I accidently stumbled onto this site. Anyone know about this?

by avengers 8 Replies latest jw friends

  • avengers
    avengers

    http://jehovah.to/freedom/steinhaug.htm

    http://jehovah.to/

    It's not really important, but I thought it might be interesting.

    A quote from there.

    I am also continually amazed by the use of some anti-Jehovah's Witnesses websites by those who profess to be Christians. Many such sites are actually owned and maintained by agnostics and atheists. Such people not only are opposed to Jehovah's Witnesses but to all Christian groups. A very good example of this fact can be demonstrated with reference to a person named xxxx xxxxxxxx, who owns and maintains a website dedicated to opposing the teachings of Jehovah's Witnesses.
  • Amazing
    Amazing

    Hi Avengers,

    Thanks for the excellent links. The site appears to be a private JW, but I suspect that either the Society is directly behind it, or the JW who owns it is an attorney. The legal citations are too numerous and well researched to be that of a typical JW.

    The site owner's "Fair Use" claims against Kent are quite correct. Anything a person puts into print can be copied and quoted for criticism, reference, and supporting proof. International and US Copyright laws are pretty much the same, and are quite flexible as long as the one quoting makes an accurate quote and credits the author, it is pretty much fair game.

    That said, there are limits with respect to how much one can copy material that is copyrighted. If you copy an entire work, such as a book or article, for the sole purpose of general distribution, whether for profit or not, and are making no other use, such as commentary or criticism, then the author or copyright holder can bring suit. A recent example is that of certain newspapers suing private individuals who merely "link" to news articles in their own website.

    I think I recall that Kent got into difficulty when he hosted a copy of the Elder's manual, "Shepherds of the Flock" ... and had to change the way he did things. If he, or others, had made commentary and criticism on each and every section of the book, then little could have been done.

    Under US law, your written material can be considered under copyright the minute you record it on any media whether written, photo, electronic, etc. You do "not" have to register your work with the US Patent & Copyright office, though this is a good thing to do. It is much like real property recordings. You can buy real property and not record the deed, but it could bite you later when you try to sell it, or enforce your property rights.

    The site you linked is a keeper, thanks! I also think the site should be monitored as the pedophile lawsuits mature. It will be interesting to see if the site host is honest enough to comment on these, especially when the Watchtower Society does not prevail. - Jim W.

    PS: The notion of suing people who copy a post, or for a poster who seriously tries to copyright a post is silly. I can just the see the jury's faces now as they listen to the Plaintiff attorney argue how Farkel made improper use of Amazing's posts on JWD in violation of Interantinal Copyright Law. They could not contain the laughter.

  • waiting
    waiting

    Who runs the site? Dunno. It's well put together, however - and always slants to the jw's favor.

    I haven't been there in a long time - but remember reviewing several law cases. Interesting.

    The site owner's "Fair Use" claims against Kent are quite correct. Anything a person puts into print can be copied and quoted for criticism, reference, and supporting proof. International and US Copyright laws are pretty much the same, and are quite flexible as long as the one quoting makes an accurate quote and credits the author, it is pretty much fair game. - amazing

    That was my view - although I'm not acquainted with the laws more than the average person. As long as a person identifies their source of quote.....it's ok.

    In fact, the WTBTS has played loose with that law for decades. They'll quote a book, but not page - leaving it up to the individual to read the whole book to find that phrase beginning & ending with * ... *

    Lord, xjw sites are built upon that law - and that law will keep the WT bleeding.

    waiting

  • waiting
    waiting

    Coming in 2003/2004

    Jesus as "a god": A Response to Murray J. Harris and Other Trinitarian Scholars, by Greg Stafford

    A comprehensive analysis of all biblical texts relating to the divinity of Jesus Christ as well as a critique of the book Jesus as God, by Murray J. Harris. The author also discusses key issues relating to Trinitarian interpretations of the biblical use of terms for "God" of Jesus Christ and others. Linguistic, historical and theological problems and implications are explored in detail, in a manner that makes the book useful for scholars and others.

    "Before Abraham Was": The History, Interpretation, and Translation of John 8:58, by Greg Stafford.

    In this book the author considers the use of this controversial passage from the Bible in early theological works and Bible versions up through the Reformation, to the close of the past millennium. Translation issues are explored in detail, yet with a simple approach that will make it easy for scholars and beginners alike to grapple with the technical though important questions surrounding this text.

    Now available from Elihu Books!

    Three Dissertations on the Teachings of Jehovah's Witnesses, by Greg Stafford, xiv + 287 pages. Please note: Shipping can take up to three weeks for international orders. We also ask that domestic orders be given two to three weeks due to the volume of orders received for this publication.

    Perhaps Greg Stafford has more than a little to do with this website? This page is found at the click at the bottom of the first page. Whoever runs the site..........is Really Close to Greg Stafford and/or Elihu Books, imho.

    http://www.elihubooks.com/

    Who owns Elihu Books?

  • Spudinator
    Spudinator

    Greg Stafford is Elihubooks.

  • waiting
    waiting

    Are you SURE about that..........what proof do you have? Please share? Thanks.

    As for the site itself.........does Greg Stafford have intimate ties with that too?

    waiting

  • Nathan Natas
    Nathan Natas

    The internet country code of '.to" indicates that wttp://jehovah.to is registered in TONGA. Is that legit?

    As for Greg Stafford and Elihubooks, a search on this very site will reveal many many instances in which it is stated that Stafford is linked to Elihubooks - for example, his email address references that site.

  • avengers
    avengers

    Thanks for the info.

    You guys always come through, don't you?

    I also think the site should be monitored as the pedophile lawsuits mature. It will be interesting to see if the site host is honest enough to comment on these, especially when the Watchtower Society does not prevail.

    I'll check the site now and then. If anything turns up you can be sure I'll post it.

    Andy

  • Dino
    Dino

    I am going totally on memory here, but I believe that the site you linked to used to have alot of it's content contributed by Hal Flemings out in San Diego.

    He is (at least on the surface) a JW apologist who secretly works for "reform".

    He also teaches/taught biblical hebrew at a community college.

    Dino

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