Does anyone know about this? It is a Christian contemplative practice, I guess it's taught by a Father Thomas Keating. In the blurb I read it mentions that phrase "clouds of unknowing" which was first used by an anonymous Christian mystic, I always thought that's a good way of putting it. Anyways I'm interested to know what it involves.
Centering Prayer
by Introspection 9 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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LittleToe
http://www.centeringprayer.com/cntrgpryr.htm
Though I tend to associate with Christians from the Reformed tradition, this is something that is acknowledged even in those circles. It just goes to show that you can't make broad assertions, and expect them to cover everyone withing a given "category" of Christian.
It is closely akin to other forms of meditation, and opens you up to a wide range of "spiritual" experience.
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onacruse
Hey you 2, I've a question that I think sortof relates to this topic:
Do you think that a "mystical" interaction with our universe is the only way to enlightenment? I ask this in the context of Kant and Ouspensky, both of whom were convinced that true understanding could never come about through intellectual exercise. Seems to me to be somewhat along the lines if meditative prayer.
Craig
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gitasatsangha
Its good these are becoming better known. The Church did a big disservice in the middleages (dark ages?) of making its meditational methods more for the clerics and less for the laity. Other groups like Hermetics, that also had meditational methods, had to keep them quiet in light of the fact that a good many people became human torches for unorthodoxy.
When eastern meditational methods became available to the west, the big spiritual shift east occured, and I think in large part this happened because of the fact that meditational education was not given out by the Church at large. Nowadays, there are methods being offered in an attempt to make up for lost time (with some Jesuits even being trained in zazen at Zen monastaries, for instance), but I have to wonder if its too little too late. Any meditational instruction is good though, as long as its not some corruption of the idea (like the Watchtower's horrid attempt to turn meditation into more Watchtower and Asleep! Study time.)
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LittleToe
Craig:
Yes.Gita:
LOL @ Wt Meditation techinques.
ROFL - I'm tickled by that.
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onacruse
Interesting. I've structured my whole life along the lines of Aristotleian rationalism. As a result, I've never really been able to integrate the "undefinable" nature of personal revelation and the power of prayer...even though I experience both. I know they happen, but I can't say how they happen or why they work; especially, I can't prove they are real.
Craig
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gitasatsangha
Fata Morgana. Just enjoy the effects and don't worry about the causation. (IMHO)
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Francois
Onacruse - Don't worry about it. When it happens you will believe with out so much as a proton of doubt. And if you had experienced it already, you wouldn't have posted what you posted, ipso facto - you haven't experienced touching the indwelling light as yet. You will though, you will. And when you do, there will be a sharp intake of breath. Very sharp.
francois
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onacruse
Francois:
if you had experienced it already, you wouldn't have posted what you posted,
That's exactly where my uncertainty rests. It's rather like "If you've experienced it, you'll know. If you haven't experienced it, then you don't know." Unfortunately, that smacks alot like JW mentality.
And, beyond even my own eventual "certainty" remains the ability to share it with others: How does one share an indefinable personal experience? I'm not in life only for myself.
Craig (of the "still searching" class)
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Introspection
Craig, it's not an experience - experience is by nature temporary so obviously it is at best a secondary effect of something that is permanent. This is basically why you can't solve it through thought, because as I stated in another thread recently since thought is dualistic and relative in nature, you can't get to something absolute through it.
I don't find it useful to use words like mystical, most people don't know what it means (including the ones who use it frequently) and here on a board like this you got reactions to spiritual words up the yin-yang, and then the same people starts voicing their opinions and why they have the beliefs they do, and pretty soon it's just a collective monologue with no real interest in any kind of understanding. I am Jack's personal beliefs/world views.
I would recommend that you check out Advaita Vedanta, they've got a nice technique of inquiry that seems to go over well with intellectuals. Just remember that when you ask questions like "Who am I?" it is not meant to produce a nice answer, it's meant to point you toward the reality, so just look and see. (wow, and nobody else tells you what it is) It's more like an insight than an experience, but of course ultimately that breaks down too and fails to adequetly describe it.