious. I think that this is a glaring example of just how rediculous people will act because of religion. Baptizing dead people from another religion, geez, religion's great, aint it?

  Edited by - Adam on 12 December 2002 19:43:52
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  Kenneson

  I'm sure that the Mormons back up their baptism for the dead with 1 Cor. 15:29: "Otherwise, what will people accomplish by having themselves baptized for the dead? If the dead are not raised at all, then why are they having themselves baptized for them?" The NWT puts it this way: "Otherwise, what will they do who are being baptized for the purpose of [being] dead ones? If the dead are not to be raised up at all, why are they also being baptized for the purpose of [being] such?"

  I sometimes wondered about this passage. This is what I found in one commentary.

  "Interpretations of this verse are legion (Foschini, Rissi), but the most common view sees Paul as referring to members of the community who had themselves baptized on behalf of dead friends or relatives who had died unbelievers (so Barrett, Conzelmann, Senft, et al.). Paul's sacramental theology, however, would never have permitted him to condone such superstition, much less to use it as an argument. Moreover, the antecedent context suggests that v 29 should evoke Paul's ministry in a general way, and this is confirmed by vv 30-32a. In this perspective one would translate, Why are they destroying themselves on account of those dead (to higher spiritual truths)? If those who are really dead are not raised, why are they being destroyed on their account? The 'spirit-people' at Corinth--those whoe denied the resurrection--had mocked Paul for the effort he expended on those whom they considered merely 'soul-people.' By radicalizing the gibe in the second question, Paul draws their attention to the implications of such effort. He would not be working himself to death, were he not absolutely convinced that the dead would be raised."
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  refiners fire

  Hmmm. Well the Mormon tome "A marvellous work and a wonder" discusses baptism for the dead.

  Cutting a long story short:

  The scripture at 1 Peter 4 verse 6 is quoted. " For this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged ACCORDING TO MEN IN THE FLESH, but live according to God in the spirit".

  Clearly (according to the Momos) this indicates that the dead will hear the Gospel, it being preached by worthy Mormons who have passed into death themselves. The book says:

  "Isnt this PLAIN? The gospel was preached to them, and they are to be judged 'according to men in the flesh'. How can a spirit be baptized for the remission of sins? This can only be done by Proxy- the living for the dead".

  Next it says:

  "When the gospel is accepted by the departed spirits, their hearts turn to their children upon the earth, who have the privilage of being baptized for their kindred dead"....

  So it appears that Mormons, scanning thru their gaeneological books, and looking at the names of those of their dead descendants, then pray to recieve a "move in the spirit" as to whether the dear departed one has repented and is ready for baptism. Naturally the objective of all this is to save all who have ever lived. Universal salvation.