Where did Bible writers get their ideas from?

by fulltimestudent 9 Replies latest watchtower bible

• 

  fulltimestudent

  Here's an extract from a Zoroastrian document.

  “...and they will make a new world, 

  freed from old age and death, from decomposition and corruption, 
  eternally living, eternally increasing, 
  and possessing power at will, 
  when the dead will rise again, 
  when life and immortality will come,
  …. and when the world will renew itself at its wish” 

  (Sacred Avesta, lines from the Zamyad Yasht 19)

  and then the link editorialises ..

  These lines, one of the most beautiful in the sacred Avesta proclaiming the ultimate goal towards which all Zoroastrians efforts are directed: the progress of the world towards total renewal and perfection of existence which occurs at the end of the world and final renovation(the Frashkart)..also according to our beliefs the creations of the great God Ahura Mazda as well participate in bringing the world towards perfection and it is the prayer of every Zoroastrian to be among those who renovate life, towards where all the good creation of Good-spirit grows deathless and the Druj (lies) and evils loose their power and perish, as is the will of the Lord.

  
  

  The above is from a facebook page on Cyrus the Great.

  https://www.facebook.com/Greatest.King.Cyrus
  

  
  

  If you'd like to know more about Zoroastrianism, Wikipedia has a reasonable description.

  Link: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoroastrianism

  And commences with:

  Zoroastrianism /ˌzɒroʊˈæstriənɪzəm/, also called  Zarathustraism, Mazdaism  and Magianism, is an ancient monotheistic Iranian religion and a religious philosophy. It was once the state religion of the Achaemenid, Parthian, and Sasanian empires. ...
  Zoroastrianism arose in the eastern region of the ancient Persian Empire, when the religious philosopher Zoroaster simplified the pantheon of early Iranian gods into two opposing forces: Spenta Mainyu ("progressive mentality") and Angra Mainyu ("destructive mentality") under the one God, Ahura Mazda ("Illuminating Wisdom").
  Zoroaster's ideas led to a formal religion bearing his name by about the 6th century BCE and have influenced other later religions including Judaism, Gnosticism, Christianity and Islam.

  We already know that the Jewish elite were exiled in Babylon when Cyrus conquered the city and gave permission for the exiled elite to return to Jerusalem. Some (but not all) did return while many (perhaps even the majority stayed in Babylon and continued to be exposed to Zoroastrian ideas.
• 

  cofty

  Thanks FTS

  I think I am right in saying that the dualistic idea of a devil was adopted from Zoroastrianism during the exile.
• 

  Village Idiot

  I heard that Zoroastrianism has a Millennial doctrine that states that human history is supposed to last for seven divine days with the first 6,000 years being that of toil and misery but the seventh being the "Age of Wonders", a divine day of rest for mankind.

  I wonder if this Millennial concept filtered down to certain Christian doctrine way back then. 
• 

  Crazyguy

  The Persians ruled over the jews for over 100 years so since the jews were ruled by the babylonians for less then 100 years and got most of the stories in the book of Genesis from them then it only stands to reason they got a lot from the Persians.

  There are many ideas in the bible that come from Persian influences that even influenced the babylonians. The charibs, satan, one supreme god as well as others that were already mentioned in the first post. Also if you notice in the bible the Messiah at the time was Cyrus and no negative things are ever written in the bible about the Persians that i can think of.
• 

  fulltimestudent

  Crazyguy: The Persians ruled over the jews for over 100 years ...

  Umm! Are you sure? I thought that the Jews (in Palestine) were still part of the Persian (Iranian) Empire up until Alexander the Great was conquering the Persian Empire. Which dates the end of Persian rule around 330 BCE, Which would mean a Persian rule over the Jews of some 200+ years. Of course, after 330BCE they were strongly influenced by Greek thought.

  And, since Jews continued to live in Babylon for centuries after that they continued to be influenced by religious developments in that part of the world.

  so since the jews were ruled by the babylonians for less then 100 years and got most of the stories in the book of Genesis from them then it only stands to reason they got a lot from the Persians.

  Yes, a Babylonian influence could be detected in the early chapters of Genesis. But I was amazed to hear a Professor of Egyptology read from an Egyptian creation document and from the first verses of Genesis ch 1, that showed an intellectual linkage between the Egyptian concept of creation and the idea of the seperation 

  Another academic writer concludes, in a paper presented at a conference at the Dallas Theological Seminary in 2005:

  In conclusion, the author/redactor(s) of the Genesis creation accounts share certain concepts of the makeup of the world with other ancient Near Eastern cultures. However, it is especially with Egypt’s worldview that the author/redactor(s) are familiar. Evidence for this lies in the many allusions to Egyptian creation motifs throughout the Genesis creation accounts. But, rather than being a case of direct borrowing, they demythologize the Egyptian concepts and form a polemic against the Egyptian gods. Thus, they elevate Yahweh-Elohim as the one true God, who is transcendent and who is all powerful. He speaks his desire and it comes to pass. He does not require the assistance of other gods to perform the acts of creation. He alone possesses the power and means necessary to effect the creation of the world. This paper has compiled a list of the more significant parallels between Egyptian cosmology and the Genesis creation accounts, and has shown that Egyptian cosmology and the Genesis creation accounts share more affinity with one another than the Genesis creation accounts share with Babylonian cosmology.

  If you'd like to you, can follow his arguments for an Egyptian influence at this link: https://bible.org/article/genesis-1-2-light-ancient-egyptian-creation-myths

  
  

  So what can we conclude? May this - that Yahweh and Jesus (who as the "Word," is the personification of wisdom, according to John ch 1. copied all their ideas from other Gods. So can we call them the original plagiarists? 

  
  

  
  

  
  

  
  
  
  
  
• 

  stuckinarut2

  If anyone even tried to point out info like this to a witness, they would run away screaming in fear!

  One could not even have a civil discussion about such matters without them clamming up and dismissing everything as "propaganda from the devil!"

   
• 

  runForever

  GOD.
• 

  fulltimestudent

  Cofty: I think I am right in saying that the dualistic idea of a devil was adopted from Zoroastrianism during the exile.

  That's the logical conclusion. As a concept it does not seem evident in writings that have a pre-exilic background, but afterwards, as for example, in the Qumran (Dead Sea) scrolls, it is. An example occurs in Vermes' translation of the DDS, ( 1QS 3:17-25) where the author speaks of having to choose between being led by either the Angel of Darkness or the Angel of Truth.

  However, we cant leave out of consideration the influential Jews of Babylon. 
• 

  OrphanCrow

  Cofty: I think I am right in saying that the dualistic idea of a devil was adopted from Zoroastrianism during the exile.

  
  

  That's the logical conclusion. As a concept it does not seem evident in writings that have a pre-exilic background, but afterwards, as for example, in the Qumran (Dead Sea) scrolls, it is. An example occurs in Vermes' translation of the DDS, ( 1QS 3:17-25) where the author speaks of having to choose between being led by either the Angel of Darkness or the Angel of Truth.

  The Christian concept of heaven and hell has also been attributed to influences of Zorastianism by some Biblical scholars. 

  In Zoroastian thought, the bridge between heaven (paradise) and hell was seen as the fine edge of a sword. Difficult to walk upon and hard to balance.
• 

  WTWizard

  The whole thing is a scam.  Nothing more than a spell of black magic intended to enslave and damn the world, while silencing anyone that might criticize the real source of this damnation.  And yet, the philo-Semitism contained therein is so blatant that anyone with half a brain that reads this book of damnation can see it.  What other nation starts with one brother stealing the other brother's birthright through deception while the first worked so hard to provide for the family, and then the thief is exalted?  Jacob was nothing more than a swindler--that was the first incident where Israel (Jacob's later name) took what others worked for.  Yet, Jacob is exalted?

  This crap goes through the whole book.  Joseph using trickery to tax the nation of Egypt.  The nation of Israel destroying innocent people in Canaan, all in the name of joke-hova, simply because they did not worship joke-hova.  Tyrant David boasting about murdering tens of thousands of innocent Gentiles because they did not worship joke-hova, yet Jewish Saul was forgiven for multiple assassination attempts.  And what about Jesus speaking favorably about slavery?  With Paul's backing at that.  And, did they get bashed in that book for this?  No, they got praise!  Meanwhile, they bash women, praise ignorance and bash wisdom, and so tightly regulate sex that anything beyond what is absolutely necessary is forbidden (and even that is grudgingly accepted).

  The whole damn LIE-ble is nothing more than witchcraft intended to enslave the whole world.  And yes, Israel is at it--which is blatant from who started the whole thing when Joshua led them to ruin Canaanite culture and that joke-hova blessed that thing in doing so (and does not change, according to that damnation book).  That book is their own worst enemy if people only stop being blinded by the "If it's in the LIE-ble, it has to be for our own good" mentality.  In fact, if the ADL really wanted to prevent defamation, they would have burned that damnation book and destroyed the religions that are openly promoting slavery.  All three of them.