by TheApostleAK 2 Replies latest jw friends
Get yer Watchtower CDROMs going (I can't use mine cos my CDROM crapped itself)....
I need some stone cold WT quotes on the postion of disassociation. Whether a DA person is treated the same as a DF person? Are they to be shunned? etc etc.
I know in the 70's & 80's a DA person was the same as a DF person but a lot has happened since then and maybe its changed. ("Apostates" seem to like to live in the 70s & 80's particularly around 1979-81)
From The Apostle AK
Hi TAAK.
The article that equaled the position of da'ed persons with da'ed persons was the W81 15/9. (Ray Franz describes that change in COC, 3rd edit., page 347)
In the late 80's there were som articles on how to treat non-baptized persons, although publishers, who had comitted wrong-doing. They were earlier treated in the same way as da'ed persons. That changed to a more liberal view with effect from w88 15/11.
Hope that this can help you out a little!?
cecil
Questions From Readers WT 7/1/84
Once a person becomes one of Jehovah's Witnesses, is he always counted as such?
No, Jehovah's Witnesses are not like religions who hold, 'Once a member, always a member.' A small percentage of individuals choose to disassociate themselves from the Christian congregation or are expelled because they are unrepentant wrongdoers.
On one occasion many disciples turned away from Jesus and "would no longer walk with him." (John 6:66) The Bible also explains that if a Christian unrepentantly practices gross sin, the congregation is to 'remove the wicked man from among themselves' and 'quit mixing in company with him.'-1 Corinthians 5:9-13.
Thus, today, if a Christian falls into a course of sin, a committee of spiritually qualified elders meets with him. They want to see if he is repentant and can be readjusted. (Galatians 6:1) If not, the elders obey the Bible's direction to disfellowship the sinner so that the congregation will be "free from ferment."-1 Corinthians 5:7.
Or, as mentioned in John 6:66, occasionally a Witness on his own initiative will decide to leave the way of truth. He may even make known his decision after the committee begins to look into his wrongdoing. He may inform them in writing, or state before witnesses, that he wants to disassociate himself from the congregation and not be known as a Witness. Then it will no longer be necessary for the elders to continue their investigation. However, the elders would then make a brief announcement of his disassociation so that the congregation will know that he "went out from us." (1 John 2:19) They then will adhere to the inspired injunction 'not to receive such a one into their homes or say a greeting to him, so as not to become sharers in his wicked works
WT 4/15/91 But may the elders themselves take any initiative in approaching a disfellowshipped person? Yes. The Bible shows that mercy is expressed not simply by a negative holding back of punishment but often by positive acts... They leave it to the appointed shepherds to take the initiative to see if such a one is interested in returning.
11 It would not be fitting even for elders to take the initiative toward certain expelled ones, such as apostates, who 'speak twisted things to draw away the disciples after themselves.' These are 'false teachers who are trying to bring in destructive sects and to exploit the congregation with counterfeit words.' (Acts 20:30; 2 Peter 2:1, 3) The Bible also does not provide any basis for searching out disfellowshipped ones who are belligerent or who actively encourage wrongdoing.-2 Thessalonians 2:3; 1 Timothy 4:1; 2 John 9-11; Jude 4, 11. In recent times there have been cases in which an elder happened to meet a disfellowshipped person. Where appropriate, the shepherd briefly outlined the steps to be taken for reinstatement. Some persons like this repented and were reinstated. Such joyful outcomes indicate that there may be disfellowshipped or disassociated ones who would respond to a merciful approach made by the shepherds. But how might the elders handle this matter? Once a year at most, the body of elders should consider whether there are such persons living in their territory. The elders would focus on those who have been expelled for over a year. According to the circumstances, if it is appropriate, they would assign two elders (hopefully ones familiar with the situation) to visit such an individual. No visit would be made on any who evidence a critical, dangerous attitude or who have made it known that they want no help.-Romans 16:17, 18; 1 Timothy 1:20; 2 Timothy 2:16-18. The two shepherds could telephone to ask about making a brief visit, or they could stop by at a suitable time. During the visit, they need not be stern or even cool but should warmly reflect their merciful concern. Instead of reviewing the past case, they could discuss Bible texts such as Isaiah 1:18 and <G<Þ>G>Isa <G<Ü>G>55:6, 7 and James 5:20. If the person is interested in returning to God's flock, they could kindly explain what steps he should take, such as reading the Bible and publications of the Watch Tower Society and attending meetings at the Kingdom Hall.
15 These elders will need wisdom and discernment to determine whether there is indication of repentance and whether a follow-up visit would be advisable. They should bear in mind, of course, that some disfellowshipped persons will never be 'revived to repentance.' (Hebrews 6:4-6; 2 Peter 2:20-22) After the visit, the two would give a brief oral report to the Congregation Service Committee. They, in turn, would inform the body of elders at their next meeting. The elders' merciful initiative will have reflected God's view: "'Return to me, and I will return to you,' Jehovah of armies has said."-Malachi 3:7
As long as someone is disfellowshipped or disassociated, we need to follow the instruction: "Quit mixing in company with anyone called a brother that is a fornicator or a greedy person or an idolater or a reviler or a drunkard or an extortioner, not even eating with such a man." (1 Corinthians 5:11) But this Biblical directive should not affect our view of Christian family members who live with the disfellowshipped person. Ancient Jews reacted so strongly to tax collectors that their hatred was extended even to the family of the tax collector. Jesus did not endorse that. He said that a sinner who refused help was to be treated "just as a man of the nations and as a tax collector"; he did not say that Christian family members were to be so treated.-Matthew 18:17.
18 We ought to be especially supportive of the family members who are faithful Christians. They may already face pain and obstacles because of living at home with an expelled person who may actually discourage their spiritual pursuits. He may prefer not to have Christians visit the home; or if they do come to see the loyal family members, he may not have the courtesy to keep away from the visitors. He may also impede the family's efforts to go to all Christian meetings and assemblies. (Compare Matthew 23:13.) Christians thus disadvantaged truly deserve our mercy.-2 Corinthians 1:3, 4.
This could be just so much crap even if it is up to date which I do not know. The WT/GB has been known to publish one thing for 'public' consumption and tell Witnesses through the 'elder' arrangement a whole other thing. We know this is true of the blood issue, the alternative service issue, and child custody issues. So go figure.
Life is a roller coaster. Get in, sit down, shut up and hang on!
