JW Ben

by OldSoul 2 Replies latest watchtower bible

  • OldSoul
    OldSoul

    JW Ben,

    I am fully aware there are many articles telling Jehovah's Witnesses to prove "the truth" to ourselves. But how? We are told to scrutinize sources that are not the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society. We are told to accept in a sheeplike manner what the "Slave" tells us. This creates an unbalanced examination and an ungainly ability to perceive or distinguish right and wrong.

    Under the subheading "How to Avoid Falling Away from the Faith" The Watchtower article entitled "Distressed by Doubts" (w92 7/15 pp 19-22, paragraph 14) we read:

    We have seen that one of the basic causes of apostasy is a lack of faith through distructive doubt and that the word translated "doubt" also means "to distinguish." The apostate makes himself a decider of what is true and what is false, of what is "good and bad" in the way of spiritual food. He becomes presumptuous. ? Compare Genesis 2:17; 3:1-7

    How can I reconcile this view of "distinguishing" with Paul's directly stated means to identify mature christians at Hebrews 5:13, 14? Diakrinos is the root of the Greek word used by Paul in Hebrews 5:13, 14, yet the WTS teaches that using our own judgement to determine between good and bad food would be presumptuousness leading to apostasy.

    For instance, please use your analytical and reasoning mind (Romans 12:1, 2) to read the context of 1 Thessalonians 4:4 and explain how that single verse taken out of context becomes grounds for expulsion from the congregation if anyone chooses to undergo hypnosis as a means for coping with trauma or for any other purpose. Examine critically the "rationale" behind the proscription against hypnosis, challenge the scriptures used as basis for contextual application, and you tell me if you agree that it represents a teaching that "originates with God." (1 John 4:1)

    If there is even one teaching that currently goes or did go beyond what is written, those who brought that teaching are clearly identified by 1 John 4:1 as False Prophets. Do False Prophets later become True Prophets? What basis is there for believing that?

    Even if it can be conceded that increasing light would take the form of clarification of Scriptural understanding, where does the scriptural basis for "new light" come from? I can't find that anywhere, except in cases of divine inspiration (Peter's revelation leading to Cornelius' baptism with holy spirit, Paul's resisting the men from James on the issue of circumcision as described in Galatians, etc.) but would be happy to consider any Scriptural examples you have to share.

    During the period of the foretold apostasy what would true Christians be expected to do? Would they be attaching themselves to an organization that was more nearly adhering to God's Word, or would they distance themselves from any organizations that did not adhere to the entirety of inspired scripture?

    If they are wrong about 607 BC, then they are wrong about 1914.

    How would Jews have understood John 10:16 at the time of Cornelius' conversion? Who did the 1st Century christians believe the "other sheep" to be? What did they think "this fold" was, if not natural Jews? They took that comment as clear indication that Jesus' had already hinted that Gentiles also would be brought in, to eventually outnumber natural Jews.

    They explain the number 144,000 is literal because 1) the number is stated twice and 2) the lamb is literally singular. Revelation 7:5-8 breaks this 144,000 down into 12 different groups of 12,000. The number 12,000 is repeated 12 times. They explain that the groups of 12,000 are figurative, not literal. Why? If they are wrong about the 144,000, then they are wrong about the "administration."

    Try this exercise, noble-mindedly. Use their numerology (as found in Revelation Grand Climax) on 12 to the power of two times 10 to the power of three.

    1st Century christians freely claimed divine inspiration, did not reach doctrinal decisions as a result of a vote or show of hands, taught that the spirit vested teaching authority in many individuals in the congregations, did not burden fellow christians with endless guilt through comments regarding what "mature" or "loving" christians would think or do, and did not silence anyone who spoke with the backing of God's Word.

    Currently, neither the Governing Body nor the faithful and discreet slave claim any divine inspiration, decisions made by the Governing Body are made with a 2/3 majority vote, the Governing Body - under the pen name "faithful and discreet slave class" - assume all the teaching authority of the apostles without any claim of inspiration by spirit, adherents are constrained by reams of guidelines for living as a mature Christian with very little need for individual perception, and the Governing Body expels any who publicly differ with their opinions thereby insuring the illusion of unity by silencing individual voices.

    The much acclaimed unity is an illusion, a massive case study in Group Think behavior. When individuals are isolated from the group their thinking changes. You probably know the mechanics involved in that process. If you think through the causes of Group Think and compare that with Paul's recommendations to the Gauls and the Hebrews you will likely find all the logical cause you need to separate yourself from those who would rob you of a key responsibility before God - your responsibility to think for yourself. (Romans 12:1, 2; James 1:5-8; 1 John 4:1; Philippians 1:8-10; Galatians 6:1-10; John 14-16)

    So when I am asked "Where is this leading? Where will you go away to?" my response is simple: "Where were true Christians going during the Great Apostasy? If we are still in that time period, where should I go, somewhere other than the Bible?"

    Respectfully,
    OldSoul

  • lonelysheep
    lonelysheep

    Have he PM'd you yet?

  • OldSoul
    OldSoul

    JW Ben,

    *** g03 7/8 p. 27 Is Hypnotism for Christians? ***Could a Christian "hold a good conscience," if he allowed himself to be put into a state where he could not fully control his thoughts or desires or even his actions? (1 Peter 3:16) The Bible admonishes: "Each one of you should know how to get possession of his own vessel in sanctification and honor." (1 Thessalonians 4:4) Clearly, hypnosis would hamper one's ability to follow such counsel.

    I agree with your concern that in context 1 Thessalonians 4:4 has nothing to do with hypnosis. So why does Awake! say, "Clearly, hypnosis would hamper one's ability to follow such counsel." It isn't clear that this Scripture applies to this teaching on hypnosis.

    There are many other examples of direct misapplication of the intent of Scriptures to support a Governing Body stance. In this case, the misapplication is connected to an offense that carries the penalty of disfellowshipping. So, does this clear misapplication of Scripture originate with God? If not, then, according to 1 John 4:1, there is only one alternate source.

    1 John 4:1 Beloved ones, do not believe every inspired expression, but test the inspired expressions to see whether they originate with God, because many false prophets have gone forth into the world.

    If the basis for the disfellowshipping is not Scriptural, then is the disfellowshipping from God? If not, then who is the source? Men? "Do not put your trust in nobles, nor in the sons of earthling man, to whom no salvation belongs." (Psalms 146:3)

    You were wondering how this relates to "distinguishing." It relates in that we are told to distinguish between right and wrong while the Governing Body has eliminated many areas the Bible leaves open to conscience by putting a fence around the law of the Christ. This "protective" fence is also unscriptural. It is exactly what the Pharisees did with the Law of Moses, which Jesus condemned them for.

    Respectfully,
    OldSoul

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