I've noticed that they are two seperate beings entirely. I just think about the OT circumstances, when wandering through the wilderness God guided Moses and the tribe with a huge smoke cloud during the day and a pillar of fire during the night. To prove that Joshua (I believe) was to lead the people God made dew appear on a rag in the morning and no where else, then when Joshua questioned again he made the opposite occur. He made people be healed by looking at a dead snake, he rained fire and brimstone, he flooded the earth, he made the sun stand still for days on end so that the Israelites could win a battle, sent an angel to write things on a wall, let's not even mention the 12 plagues. In the new testament, he sent a dove of holy spirit to Jesus when baptized, caused an earthquake when Jesus was killed, tongues of fire appeared on 1st century christians, they all spoke every language, and when Saul was persecuting christians God literally made him go blind until he agreed to serve him. What's the last miracle that you heard of? And that stupid show with John Boy Walton doesn't count. I've noticed when we hear of miracles it's all stuff that's simply cooincidental. Like my mother used to say how certain things were miracles like not getting pulled over by a cop when she was speeding. I remember bringing this up once saying, "Well if God were real he'd make a pillar of fire right here to prove it" and then I was told that "God was not to be tested". Maybe I'm just bitter but I'm curious why all this crap could happen in the bible but now if I pray not to fart in the middle of an elevator God can't help me. Any thoughts?
Miracles...
by Tuesday 7 Replies latest jw friends
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Love_Truth
Good question. IMO, it's because those miracles were done away with shortly after Jesus' ransom sacrifice. I feel there is enough evidence to believe in God, and his Son, and his word, that we shouldn't need (big) miracles in our day and age.
However, perhaps there are miracles that stil occur. Life itself is no small miracle, the way we grow and learn, the way we heal after injury, etc. The myriad forms of life; how the Earth heals itself, the natural and physical laws are all miraculous in themselves.
And some people still claim they have witnessed miracles.
Love_Truth- That's my two cents.
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link
Love_Truth, you seem a knowledgeable sort.
Good question. IMO, it's because those miracles were done away with shortly after Jesus' ransom sacrifice.
Can you tell me if anointing was one of the miracles that was done away with at the same time?
This is a genuine question and I would appreciate your thoughts.
link
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Love_Truth
link ,
You wrote:
Can you tell me if anointing was one of the miracles that was done away with at the same time?
This is a genuine question and I would appreciate your thoughts.
I?m not sure about your question, and here?s why: I don?t consider ?anointing? a miracle. Rather, I would define it as a ?ceremony?, or a ?rite of passage?. Why? Well, here?s the definition (American Heritage) of ?anointing? I refer to:
a·noint
tr.v. a·noint·ed, a·noint·ing, a·noints- To apply oil, ointment, or a similar substance to.
- To put oil on during a religious ceremony as a sign of sanctification or consecration.
- To choose by or as if by divine intervention.
Whereas, ?miracle? is defined thusly:
mir·a·cle
n.- An event that appears inexplicable by the laws of nature and so is held to be supernatural in origin or an act of God: ?Miracles are spontaneous, they cannot be summoned, but come of themselves? (Katherine Anne Porter).
- One that excites admiring awe. See Synonyms at wonder.
- A miracle play.
That is, anointing is done to signify attainment of some metric, whereas miracles are presumably performed to lend credibility to a claim, or perhaps strengthen faith.
Perhaps I misunderstood your question?
Cheers, Love_Truth
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link
Love-Truth,
Perhaps I misunderstood your question?
What I was getting at is the JW belief that some people on earth today are anointed with Gods Holy Spirit. ("to chose by Divine intervention", from your definitions)
It would seem that this anointing, like that of first century Christians, was/is a miracle.
Of course, if you don't agree that this anointing can be classed as a miracle then there is no question to answer.
link
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franklin J
Hey Tuesday
I am not sure if I believe any of the Biblical miracles, to me they are more Greek Mythology ( I prefer the Greek mythology)
However, I can tell you that I did pray to ...someone (God?) in an elevator in New York City when the cable snapped and the car dropped . Myself and about 8 other people walked away unharmed.
the more impressive miracles in my life were the arrival of my 3 children. Yes, I know; they are just kids. But the fact is; they are a result of two people who found love and some kind of connection in this crazy existence we call "life". Three perfectly formed new individuals....I am still awed by their prescence in my life.
just my opinion....
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Love_Truth
link,
I see now. Anointing such ones with Holy Spirit is the work of God. But I wouldn't call it a "miracle" because only the person so "anointed" feels so. I feel that if you exercise faith in Him, His Son, and the redeeming power of his Son's ransom sacrifice.and pray to God for His direction and guidance, both in studies of Scripture, and the way you conduct yourself, anyone who God sees fit can and will be "anointed" with His Holy Spirit. So it's still going on, it has not ceased.
I'd also add (not sure if this why you asked) that all believers (except those referred to in 1 Corinthians 11:22-32: 27 Therefore, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. 28 A man ought to examine himself before he eats of the bread and drinks of the cup. 29 For anyone who eats and drinks without recognizing the body of the Lord eats and drinks judgment on himself. 30 That is why many among you are weak and sick, and a number of you have fallen asleep. 31 But if we judged ourselves, we would not come under judgment. 32 When we are judged by the Lord, we are being disciplined so that we will not be condemned with the world. ) should therefore partake of the wine and the bread after they have been prayed over.
That's my belief.
Cheers,
Love_Truth