Onager

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Posts by Onager

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  22

  “There’s nothing out there in the world for you...”

  by Jules Saturn in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  how would you guys react if or when you were told this phrase by a jw while having a conversation?

  another phrase is “this world...” or “this system, like gum will chew you up and when it’s done with you, spit you right back out.”.

  one i’ve been personally told was from a convert that had told me “whenever i speak to young ones that want to know if the grass is greener on the other side, i tell them i was a part of it.

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  Onager

  Laughter, just laughter, honest, from the gut laughter. Possibly even a bit of slapping of the thigh and a wiping of a tear from the eye.

  That's how I'd respond.
  
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  89

  Do you believe in god?

  by freakyAL in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i used to be a staunch believer in god.

  maybe its technology and science advancing so much thats got me doubting idk.

  do you believe in god?

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  Onager

  I'm atheist. I went through a period of saying I was spiritual rather than religious, then I said I was agnostic, then agnostic atheist before finally settling into atheism.

  I can't say I'm an Agnostic atheist because although I don't know, my current belief is that there is no god. After all, I'm not an agnostic unicornist, I just don't believe in the existence of unicorns. Show me evidence for either and I'll change my beliefs.

  Similarly I realised that what I was calling spirituality was actually entirely within the natural world. My reverence for nature or that feeling of awe looking up at the stars was a result of the amazing capacity of my human brain and not because of something "more" than reality.

  I have to say though that if, incredibly, the god of the bible did suddenly manifest themselves unmistakably, I would become a theist through not having any other choice, but I would not become a worshipper. The horrific things that god has done, the malicious, cruel, but above all, stupid decision to hand out their instruction manual to a tiny group of people in the form of a book! And then leave it in the hands of countless scribes and translators so that almost any interpretation can be taken from it.

  That alone would make me rather die than submit to being ruled by such an inept overlord. But when you take into account the cold cruelty of what would then be revealed as their creation: The orcas playing catch with a live baby seal, the Ichneumon wasps laying their eggs inside living caterpillars which are then eaten from the inside while still alive, the mallard ducks gang raping females to death and, of course, the worm that eats children's eyeballs. If a god manifested themselves and took credit for creating that deliberately then I say shame. shame on you, now kill me and be done.
  
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  36

  is armageddon starting ?

  by stan livedeath in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  the sky is so dark here in the south of the uk.

  could be armageddon starting.. or then it could be dust particles in the atmosphere..

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  Onager

  There were a couple of people in the office this morning saying "It's the end of the world!". Admittedly it was tongue in cheek... but I think it does say something about human nature that the first response to any change in the environment is that it means the end of the world!
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  16

  Avatar image or whatever it is called

  by amicabl in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  could someone please tell me why my image is either sideways or upside down.

  i feel an utter fool asking this question but i can't find any help anywhere.

  sorry..

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  Onager

  Did the picture come from a phone or tablet? It may be upside down but a phone or tablet will automatically turn it the right way up.

  Try opening it in Windows Paint and see if it's upside down in that. If so, you can rotate it in Paint and save it to sort out the problem.
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  44

  Did you leave the JW RECENTLY? Really? Recently? WTF were you thinking?

  by The Real Edward Gentry in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  not to be overly harsh...but if you just left, what the hell were you thinking?

  between 1995 and now, you never did an internet search of "jehovahs-witness" or "watchtower"?

  good god.

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  Onager

  I think that the answer to the OP is that the trigger that awakens people is almost, if ever, logic.

  The reason is that logical thinking has itself been subverted by JW conditioning. After all, if it was simply a matter of assembling and assessing the facts, then there would be no JW followers. None.

  If you accept the premises that the world is full of evil people and that anyone who speaks against the JW organisation is an apostate who only tells lies. If you accept that the GB are, at the same time, fallible humans and yet divinely directed\inspired, then it doesn't matter how rational, intelligent or logical you are. In fact! These attributes will work against you as you will use those abilities to defend and reinforce your beliefs.

  The factors involved in a trigger that awakens people are complex and almost random. Take the child abuse scandal for example. In theory that should be enough to awaken 100% of JW's. But a percentage of those on hearing about the child abuse scandal will "Wait on Jehovah", a percentage won't believe it at all and some will even not have heard about it at all. Of those that would be woken up, some will remain JW's through fear of losing their family, some through fear of death at Armageddon and so on. It's a minor miracle when all the factors align for a single person to wake them up.
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  33

  Using history as a means to pinpoint possible future events.

  by HealthySkeptic in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the purpose of this thread is to share some history with the community.

  i am an active jw.

  the reason i picked this forum is due to the openness and ease with which information can be accessed.

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  Onager

  Bertrand! The best of the Russells! (compared to Charles T).
  
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  Shunning accountability – To god or men?

  by sinboi in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  i have met this brother a few times after i da’d.

  in the past, when i met him, he was with another jw.

  i am sure he saw me but he just continue walking, pretending not to see me.

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  Onager

  Is that a trick question?

  It's men of course! That's obvious by your example.

  It's obvious in a thousand different ways, have you ever tried debating the existence of god with a JW? It's pointless, yes, but the argument can go on for hours. Try debating that the governing body are a bunch of fallible, corrupt men and Boom! You're instantly branded an apostate and the conversation is over. God is abstract to them, but the GB are real.
  
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  64

  Free to sin but still cannot bring myself to do it

  by sinboi in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  have da'd myself nearly 3 months ago.

  now i am part of this world but i feel myself the odd one out.

  something inside me is still blocking me to do the things i have been longing to do while i was still a jw, such as attending birthday parties, sex, etc.... just last nite, i was on the way to attend a birthday party.

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  Onager

  Hey Sinboi,

  One of the things I've found as I've got older is that I can't stand to watch "Real" violence in films. As I have settled down as an atheist I see more and more the sanctity of all human life. We are only here for one short chance at existence and the thought of that being taken away is too horrible.

  Perhaps if you didn't watch too many of those kinds of films you wouldn't get so affected either?

  (When I say real violence I mean violence that really happened, like war films, or violence that could happen like the Saw films. I enjoy films with fantasy violence like Aliens, although I do fast forward some of the more grisly moments tbh.)
  
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  33

  Using history as a means to pinpoint possible future events.

  by HealthySkeptic in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  the purpose of this thread is to share some history with the community.

  i am an active jw.

  the reason i picked this forum is due to the openness and ease with which information can be accessed.

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  Onager

  Hi HealthySkeptic,

  Just addressing your topic "Using history as a means to pinpoint possible future events":

  Have you read the second epilogue of Tolstoy's War and Peace? In it he expounds on his theory of the tides of history and how it's the infinite minutiae that dictate it's future course. That idea runs through the whole book actually, which is well worth a read, I can't recommend it highly enough.

  Have you also considered the Foundation series by Isaac Asimov? These books explore the idea of predicting the future by examining the past and then going on to try and manipulate it.
  
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  72

  What was the biggest thing that convinced you that

  by Ponyo in

  1. jw
  2. experiences

  .....the truth was not the truth... ?

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  Onager

  What was the biggest thing that convinced me that the Truth was not the truth?

  FACTS! :)

  If you have a moment, please look up a youtube video titled: "Bertrand Russell - Message To Future Generations."

  it is a wonderful summary of how to approach your question and, indeed, all questions.