Was Paul epileptic?

homme perdu

I watched a Discovery Channel program on Paul yesterday. It showed that Paul was epileptic due to certain descriptions regarding his health in the scriptures. Also he displayed symptons which is a feeling of superiorty, dismissing all views except your own.

Deputy Dog

homme

Also he displayed symptons which is a feeling of superiorty, dismissing all views except your own.

Sounds like most of the people on this board, what is your point?

D Dog

BluesBrother

Also he displayed symptons which is a feeling of superiorty, dismissing all views except your own.

Bloody cheek!

I am not the only epileptic to use this board and take exception to that stereotyping generalisation. Anyone that knows me will say that I am the most reasonable of people

Btw, I would like to know upon what evidence they based that statement - not your fault homme perdu

trevor

As I understand it, epileptics lose touch with reality occasionaly - In Paul's case the condition was permanent.

minimus

Paul sounds likes a typical Jehovah's Witness.

Leolaia

Here is a post that examines the evidence for and against this:

http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/10/79554/1296121/post.ashx#1296121

Rabbit

Epileptic rabbit here !

Everyone KNOWS people who have epilepsy are just normal folks...well, normal as you can be with a demon inside you. If you remember...all of the people who had a demon that had to be 'exorcised'...had symptoms exactly like epileptic seizures !

So-o, Paul would have had to have his ~~demonz~~ epilepsy cured before becoming a good Christian. Witches...remember all the 'witches' that were burned alive or drowned ? A lot of them had seizure symptoms ...that is all it took to get accused.

Here is a 'fun fact': Back then...it was believed a 'witch' could NOT be drowned. So-o...they would lower the accused into the water for 20 minutes or so, IF the person was alive after all that time...guess what? They were 'witches'. You guessed it...if they were d e a d they were innocent !

Tough court !

We are still stereo-typed today. And we are only superior to the rest of you insignificant little people...because we have "Billy Bad Ass Demonz" to help us ! So...there !

Demon Rabbit

Rabbit

bttt

BluesBrother

Since this thread is still running, i can repeat the comment that I made in the thread that Leolaia linked us to.

My experience of grand mal seizures is that one is totally blacked out, with no 'visions' or mental recollection of any kind. It is not even like sleep. I feel that time has jumped forward, like a badly edited home movie.

As to the assertion that epileptics cling unchangably to their opinions, well, I am here after admitting that my previous life as a dub was wrong, so what about that?.

I still feel that the WT comment on Pauls affliction being partial blindness is reasonable. He said on one occassion "See with what large letters I have written in my own hand", on another occasion he did not realise that it was the High Priest that stood before him

Discovery Channel likes to give an airing to theories , that is ok. Just as long as they are not presented as absolute truth

Leolaia

Rabbit, BluesBrother....As I pointed out in the referenced post, it is a specific kind of epilepsy that is refered to -- temporal lobe epilepsy (TLE), that may indeed have auditory hallucinations, derealization, autoscopy, and other features as part of its pre-ictal aura. In no way is this supposed to be typical of all forms of epilepsy, nor are all TLE seizures supposed to be the same, and one's own personal experiences with seizures may range from no aura at all to severe cases of it. Suggesting that Paul had some form of epilepsy is not the same as claiming that Paul's experiences were typical of epileptics.

It is also very speculative to try to diagnose someone post-mortem using only literary texts. It will never be provable whether Paul suffered from TLE. At the same time, TLE seems to be one of the best candidates for Paul's illness because it explains a greater number of symptoms and traits discussed in the literature than other possible conditions (such as migraines, partial blindness, etc.). As I went into in my earlier post, it isn't just the fact that Paul fell to the ground in his conversion experience (which itself could well be a fictional element composed by the author of Acts) or that he described sensations consistent with pre-ictal auras. Paul's expectations of being spat upon because of his illness and being buffeted by "an angel of Satan" are especially suggestive of epilepsy, for the literature of the time uses very similar language to refer to epileptics. The physical pain that he experienced after his visions (which prevented him from enjoying them too much) is also suggestive of post-ictal headaches that can occur in some patients with TLE. (BTW, the auras precede the ictal event itself -- they don't occur when the patient blacks out). Partial blindness, on the other hand, does not explain the physical pain, the hallucinatory and out-of-body sensations, the spitting and "angel of Satan" references that the TLE explanation could accommodate.

I agree that it does no good to stereotype anyone, and the comment attributing Paul's "feeling of superiority" to epilepsy is quite a dubious and unnecessary comment.

Was Paul epileptic?

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