I don't take the Bible literally . . ?

by patio34 9 Replies latest jw friends

  • patio34
    patio34

    Just a little thought on that subject. Is that like you wouldn't take "Snow White and the 7 Dwarfs" literal? Comparing the Bible to a fairy tale, or myth?

    Or would it be like saying It's a book of parables that one should look for the morals behind the story (you would have to go far on some of those sanguinary stories!!)? Such as in Robin Hood and His Merry Men?

    Or does the phrase indicate that it's pretty much meaningless--the Bible that is? As it it were written literally, but is not true in many instances, so 'let the reader use discernment'?

    If one were speaking of a legal, medical, biography, or any other piece of non-fiction, would that term (not take it literally) ever be used? But, if you were referring to a fictional work, it would be implicit that it was not to be taken literally.

    So, what does it mean to say "The Bible can't be taken literally"?

    It seems to me to be an astute sidestep of the infallibility of the Bible and would not offend anyone. But I just want to know others'take on it.

    Thanks.

    Puzzled Pat

  • Seeker
    Seeker

    When I hear the phrase, I think of the parts of the Bible that indicate reality but could never have actually happened (the Flood, for instance).

    So if you take the Flood as a parable, that's fine. But you can't take it literally.

    Hope that helps.

  • Jigrigger
    Jigrigger

    Hi patio34,

    Adam being the first human: WRONG! It can be easily affirmed that
    humans have been on this planet much, much longer than 6000 yrs.

    Now when this book we call the "Bible" gets off on the "wrong
    foot", so to speak, can one honestly expect the rest of it to be
    any different?

    Jigrigger

  • Flip
    Flip

    "The Bible can't be taken literally", otherwise we’d all be living in a continent resembling present day fundamentalist Afghanistan.

    Flip

  • patio34
    patio34

    Thanks Seeker, Rig, and Flip,

    It seems to be it is a very clever phrase that can be taken to mean:

    "The Bible is not true history, but there are some good morals that can be deduced. And it doesn't have to be taken seriously and is open to many intrepretations."

    This clearly avoids getting into hassles with fundamentalists and doesn't commit the speaker to any beliefs at all! It's entirely politically correct!

    I, on the other hand, in the past 2 months, would probably have started countless arguments and gotten df'd. Would have said something like:

    The Bible is Hebrew mythology and no more to be taken seriously than Greek, Roman, or Babylonian mythology.

    Answer #1 is so much better, and yet honest too. "It can't be taken literally." Neither can Cinderella!

    Pat

  • Amazing
    Amazing

    HI Pat: I think the Bible is much more than mere fairy tales. It is a legitimate history of the Jews and early Christians. The culture of that day, however, had two features affecting their writing. First, their legends were allegorical and used for teaching lessons, values, and morals. We make a serious error in modern times when we treat any of these too literally.

    Second, these ancient people had a very limited level of scientific knowledge, such that they could only write according to how they perceived events. The Flood, for example, was said to cover the world ... but I think it was the Apostle Peter who clarified this by saying 'the world at that time' ... To these ancient people a major flood could have easily been interpreted as the whole world.

    I believe that the Bible has much good in it, and that God's words was contained in it ... but, I cannot accept it as THE whole, entire, and infallible WORD of God. I do not believe that there is any such book. The Bible contains too many errors to be a perfect work of God.

    Amazing

  • patio34
    patio34

    Amazing,

    Thanks--that's a better answer. I was overlooking the Israelite history it contained and records of kings, etc.

    Pat

  • kes152
    kes152

    Amazing,

    Thus are the words of my Lord,

    "You keep searching the SCRIPTURES because you think that by means of them you will have EVERLASTING LIFE........"

    So you CANNOT get "everlasting life" by means of the "scriptures" ....

    "And yet these are they which speak of ME ......."

    And yet you will NOT come to ME that you may have life."

    If you need it in "writing" its in John 5:39, 40 the very heards I heard him say.

    Peace to you,
    Aaron

  • XJWBill
    XJWBill

    Interesting topic, Pat, and one I'm sure all of us freed WT slaves have had to struggle with and answer to our own satisfaction.

    As an orthodox Christian now (Episcopalian), I subscribe whole-heartedly to the essential teachings of the historic Church, as summarized in the Apostle's and Nicene Creeds. And as an Anglican, I believe, as our Prayer Book says, that the Bible "contains all things necessary for salvation." (Which is different from believing all things in the Bible are necessary for salavation.)

    However, we Anglicans have always based our understanding on what is called the "three-legged stool" of Scripture, Tradition, and Reason. (I believe churches in the Calvinist tradition add a fourth leg, Experience.) Each leg balances and illuminates the others.

    So, speaking strictly for myself, I don't see a need to consider every word and punctuation mark of the Bible as coming directly from God. It is not "inerrant," as the many variations in the text from one ancient manuscript to another make clear. However, only a tiny fraction of thousands of variations affect the sense of any significant passages: on the whole, the main thoughts still come through clearly, Bible scholars say.

    So leaving inerrancy aside, what about the question you raise of "literal" meanings? Again, my own view coincides with that of C. S. Lewis, who in his book "Miracles" expressed it better than I can here: it depends on which PART of the Bible you are talking about.

    Remember, the Bible is not one continuous manuscript; rather, it is a COLLECTION of 66 books, written by many men over many centuries. Some of those books were meant, at the time of writing, to be factual histories, like I and II Samuel, I and II Kings, I and II Chronicles; some were meant to be poetic song lyrics, like Psalms and Song of Solomon; some were the record of phophets' deeds and visions, like Daniel, et al. And so on.

    In the NT, you have the Gospels and Acts, which detail the activities and speech of Christ and his disciples; letters written by various Apostles to individuals and churches; and the apocalyptic vision of Revelation, deliberately written in metaphors and symbols.

    So to ask, "Should the Bible be taken literally?" is meaningless unless you are specifying which chapter and verse you mean. Some parts were never meant to be taken literally (the number 144,000 especially springs to mind), while others were.

    Taken as a whole, the Bible comprises a collection of books, selected out of many others written in ancient times, which shows the history of God's dealings with mankind and the outworking of His promise to send a Messiah, a Savior, who Christians believe was Jesus, the Christ.

    Nevertheless, Christians, in my view, are not under obligation to take every passage literally. To use only one example, Origen, an early Doctor of the Church and a great intellectual, wrote in the 2nd century to the effect that "no thinking Christian can believe such an old wives' tale as that the earth was created in only six days."

    I don't feel a need to regard the six days of Creation, or tales like that of Jonah and the whale, as being literally true--they simply embody in metaphor a certain truth about God or man or matters of the heart. In the same way, the patriotic song lyric that goes "Thine alabaster cities gleam" does not mean our cities are literally made of a soft white stone--it's merely a poetic way of expressing a certain view of or truth about America.

    As Mr. Lewis puts it, the earlier parts of the Bible are often real history mixed with a good amount of myth or legend or metaphor. (That there was a real flood of some kind seems to be confirmed by a parallel account in the ancient Epic of Gilgamesh, for example--but probably not literally covering the entire planet.) When we come to the recorded sayings and deeds of Christ and His disciples, we are on firmer ground.

    At which point, I'll stop, because to go further would get into questions of doctine beyond what your original question asked. Besides Mr. Lewis's book, I can also recommend the short overview, "Introducing the Bible" by William Barclay, a scholar of the Church of Scotland, and an entertaining writer.

    Also recommended are Barclay's commentaries on each book of the Bible. He brings in a great deal of history, archaeology, and social customs to enlighten the meaning and context of each Bible verse, and is very good at bringing out the poetic meaning of passages that are sometimes mistakenly understood literally.

    For me, it all comes down to Matthew 22:40 and 25:31-46.

    Peace,

    Bill

    "If we all loved one another as much as we say we love God, I reckon there wouldn't be as much meanness in the world as there is."--from the movie Resurrection (1979)

  • patio34
    patio34

    Thanks for your reply, Bill. It was very helpful. Especially the main point that the Bible is a collection of books, so it would depend on what part one is referring to.

    Thanks,
    Pat

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