Re: Call no one teacher, call no one father

by A Paduan 3 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • A Paduan
    A Paduan

    I read a post that mentioned how, when questioned, rc clergy didn't know how to respond - I'm not sure what the questions were, but I can imagine it would probably be similar to asking someone (B.C.), "What about eagles and hawks - god clearly said good humans shouldn't eat eagles and hawks! So what do you have to say for yourselves?"

    I imagine that they may have simply declined to comment, being a little disturbed and even upset by the state of those pursuing the questions - later to pray for them.

    One could ask them now "What about this?" Call no one teacher, call no one father I've seen clergy respond to such things in a similar manner - understandably I feel.

    Jws see many things as 'victories' - only the 'losers' actually pray for them - perhaps.

  • peacefulpete
    peacefulpete

    Interestingly the title "Father" was used by Mithraic cult leaders. "Rabbi" of course was Jewish. This passage has been understood as an early effort to distinguish the Proto Catholic Christian sect from it's competitors. Ironically later Church leaders felt free to use the title "Father" because they had effectively wiped out the Mithraists and they no longer posed a threat.

  • Mysterious
    Mysterious

    I found this on a website. Maybe it's what you're looking for.

    The following is the correct Biblical quote:

    Matthew 23:9 "Call no one on earth your father; you have but one Father in heaven."

    The key word "your" is in most Bible versions including the King James. The use of this word "your" signifies that only the creator, as Father of the spirit -- that which lasts for all eternity -- is the true "Father." All other references to "father" refer to human beings who in one way or another serve as foster fathers. The argument that "dad" or "pa" or "pop" bears a different significance than the word "father" is to be considered as being close minded. If one calls someone "dad" with the notion that dad is his creator, and believes that this is okay because it does not go against the literal interpretation contained in Scripture, then many messages of Jesus must be considered as rendered useless. The spirit is of God the Father. The material body (that which is mortal) has a human father.

    It should be noted that there are 1,511 references to father, fathers. etc. in the King James version of Sacred Scripture. Most of these do not refer to God the Father. There is no admonition by Jesus or anyone else that these usages were wrong. When Jesus used the reference your father it would have had little meaning if the basic concept of father was not clearly understood by being in common usage.

    • Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh. [Genesis 2:24]
    • Who said unto his father and to his mother, I have not seen him; neither did he acknowledge his brethren, nor knew his own children: for they have observed thy word, and kept thy covenant. [Deut. 33:9]
    • But when he heard that Archelaus did reign in Judaea in the room of his father Herod, he was afraid to go thither: notwithstanding, being warned of God in a dream, he turned aside into the parts of Galilee: [Matthew 2:22]
    • And think not to say within yourselves, We have Abraham to our father: for I say unto you, that God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham. [Matthew 3:9] ? Jesus here made no reference that their concept of "our father Abraham" was in error.
    • And going on from thence, he saw other two brethren, James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother, in a ship with Zebedee their father, mending their nets; and he called them. [Matthew 4:21]
    • And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death. [Mat. 10:21]
    • He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me. [Matthew 10:37] ? This passage clearly shows that Jesus did not consider the natural use of the term father to be in error, for He Himself uses it in this fashion.
    • I write unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I write unto you, young men, because ye have overcome the wicked one. I write unto you, little children, because ye have known the Father. [1 John 2:13]
    • And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised. [Romans 4:12]
    • Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all, (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were. [Romans 4:16-17]

    The use of the word "father," in regards to priests, only means that a priest acts as a spiritual guide under the authority of God the Father. No one in their right mind thinks that each priest is God the Father or that any human being is their creator. Jesus made this statement to help us focus on our true origins and upon that which has lasting value. This type of message is called a metaphor. It is figurative language used as a method of teaching and not meant to be taken literally. It is a way of getting across a message.

    One's human father provides for the needs of this life during growth and also acts as teacher and moral guide for the mind and the spirit. A priest is called father because he is intended to act as a link to spiritual values that otherwise would be without authoritative foundation.

    If one has a concordance -- a catalog of words found in the Bible -- he should look up the word "father" and see the many different ways the term is used in Scripture, particularly in the New Testament. The term "father" in the King James version is used 541 times in the Old Testament and 311 times in the New Testament for a total of 852 times. When Biblical passages are taken out of context and/or interpreted literally one is often going to be in error.

    And this one:

    Doesn?t the Bible say ?call no man Father?? Why, then, do we call our Priests, ?Father??

    Bible Geek's Answer:
    This is a very common question, usually posed to Catholics by non-Catholics of various Christian denominations. Some folks ask with genuine interest, unfortunately others ask in an attempt to ?trap? Catholics or point out supposed ?flaws? in our faith practices.

    It?s actually not that difficult to explain.

    Most people base this question on the verse in Matthew, ?Call no one on earth your father; you have but one Father in heaven.? ? Mt 23:9

    There are just a few points we need to know to explain this verse.

    1. When someone uses this text to say we shouldn?t call our priests ?Father? they?re doing what is called ?proof texting.? Basically, proof texting is when someone takes a passage or verse out of context, and skews its meaning, ignoring the intended and real context of what was being said?er, written, in this case.

    If we read the verses immediately before this one (Mt 23:7-8) and immediately after it (Mt 23:10-11), we see Christ also tell the disciples to call no one ?Rabbi?, ?Teacher?, or ?Master?.

    But the apostles, themselves, guided and inspired by the Holy Spirit go on to call the bishop a ?teacher? in 1 Timothy 3:2, and use the term ?Master? in Ephesians 4:1. St. Paul even says that he was ?appointed a teacher? (1 Tim 2:7). They recognized that Jesus was using the titles as a hyperbole, to stress a point. (See Mark 9:47 for another example of Jesus doing this).

    2. Jesus was trying to show that God transcends any formal or earthly title or distinction?He?s bigger than that, bigger than anything on Earth that could compete with Him. That does not mean, however, that people on Earth cannot participate in Christ?s fatherhood. Remember, when you were baptized, you were baptized ?priest, prophet and king.? (If you don?t understand exactly what that means, ask your parish priest or youth minister just how significant this fact is).

    3. Also, we need to realize more personally and more fully the words in Ephesians:

    ?For this reason I kneel before the Father, from whom every family in heaven and on earth is named?? ? Eph 3:14-15

    This is showing us that, as children of God, we are all intimately ?tied into? God as Father, and all creation is ?wrapped up? in His Fatherhood. We couldn?t escape it if we tried! We participate in God?s fatherhood, each and every time we evangelize or help spread the Gospel message, (read 1 Cor. 4:15).

    We call our priests ?Father? because we recognize their ?fatherly? and pastoral ministry, in the family of God and among the children of God. They shepherd the faithful, and guide us and protect us in a very fatherly way.

    Remember:

    Jesus wasn?t saying that we should ?ban? the word father from our language?if He was, than every time a little kid called their Dad, ?father? they would be committing a grave sin in the eyes of God (that is, if we really took this verse literally).

    If that was the case, than we?d have to shut down ?Hallmark? for making all of those ?Father?s Day? cards.

    We?d be celebrating ?Male Parent?s Day? every June.
    Now THAT sounds stupid.

    For additional verses that use these ?taboo? terms, check out:
    Acts 7:2, Rom 9:10, 1 Cor 4:14-15, 1 John 2:13-14, 2 Tim 1:11, Eph 4:11, Job 29:16, Is 22:20-21, 2 Kings 2:12, Gen 45:8

    Additional links:

    http://www.staycatholic.com/call_no_man_father.htm
    http://www.protomartyr.org/father.html
    http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&safe=off&q=%22call+no+one%22+father+bible

  • Euphemism
    Euphemism

    Mysterious, I assume you don't necessarily agree with the argument you quoted, so it won't be taken as criticism of your post if I say that the reasoning is as good an example of the straw-man fallacy as any the JWs have produced.

    No one is arguing that Jesus was trying to banish the word "father" from the English language. It's obvious from the context (Mt 23:1-12) that Jesus is militating against religious titles or anything else (prominent seats, phylacteries, etc) that appealed to the pride or prestige of religious leaders.

    Basically, the Catholic defenses try to explicate the text into meaninglessness.

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