Posts by umbertoecho

18

THEOCRATIC KENOSIS: the Watchtower Organization's ultimate goal for humanity

by TerryWalstrom in

ever wonder why jehovah's witnesses have almost nothing but words instead of love?.

every wonder why jw's praise their corporate leaders rather than jesus?.

every wonder why faith is only demonstrated by allowing children to die and molesters to escape, or disasters to be welcomed through obstinate demonstrations of loyalty to the org?.

umbertoecho

Thank you for this post Terry.

It's very true that once a person has emptied themselves out...so to speak.....in order to take in the religious instruction of the JW religion; only to find they are a very cold breed of people who are confused about their own teachings and afraid of their history.........And once a person starts to investigate this religion and finds the many many changes to doctrine......Well. Everything sort of falls apart for them. Myself included. We have become so hollow we don't know where to turn. I think there is a saying from a Jesuit source about " ...give me a child until he's seven......and you can have him back after that...." Not the best paraphrase I fear, but close enough to the point. A child raised in this religion will rarely find freedom or the peace "within" once they have been taught that everything outside of their version of Godly living is wicked or evil........especially other religions.

This was the case in my family where only one remains fully fixed into their beliefs and practices. Nothing can shift this sister of mine when it comes to extending the sort of kindness or mercy to "all" that believe in the Christ. No matter how nice they are, they are not good enough and very likely they are blinded by Satan and their good deeds are suspect........, for they are still in "the world". She has been avidly awaiting the end for so long now that both she and her husband are unable to think in any other way. Interestingly, they have recently taken out insurance for their respective funerals. This says a lot me about whether they can allow themselves to re-enact the 1975 fiasco that they completely bought into.

In those days, and unbeknown to me.........Armageddon loomed hugely for them. They were planning their lives around it. She was particularly cold toward me in those days, refusing to have me visit. ( I wasn't baptised or close to it. Just living my life and raising children) I had no idea that the end was just around the corner..........It was three years ago, after commencing to study again. That I discovered all of this incredible turmoil and change that had occurred. I feel they were shaken up when all of this happened but they re grouped around their faith or religion even tighter in some ways...(barring the funeral fund) Now it is totally impossible for them to leave, for what will they go to? Their entire lives are coloured by the associations formed in the kingdom hall and the shifting doctrines. They are not happy people by any standard, they have one son who is an elder.........a snotty upstart type and another who was gifted but didn't quite make it and so is on drugs and very likely damaged to the core with an inner guilt.

Must stop here for I didn't intend to go on and on and on...........

.

2

changing user name

by umbertoecho in

i really need to change my username.

could someone assist with this please

umbertoecho

I really need to change my username. Could someone assist with this please

2

Supreme Court of Canada Overturns Ban on Physician-Assisted Suicide

by Heaven in

epic news today in canada!

this has been a long time coming and i for one am glad.

i have no qualms about using this if i'm not aging well.. supreme-court-overturns-ban-on-physician-assisted-suicide.

umbertoecho

I need to delete my account or change my user name. I can't find out how to do it or how to contact the moderators.

Could some one help out here

39

Doing away with Calculating How Close we are to THE END

by FusionTheism in

the watchtower study edition, august 2015, "keep in expectation!

" article:.

paragraph 3: "after looking forward to the end of this system for what may seem to be a long time, however, some may wonder, do we still have sound reasons to keep in expectation?

umbertoecho

The witnesses who came to my door, when pressed by me about how long they thought we had before Armageddon said. " We think it will come in our life time". This woman was about sixty years of age. My family are saying the same thing too with a great sense of anticipation or eagerness. A young sister, about thirty years of age, came to see me last year to ask me to hurry up as she felt the end was so very close. She felt worried about the things she had done wrong and was trying to put right. She has never done anything particularly bad, except to fret because she has not married and had a child. She said that this was selfish of her and she should be content with what she has. The poor woman has been reproved twice in 2014 for partying and going on a few dates.

So, essentially they really do think the end is just around the corner again.

10

What do we have to say to ourselves about this video...we are being exposed..

by jdub1991 in

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rdvt_gyq-ls&feature=youtu.be

umbertoecho

Don't fret, many would have watched this and may still be digesting the information and ramifications of it. You are not left hanging here. I watched it early this morning from Australia and I was upset but not surprised. I wonder where this was done and other such things but the main issue is that there is "exposure" of this damaging religion and a riveting and heartfelt atmosphere in all that she conveys.

9

The visit with elder and wife outcome

by umbertoecho in

where to start in regard to my visit with the elder and his wife; a wife who sat mute throughout the discussion.

they arrived on the dot and we engaged in talk about the weather.

this could have gone on for some time but i brought it around to the reason for this particular visit.

umbertoecho

FayeDunaway

I was wondering when someone would come up with that one. A bit of satire never hurt anyone did it?

9

The visit with elder and wife outcome

by umbertoecho in

where to start in regard to my visit with the elder and his wife; a wife who sat mute throughout the discussion.

they arrived on the dot and we engaged in talk about the weather.

this could have gone on for some time but i brought it around to the reason for this particular visit.

umbertoecho

stuckinarut2 I don't know why he chose to start this discussion on the topic of abuse. Perhaps he is aware of the negative press that is swarming the online community. Perhaps it is due to something my own sister mentioned, as she is in that hall. She had tried to drag me into this discussion of the societies purity once. I could not accept her position on it and therefore the societies. She, of all people, new of our past but developed amnesia. All this led to me refusing her white washing methods as per the society. She flung insults to my retreating back I recall.

So who knows why this happened.

Doc, I have no doubt that this is the conclusion that will be reached and a sad one at that. I had always believed so solidly in this religion.

Steve2 I tend to agree in this opinion and wonder if it is worth the exhausting effort. The main intention here is conversion. Considering I was a month away from baptism, I suppose I am or was considered "One that got away"

westiebilly 11 I thought it was risky of him to choose such a scripture as that written by Paul. It proved nothing at all. What it did do, was cause him to flounder as it dawned upon him that he was actually agreeing with me to some degree.

The point is, I am not trying to score points or brag. I think it would be saner for me not pursue this study with them as it will lead to some huge misunderstandings. It really is time for me to let go of this hopeless hope that I have clung to for decades. This site has enabled some of that decision making along with another. I suppose I will go it alone and place complete trust in my imperfect reasoning powers.

9

The visit with elder and wife outcome

by umbertoecho in

where to start in regard to my visit with the elder and his wife; a wife who sat mute throughout the discussion.

they arrived on the dot and we engaged in talk about the weather.

this could have gone on for some time but i brought it around to the reason for this particular visit.

umbertoecho

Where to start in regard to my visit with the elder and his wife; a wife who sat mute throughout the discussion. They arrived on the dot and we engaged in talk about the weather. This could have gone on for some time but I brought it around to the reason for this particular visit. My reason was that I felt "books" by man, were not authorized as the word of God, that the only word is and has always been, the bible. He ignored me completely on this point, totally ignored this opening. What he did commence with was really strange.......It was his history of abuse as a child.

He launched into his experiences and the damage they had done to him. This lead, he said, to memory problems and the like. After about ten minutes I stopped him by saying that I was not interested in this subject for it plagues every form of society upon earth; including yours'. He did a physical sort of jerk of his body, as though I had hit him. I then reiterated my desire to speak about the things in the bible and discuss them in a friendly manner that would be beneficial to all of us.

This lead to an observation I had made concerning the pronouncement by God, at the end of his creative span.......and he saw it was good. This brother did not like my reasoning on this and commenced to search for scripture to prove my thinking wrong. I let him know that this was a good thing and that I would stand totally corrected but not upset if he should do so. I would like to add at this point, that he was lecturing me in a fashion as to how I could imagine that God would create anything less than perfect. So I tried to clarify my position on this perfection word. I won't need to go very far with you, suffice to say that I raised the issues of the Edenic garden, the daily discussions with God, the command not to partake of a certain fruit, the jealousy of Satan, the temptation to go against this command/warning..... using free will........................... My point being that this perfection may just well be, that of a spiritual perfection to compliment this physical perfection. I included every Angel in this. He could not accept this angle and searched about in Paul's letters, wherein, one of them says that there are degrees of perfection. I said that degrees of perfection did not match a God decreed and absolute perfection.

He then raised the issue of the Pharisee's in calling Jesus "Good Teacher" and how Christ immediately referred them to a higher source of good teaching in God. To which I said that this may well strengthen the point that even Christ would not allow them to pervert his standing before his Father, thereby showing that Christ was aware of a future challenge in a mortal form. This being his faithfulness to the end. Whereupon this would show him to be absolutely the most perfect of all humans who had ever lived. And so it went. This man could show me no other scriptures and did not try to.

He asked me if I believed that God was responsible for this worldly state of things.......NO

Do you believe in the Trinity? No

Do you believe in the authority of God. Yes.

In the end it was a sort of mish mash of a visit, with one potentially redeeming outcome ( barring that he may be marking me for future exclusion at meetings.) They agreed to visit and only use the bible at these visits. I then took a method and said, it they wished they could prepare in the form of questions from the Organized book. Not on. Doesn't matter really for I have this book. What we agreed to was that we would pick a topic. In this instance I suggested resurrection. He did start to brag, really he did start to brag about the JW knowledge of the bible as opposed to all other religions. That made me stop him short. Straightaway I pointed out that the bible has been scoured for clues and insights, going on two thousand years now and that this was not about lambasting another religion. "Please don't do this as I find it arrogant and dangerous" Were my words. How could he genuinely refuse me this request in the face of what we are about to do? Perhaps in his mind he is sorry for me. Who will ever know? I do know that this experience was NOT faith strengthening in regard to the WTBTS assertion of an all encompassing and even superior knowledge of scripture.

31

Catch phrases used by the GB

by stuckinarut2 in

i read a comment on another thread that made me think of this topic.. how many catchphrases are used by the gb and organisation in an attempt to control or gain power or prevent questioning?

feel free to list as many as you can think of!.

i'll start:.

umbertoecho

$ KIngdom Interest Rates $

31

Catch phrases used by the GB

by stuckinarut2 in

i read a comment on another thread that made me think of this topic.. how many catchphrases are used by the gb and organisation in an attempt to control or gain power or prevent questioning?

feel free to list as many as you can think of!.

i'll start:.

umbertoecho

Isn't the Celestial chariot originally of a pagan origin? Egyptian beliefs have the sun being dragged across the sky by a fiery sort of horse drawn chariot. Other; old faiths have something like this too. The GB is using pagan analogue to promote a faith, using a slogan. Wonderful, riveting stuff

I know there is mention of chariots in the bible, but this is not the oldest source of such a thing. It is pre dated by many other cultures.