Half of disfellowshipped one suicidal?

by ExBethelitenowPIMA 9 Replies latest jw friends

  • ExBethelitenowPIMA
    ExBethelitenowPIMA

    This ex brother says about half of disfellowshipped ones are suicidal at about 43 minutes into this video https://youtube.com/watch?v=OtcDKSNf4Zo&feature=sharec

    it really is that brutal having your family and friends shun you that many unfortunately do actually take their own lives including Steve Letts nephew.

    No wonder the drastic change in the elders book to not have any more judicial committees if suspected it would make them suicidal.

    this is probably one of the largest changes in recent history that most rank and file don’t know about yet.

    how it will work in practice I just don’t know. What if someone keeps sinning but says it’s weakness not wickedness and they are suicidal? What will happen then?

  • EasyPrompt
    EasyPrompt

    They will still disfellowship the person if it suits the branch/elderbody/CO.

  • Journeyman
    Journeyman

    Suicide (and depression and suicidal feelings) are a growing problem generally, due to the pressure of life today - finding and keeping work, paying bills, maintaining relationships, developing your own self-worth and identity, etc.

    I just saw a news report literally minutes before reading this thread, that suicide in 2022 was at the highest level in the USA since WWII.

    https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/8/11/us-records-highest-number-of-suicides-in-2022

    So it's no surprise it would also be a growing problem in the JW world too.

    As for JW judicial procedures, if they do begin to see a lot of people 'using' talk of being suicidal to try and 'dodge' being DFed (as they see it), they will probably adjust their procedure.

    To be fair, that's no different to secular organisations such as police, courts or other bodies doing the same - adjusting their procedures to prevent people trying to 'get around' them. As an example, for years, British police had a policy not to engage in a car chase with criminals on motorbikes if they were not wearing a helmet, for safety reasons. So of course, lots of crims started ditching their helmets after committing crime so the cops had to stop and they could get away. So eventually, some police forces changed their policy so that they now use 'tactical contact' to lightly nudge the bikers off (a bit like a softer version of the US PIT manoeuvre). Now, surprise, surprise - bike crime has fallen by 50% in some areas.

    It's just a cat and mouse game, and I'm sure the org will just see it that way if they feel the 'suicidal' clause becomes a 'tactic' in judicial cases. Eventually they'll either just say "disfellowship anyway" (as EasyPrompt says) or they'll introduce some other test or procedural hoop to make 'genuinely repentant' ones go through.

  • EasyPrompt
    EasyPrompt

    Yes, "a cat and mouse game" is a good way to put it. The borg already showed they don't care about disfellowshipping victims of CSA or about disfellowshipping honest-hearted ones who tell the truth about false doctrines. They don't care about the sheep. It doesn't matter if the sheep is "suicidal" or "not suicidal". It's not about the sheep. It's about maintaining control of the flock.


    These guys are not shepherds. They are fakers. If they do make changes in their book, it's only for show.

  • ExBethelitenowPIMA
    ExBethelitenowPIMA

    From now on there will be hardly anyone getting disfellowshipped as long as they know about the change

  • EasyPrompt
    EasyPrompt

    I don't believe it. Who's the "they" who knows about the "change"? When did this supposed "change" happen?


    Look, I was just disfellowshipped last year. The charge was "reviling and causing divisions" since I reported abuse and warned the rest of the congregation via email. The elder in question was a COBE and HLC and substitute pioneer school teacher and a high rated convention speaker, and the other elders wouldn't proceed with the procedures as written in the elder book. Instead they did everything they could to throw in "monkey wrenches" and dance around even their own procedures. I sent copies of a transcript of one of the "shepherding calls" to Bethel, as well as copies of emails sent to me by the CO and different elders so that Bethel would see how they weren't following their own supposed procedures. (A lot of that time was during COVID, so much of the communication was via email and Zoom rather than at the KH.) It turns out Bethel was the one telling these guys what to do, so they could keep that elder in "use". There were three different KHs involved, three bodies of elders, two COs, and then the appeal committee with elders from another circuit/KHs.


    For months, one tactic these guys used was to copy a paragraph from the w88 about mentally deranged people shouting out during meetings and quote it to me saying "you need to be medicated." They even said "we'll take you to the doctor so you can get treatment" even though I very clearly told them I regularly see my medical practitioner for a thyroid disorder that is treated with medications, thank you very much, I have a clean bill of health and I am under no need for any psych medications. I have never disrupted a meeting. Those elders kept giving me assignments to research and arrange phone and writing territories during COVID, and they kept calling on me to comment during Zoom meetings. It wasn't until I sent emails to the congregation members to tell them what was going on about the abuse situation that the "get medicated" baloney started getting shot at me on the "shepherding calls".


    Eventually after several extremely rude and condescending "shepherding calls" I told those elders - "Fine - make an appointment. Sure, you can take me, and when we go in to the doctor, I'll tell him that these elder-clergy-guys here with me want me to be drugged up because I keep telling on how they are allowing an abuser to stay an elder in the congregation." After that, they stopped with the "we'll help you get to the doctor" bit, but they stripped "privileges" little by little, saying "we're not supporting your ministry any more, no more literature for you" and "no more Zoom meetings" since I would turn off my video/audio during their hypocritical prayers. Then when meetings were going to resume "no coming to the KH" since I asked to meet with the elder in question about the abuse and the elders didn't want to have to follow up "with the second part of Matthew 18". (They told me they wouldn't talk to that elder about the abuse allegations until I confronted him first, and that I hadn't talked to him yet since he wouldn't answer my repeated phone calls and letters.) They got a trespassing ban on me when the KHs were opening up again because they didn't want to have to follow through with the abuse procedures. Bethel told them how to avoid having to follow those procedures.


    These guys have known me for over 20 years. I pioneered for five years, then married an elder and raised my two kids as good little Jehovah's Witnesses. They were baptized at ages 9 and 11. I auxiliary pioneered every year a few months of the year. I was interviewed on different parts at conventions. They never gave me a hard time about being "disruptive" until I told the truth about abuse an elder did, and then they threw me under the bus.


    They disfellowshipped me even though they labeled me "mentally" whatever. Their label was a lie, just like their charges for disfellowshipping me were a lie. They don't care about anyone, ExBethelitenowPIMA. Those "changes" are just for show. They are a pack of liars who are trying to "rule as kings" now. They have slaves. They have positions and people paying for their cars and insurance and food. It's a scam. They aren't letting go of their "kingdom" until Jesus comes and rips it away from them.


    If it's to their advantage to "disfellowship" someone, they'll do it. It doesn't matter to them if the person is suicidal or not, or whether they are guilty or not. My alcoholic husband was caught smoking, committing adultery, celebrating Christmas, arrested for domestic assault and breaking conditions, there were plenty of witnesses, he never repented, and he was not disfellowshipped because he supports the elder worship/GB worship.


    It's a scam. It's all a bunch of baloney.


    Here is part of an email from one CO to me...



  • EasyPrompt
    EasyPrompt

    (I posted the transcript of one of the elder "shepherding call" meetings on this thread, as well as copies of various emails from the elders...they are not shepherds - they are wolves...)

    https://www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/6553089276903424/three-amish-bishops-who-told-woman-rescind-protective-order-against-husband-guilty-intimidation

  • Lee Marsh
    Lee Marsh
    it really is that brutal having your family and friends shun you that many unfortunately do actually take their own lives including Steve Letts nephew.

    Yes it is. It is even worse than losing your family and friends which is traumatic.

    You lose your religion. Your entire community. Remember that as JWs you don't have outside associations. So zap. Every person in your life will turn their back on you.

    You have been betrayed by the very people you are supposed to trust the most and who are supposed to guide and protect you.

    Worse still is that you lose your identity. Ask a JW who are you and most of the time they will say they are JWs. Before work. Before marital status. "I AM A JEHOVAH'S WITNESS". That is who they are. They have been taught from the beginning that being a JW is who they are and is the only thing that will save them. Without that identity they are doomed to have a miserable life and die alone.

    They have been taught to avoid ex-JWs and oddly, after leaving, many still think they have to avoid ex-JWs because that will make their lives even worse.

    Many don't have post-secondary educations so getting a job and supporting themselves is harder.

    If they have a family they may believe that the family is better off without them.

    It is extremely depressing to go through a traumatic experience like this. Depression, severe, debilitating depression goes with the trauma. And since JWs are generally warned not to seek therapy/counseling, that door is closed to them too.

    Believing they have absolutely nothing left, many think they should just quit living.

    Being disfellowshipped is one trauma. The shunning multiplies that more than a hundred times over.

  • LongHairGal
    LongHairGal

    LEE MARSH:

    I heard of a few JWs who killed themselves. But, one I know of was not disfellowshipped.. Who knows what was going through his mind - and what kind of hangups he was saddled with?

    With regard to disfellowshipped people, everything you said is correct: when all is said and done some might wrongly assume they have nothing to live for…

    I was not raised a JW and I remember them trying to separate me from non-Witness friends and relatives….Now, of course, it’s obvious they want to isolate the new JW so it will be easier to ‘shun’ him or her when they are in ‘violation’ of any of the rules and regulations and even popular people’s opinions!! If the JW has people on the outside to turn to, the shun gun has little or no effect. No control. The religion can’t have that.

    I’m grateful I had my full-time job at the time, so I wasn’t totally isolated much to the religion’s disappointment. That’s why they hated me.

  • road to nowhere
    road to nowhere

    I have seen suicide from the pressure to not get a good job, pioneer, don't marry, go to bethel.

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