Hypothetical Bible question for Christians

BoogerMan

Although not stated, is it possible that Satan issued a challenge regarding Adam & Eve, just as he did with Job?

Reason I ask: If YOU made something "perfect", why would you UNNECESSARILY subject it to a trial/test?

Sea Breeze

If YOU made something "perfect", why would you UNNECESSARILY subject it to a trial/test?

Why do you assume it was UNNECESSARY?

"I would not have known sin except through the law"

"But now we have been released from the law, because we have died to that by which we were bound, so that we may serve in newness of the Spirit and not in oldness of the letter of the law."

enoughisenough

I was thinking they were made perfect, but they were also given free will...the "test" would show what a perfect person would do with free will.

As I see it, God is omniscient. He made Adam perfectly sinless and capable of love, but ignorant of evil. So, God's image was not fully formed and could not be without the knowledge and experience of sin and evil. God is still forming the image of Christ in man by the redemptive work of Christ and the presence and work of the Holy Spirit.

It seems that God let Satan into the garden for a purpose. It was not a test. Man was bound to fail. Christ was bound to be crucified. It was the divine intention. He foreknew it all and still went ahead with creation.

I can't see any other possibility.

enoughisenough

Vanderhoven7 if your thinking is correct, the whole thing is nothing short of evil.

Vanderhoven7

What exactly do you see as evil?

That God allowed Satan into the garden?

That God foreknew the fall and still created man?

That it was not a test?

That man was bound to fail?

That Christ was bound to be crucified?

That God went ahead with creation?

By the way; if the above is true, are you still happy that God saw that you would be born and experience the life you have now?

enoughisenough

as I understand it, it your take is correct, he already knew Satan would tempt the humans, he already knew they would fail, he already planned Jesus as a ransom. He knew in advance all the wickedness that would be the outcome. That not only would have been evil and cruel to humans ( because humans do suffer), but to the angels ( tempting them with women) and Jesus( plotting a torturous death) Why would he create something he knew in advance he would regret? Gen 6:6 Jehovah regretted that he had made men on the earth and his heart was saddened. ( so he planned to wipe it all out but Noah found favor )

Vanderhoven7

Yes, if God is Omniscient He foreknew it all including the holocaust, WWI and WWII etc.

This from "Room for Doubt"

"In these cases in which the biblical author seems to describe God as regretting something and it seems as though God did not know what would happen, it is anthropomorphic language. Anthropomorphic language (describing God using human terms) is used sometimes in the Bible. For example, God does not literally have an arm (Job 40:9) or nostrils (2 Sam. 22:9). We understand how we regret things, and by describing God as regretting His actions, it allows us to get a sense of how God feels about these sinful actions. There is some analogy between God’s sense of regret and our own, even though they are not perfectly analogous. God is infinite in knowledge and incapable of learning new information; by contrast, humanity is finite and needs to learn new things."

Since God lives outside of time He sees from beginning to end and if He is satisfied with the final result (the former things will pass away) I'm sure we will be satisfied when His image is formed in us.

truth_b_known

...is it possible that Satan issued a challenge regarding Adam & Eve, just as he did with Job?

No.

In the Hebrew Bible there is no Satan. There is "the satan" or "accuser. A satan is referred to 9 times in the Hebrew texts. Five times to describe a human military, political or legal opponent, and four times with reference to a divine being. In Numbers 22, the prophet Balaam, hired to curse the Israelites, is stopped by a messenger from Israel’s God YHWH, described as “the satan” acting on God’s behalf.

Remember the Sadducees? There were the larger of the 2 sects of Judaism practioners with the Pharisees being the newer, more progressive sect. They were self-appointed to keep the Jewish religion pure from outside religious influence. The Sadducees were a longer standing group with some influence.

Remember the two doctrines that set them apart from the Pharisees -

No resurrection
No angels

So the "Satan" of Job is actually just "a satan" or "accuser" which was the legal term given to the plaintiff of a court case.

3 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, “Did God really say, ‘You must not eat from any tree in the garden’?”

Notice Genesis 3:1 says "the serpent". In Hebrew the word here that is used is "nachash" which translates into snake (noun), deviner (verb), shining one (adjective). It can't be the noun (snake) because later on in chapter 3 of Genesis we find out that this nachash is cursed to eat dust. I know of no animal that eats dust, let alone a snake.

In addition, the verb form of nachash means "deviner" or "witchcraft," but it also came to mean "to guess."

Satan being a fallen angel did not become part of any belief system until angels became part of the Jewish society. That did not occur until around the 2nd or 1st century BCE. Enter the Pharisees and the Apostle Paul - a Pharisee. It is not until the New Testament that Paul starts speaking of Satan the Devil as being a specific heavenly person and chief opposer of God. Paul's writing predates the Gospels. Paul writes as if an actual snake had become possessed by an angel and temped Eve.

What makes more sense -

Eve is tempted by her own desires (nachash or "to guess" aka "second guess") or
There was a snake possessed by an angel that began to talk and later ate dust?

Hypothetical Bible question for Christians

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