my thread was inspired by gentledawn's insightful comment about the effect the events in wales had on her jw husband.... hope any lurkers out there can filter out the signal (storys and experiences like this) to noise (the current trolls running amok on the forums) ratios.
this the problem with those who focus on outrageous fantasies about the watchtower.
it distracts from the real issues that need to be highlighted.. what happened in wales was for real.
(Am I the only one who reads Focus's posts and pictures Jeffrey Goines?)
Anyway, no, I was never in contact with either Obed or Big Ray. I just posted on their boards sometimes. I'm sure with the skills you indicate you have, you could tap deep into the web and sniff them out if you wanted.
Ann (of the 'that's your lot' class)
my thread was inspired by gentledawn's insightful comment about the effect the events in wales had on her jw husband.... hope any lurkers out there can filter out the signal (storys and experiences like this) to noise (the current trolls running amok on the forums) ratios.
this the problem with those who focus on outrageous fantasies about the watchtower.
it distracts from the real issues that need to be highlighted.. what happened in wales was for real.
Witnet and Big Ray's WOL! Wow.
Ann (of the 'gonna search my old hard drive' class)
video of convention online for download .
the english international convention program presented in east rutherford from june.
20 to 22, 2014, will be available for viewing beginning friday, june 27, 2014. the spanish international.
Thanks!
Cross-referencing: http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/280669/1/2014-Convention-Audio-available#.U7V8AJRdXYk
i continue to be stunned by posters reporting on the convention, lamenting the convention, complaining about going in serve-us and meetings, and yet continuing to participate in these activities.. a simple question.
how long have you done these things, fully knowing it is absolute bullshit?.
i couldn't handle it for more than six months before i basically outed myself.
LG, yes it's a loooong time! 2nd and 3rd generation in an area where we have roots - harder. In the end, I was the one trying to hurry along our fade, but hubby was (for all sorts of understandable reasons) too afraid/cautious to take the next steps. The last years were a tremendous strain on us as a family. Then a set of circumstances presented itself - a hole in the fence, as it were - and I knew it was now or never. So we took a deep breath and ran for it.
Very perplexing for our long-time acquaintances at the cong. The ever-present elephant is ignored by most (apart from 'we miss you'). The one family member who we knew would take it hardest is acclimatizing. I understand the attraction of cutting one's losses and having closure as we still have to be careful and anxiously look over our shoulder at times but, overall, we are much happier, much more relaxed, and for the moment (for as long as possible) we have normal, cordial relationships with JW family.
a discussion of this talk on friday morning deserves its own thread.
as i said elsewhere, it was a remarkable one.
the speaker was manfred vencebi (google him - he's a bethel bigwig) and some of his remarks are real gems.
Apognophos - Yes. Exactly! LOL.
i continue to be stunned by posters reporting on the convention, lamenting the convention, complaining about going in serve-us and meetings, and yet continuing to participate in these activities.. a simple question.
how long have you done these things, fully knowing it is absolute bullshit?.
i couldn't handle it for more than six months before i basically outed myself.
Hubby about 20 years. Me about 10 years. Children are out too now. The "touching loyalty and devotion" was to our JW families, not the Org. - a bigger picture to be considered; lots of patience and little steps required. There comes a tipping point, however, when it really is time to go, which is different for everyone.
bibl3thumper has posted a youtube of the celebrations that took place for german delegates.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvs6_q7rqps&feature=em-subs_digest.
it's hard to believe that they are now using the kingdom hall to sing pop songs and for dancing.
A DRUM KIT? In the Kingdom Hall?
Songs from Satan's world being sung and danced to? In God's house of worship?
I'm surprised fire didn't come down from heaven and devour them!
*** w10 5/1 p. 31 What is a Kingdom Hall? ***
"So the name Kingdom Hall, which was coined in the 1930’s, appropriately describes the purpose of these buildings—to promote true worship and serve as a hub for the preaching of the “good news of the kingdom.” (Matthew 24:14) Thus, Kingdom Halls are not used for social or commercial activities."
*** w91 12/1 p. 19 par. 13 Practicing Pure Religion for Survival ***
"Jehovah’s Witnesses respect their Kingdom Halls and larger Assembly Halls as places dedicated to Jehovah’s worship. Unlike many churches of Christendom, Kingdom Halls are not social clubs."
Having said that, it was a really nicely-made, souvenir video (OK I didn't watch the whole thing but skipped parts) and it was good to see a little creativity (and there was only a little but hey, it's a typical cong.) and spontaneity, shaking off some inhibitions, displaying more of their natural personality. They need more of those kinds of gatherings at the KH, imho.
my friend, mike works as a massage therapist, and there is a woman at the shop that is super-jw-woman and is constantly hounding him with things.. today, he's messaging me and he tells me that she was trying to push a brochure or something on him.
he said he'd really rather not read a religious pamphlet.. so... she says, "it's not religious... it's from god.".
isn't that kinda what religious means?
"No, no, we're not here to convert you. You can only convert yourself. [Smile]" That was one line we had.
After the donation arrangement came in, and we came across 'No salespersons or canvassers' signs:
Householder: "What are you selling?"
Me: "We're not selling anything. We've come to talk to you about the Bible's hope for the future."
Often that made the householder relax a little.
Then one day a man answered with: "Yes you are trying to sell me something."
Me: [Laughing] "No we're not, we're only here to t... ."
Man, cutting me off: "You are trying to sell me a religion."
Me: *ding* "Um, well, um ... " Damn. He's right.
And there's the one where we'd try to reassure challenging householders that we were very interested in truth and if the truth could be found elsewhere, we would follow it (then we proceeded to reject any home-truths the householder tried to give us).
The thing is, we really believed what we were saying. I wasn't lying when I said those things. Deluding myself (and consequently the householder), yes!
a discussion of this talk on friday morning deserves its own thread.
as i said elsewhere, it was a remarkable one.
the speaker was manfred vencebi (google him - he's a bethel bigwig) and some of his remarks are real gems.
So, because there are abuses in technology, it is not a good way to measure progress?
It's not a good way to measure progress "in this world." It is a good way to measure the progress of the Organization. Hence the trashing of 'worldly' technological advancements while bigging up any technology the Org. has made use of.
to me af's.
see below for more on af.
"prominent" (lol!
Antioch -
problemaddict - I know! Having Antioch/DrivesLikeJehu here! I remember him from Touchstone too (lurking, never joined, can't recall if Wrench ever invited me or not). Some great discussions.
Phronesis posts on Bnet occasionally - usually on the 'safer' subjects like Trinity-related stuff.
Newt, yes he's still there touting his fantasy version of JWism - we've had many spats and I like to show him up when he's telling porky pies or passing off drivel as truth. Good fun when I have the time.
Yes, it's a shame about Solomon. Our last online encounter ... well, he was rather contemptuous of me but no hard feelings as I was an anony-WT-critic who raised his hackles; I did once know a different side to him.
APOLOGIST (Ed Andrews) - you never heard? Read this!
Focus, is it paranoia or is everyone really out to get you? Btw, did you know Ros? (Another RIP.)
Ann (of the 'Memory Lane' class)
