Posts by frankiespeakin

82

Yet another example of how silly the Bible is...

by Abaddon in

okay, let's go along with the flood story for a moment, to the point where noah exits the ark.. here we have noah, with two of each animal and seven of the clean animals; maybe a few dozen animals that were not essential to the future survival of the species.. what does god do?.

tells noah he can eat animals now.. are you telling me an all-wise, all-knowing god isn't capable of better planning than that?

which strikes you as more likely?

frankiespeakin

Abbadon,

I'm also having a laugh at people who will accept the bits of the Bible they know are false as allegory/etc. (rather than Bronze-age understandings of the world), but are equally happy to accept things that cannot be proved false due by assumption true; as I have pointed out, a god allowing a book with such an important message to be full of so much rubbish compromises the believability of the rest, which is illogical.

Your assumptions of it being illogical and rubbish, maybe due to not understanding the purpose of Scripture??? It's purpose is not to provide proof of God's existence, by relating scientific knowledge, that is far advanced of the concepts of the people to whom the word was originally spoken.

The first five books of the Bible, form the written contract, between the Isrealites and Yahweh. While Abraham worshipped the Lord, that cannot be said of the Israelites in general, they were for the most part polytheist(pre-national). The book of Genesis establishes status. Yahweh is portrayed in the poetical genera, as the creator of all things, and alone to be worshiped. The first three chapters of Genesis help establish clearly in the mind and concepts of the Idol worshiping Israelites, the status of Yahweh as creator, and everything else as creation. Since the Israelites as well is all the nations around them worshiped many parts of the creation as different god's,, in order to enter into the Law Covenant, or contract, they had to understand, as Moses stated "Yahweh is one" that he was the only true God, and everything else demoted to the status of creation. This was no small task, since polytheism was everywhere during that time the Law covenant was given to the Israelites. The poetic narrative of the first three chapters of Genesis, which describe God in anthropomorphic terms, are clearly poetic in nature, not meant to relating scientific knowledge, the purpose first three chapters of Genesis is not to give accurate history of the developments of creation, most assuredly it is not written with scientific language, that is common to our 20th-century, but in poetic metaphor, commonly used, during that time the Law was given to Israel.

To expect the Bible to answer scientific questions about creation, is inappropriate, and leads many fundamentalists, holding to a position that is untenable, and in my opinion, shows a lack of real understanding as to the purpose of Scripture. This of course in no way endangers their salvation.

the Bible in general is just what you'd expect; a flawed historical account of a people with added made-up bits.

The Bible does contain a prehistory of the nation of Israel, that is not altogether accurate according to our 20th-century way of explaining history. But the fact that there is such a thing as Biblical archaeology, where the Bible is used as a guideposts, in its discription of some of the history of the near East, should atleast taken into account, in forming one's opinon of the biblical account. Biblical archaeologist, according to my studies seem to feel that the history in Genesis starting from Abraham at the 12th chapter to be very accurate, that is according to archaeological excavations in Mesopotamia and the near East. Whereas chapters one to 11 seem to be covering great lengths of time, with less accuracy for details.This of course is common in ancient literature. There seems to be no consensus however as to how the information was obtained or compliled in forming the book of Genesis, espesially the early chapters, but the fundamentalists on the other hand seems to have it all nailed down(joke), and is very sure that it was compiled by Moses under strict control of God's spirit which would not allow for even the slightest error. These of course are speculations, and must be viewed as such. Perhaps archaeologist as they continue to be granted permission to dig into sites that are currently off-limits to them, perhaps then more information will become clear. I must say that many archaeologists have a deep respect for the Bible and its accounting of events. Although I wouldn't value the opinion too greatly a fundamentalist archaeologist because he has a peculiar way of interpreting information that has to be along the partyline. Where as others not so black and white in their veiws seem to be much more reputable.

12

GB on a Self Self-Destruct Course

by frankiespeakin in

jw
friends

the governing body continues to surround itself with yes-men.

protected inside the walls of watchtower's brooklyn bethel, they have practically no contact with the real world.

which means that the aging members of the governing body have little or no contact with anyone that can offer them corrective criticism.

frankiespeakin

Integ,

In regard to the Society monitoring "apostate" websites, I would think that they definitely do it. I would think they probably give that job to guys that are really hard core loyalists who have to pass some secret test or something.

I was only giveing my opinion, you very well may be right. Nonetheless, if they do have someone, they are sending him on a deadly mission, one that must cause them great anxiety if true. Maybe one of these days, someone will start posting on the board telling us about how they were sent by the Society to check out the Internet and wound up getting deprogramed.

It is in their best interests to keep themselves abreast on what's going on here, so they can off-set it, and we all know that the Society is all about doing what's in their best interest.

Yes, it is in their best interest, but I guess it's a tossup isn't it?

12

GB on a Self Self-Destruct Course

by frankiespeakin in

jw
friends

the governing body continues to surround itself with yes-men.

protected inside the walls of watchtower's brooklyn bethel, they have practically no contact with the real world.

which means that the aging members of the governing body have little or no contact with anyone that can offer them corrective criticism.

frankiespeakin

The governing body continues to surround itself with yes-men. Protected inside the walls of watchtower's Brooklyn Bethel, they have practically no contact with the real world. Which means that the aging members of the governing body have little or no contact with anyone that can offer them corrective criticism. For example how many people do you know inside the watchtower organization that can speak frankly with governing body members, apart from their wives. This type of sterile environment where desire to offer constructive criticism, can be met with disfellowshipping, has gotta be a breeding ground for all sorts of idiocy, comparable at least to the same idiocy that occurs through constant in-breeding of the human species. For that one reason alone I would say they are on a self-destruct course.

They have created an organization of organization worshipers,

where contrary opinions are evil, threatening, and should never be expressed, or felt. This is a sterile environment for creative thinking, were only the partyline can be voiced. The monster they have created will eventually eat them up.

Their rules will continue to get more and more foolish, even though they changed them to implement damage control.

The Internet has offered the greatest challenge of all to the watchtower, and they are losing ground, I think the watchtower is terrified of the Internet. Hey, they don't even mentioned their own web sites in the publications. Sometimes I wonder if they're really aware of what is on the Internet, because they are so afraid of it. they no doubt have very few that they can trust personally to check it out for them. I'm even willing to think that probably The only ones that have official authority to check things out on the Internet are probably only governing body themselves, because they are too afraid to have anybody else doing it, for they know the very real consequences of such actions, and serious repercussions that could come from somebody officially assigned by the governing body to investigate the Internet as to what things are being posted against the watchtower bible & Tract Society.

I don't think the GB, are very comfortable anymore, and they probably shit their pants, on a regular basis, over all the bad publicity that has been unleashed in recent years.

82

Yet another example of how silly the Bible is...

by Abaddon in

okay, let's go along with the flood story for a moment, to the point where noah exits the ark.. here we have noah, with two of each animal and seven of the clean animals; maybe a few dozen animals that were not essential to the future survival of the species.. what does god do?.

tells noah he can eat animals now.. are you telling me an all-wise, all-knowing god isn't capable of better planning than that?

which strikes you as more likely?

frankiespeakin

The Flood account in Genesis, can not rightly be interpreted as global. One has to be reasonable, and realize that Noah or whoever wrote genesis had no idea what the "earth" was.

When the ancient book of Genesis speaks about the "earth" it is speaking of dry land.

Why does everyone read the bible with 20th century concepts, and not use a little insight and recognize that it was originally written to people with far different concepts than we have today. I would figure some like Abbadon would know better, since he seems to know some science.

To even imply that genesis is talking about the whole earth(in our modern concepts), displays a lack of reasonableness. If you are reading an ancient document to properly understand it you have to understand the original audience, and what they thought and how they veiwed things.

To think that God would comunicate to an ancient people in our 20th century concepts and not their is shows a lack of comon disernment. I thought you guys rejected fundamentalism and all its non-sense.

37

Will the Internet bring down the watchtower Bible and Tract Society

by frankiespeakin in

jw
friends

in the united states i keep hearing about how nobody sees the witness is going door-to-door and more, or at least not as often as they used to.

i also heard a report from england recently which stated to the same effect.. what do you think?

do you think the internet is the watchtower society's worst nightmare?.

frankiespeakin

One of the nicest things about the internet and its bringing down the WT is that there will alway be surprises!!!

Because you never know who's it's going to bring together? When you think of it, the watchtowers has hurt a lot of people, and somewhere along the lines they are going to hurt too many of the wrong people,.. some genius, or financially powerfull person, or some legal eagle, that can do a lot of damage to the watchtower, someone that knows how to pull all the right strings, and knows all the right people. It's bound to happen eventually, the more enemies they make. With the Internet making easy access for these people to get to know one another. The Society must be very worried as they see sites like this one increasing!!! and they see more and more people visiting these sites. They must know the more enemies they make the more difficult it is to deal with the problems this banding together causes and they have made a lot of enemies and will continue to make more, and more enemies in their under-handed treatment of people that gave them their trust.

I see a big snow ball rolling down the mountain and it is headed for the WT and its GB.

37

Will the Internet bring down the watchtower Bible and Tract Society

by frankiespeakin in

jw
friends

in the united states i keep hearing about how nobody sees the witness is going door-to-door and more, or at least not as often as they used to.

i also heard a report from england recently which stated to the same effect.. what do you think?

do you think the internet is the watchtower society's worst nightmare?.

frankiespeakin

Wow, I can't beleive all the positive responses to this thread. I definately see a trend here that is very good and encouraging.

At this time I would like to give a special warm, thank you to those who have websites that do a wounderful job exposing the watchtower Bible track Society you deserve our support and commendation for the money and time you put into a very worthy cause. I think your motives are good. It's so encouraging to see my search engine pickup so much expose on the watchtower every time I use my search engine. Makes me want to cry for joy. All thought I feel sorry for those that have sacrificed so much to the WT whore, my joy still is not diminished in the least.

Shake, and tremble WT your day are numbered and you will go down in great shame.

4

Fooled, Controlled, and Abused by the watchtower.

by frankiespeakin in

i first got the "trufh" when i was 19. knowing little about the bible being a catholic, i was searching for god, and was too trusting and too naive to see that i was being brought under watchtower mind control.. for 29 years, i let the watchtower tell me how to think, tell me how to interpret scriptures, and that was painful for me, coming out of mind control, is an unpleasant experience, dealing with cognitive dissonance, having your whole life turned upside down,.

when i found out the watchtower is a false prophet, i warned my family the best i could.

and for that i was rewarded by the watchtower bible track society with disfellowshipment, with subsequent shunning by many close family members and close friends.. .

frankiespeakin

Nos,

I'm guessing you've already got something happening.

Not in the courts, at present. In reality we all have a legal case against watchtower Bible and the tract Society.

I think the laws of the land are slowly evolving to better protect the rights of its citizens. Observing this trend, gives me reason to believe the days are numbered for the watchtower to hide behind laws which were origenally designed to protect its citizen's rights of freedom of worship. What is happening to the Catholic Church I think it's just a small precursor, to what is happening in the the justice system of the United States, and other developed countries. Please don't misunderstand,.. I'm not a legal eagle. I'm just observing the trend, which makes me very hopeful that the watchtower could be bankrupted by legal battles.

In this legal battle I think the Internet will play a very important part in uniting people, to battle the WT very economically and win. I Strongly feel we are just in the beginning, of something that will snowball. Man's intelligences is increasing,.. through progress is not always in a straight line up, but has its ziggs and zaggs,.. but progress does eventually come, in thought, and his sense of justice, this I feel is evident from our examination of history of laws in general.

4

Fooled, Controlled, and Abused by the watchtower.

by frankiespeakin in

i first got the "trufh" when i was 19. knowing little about the bible being a catholic, i was searching for god, and was too trusting and too naive to see that i was being brought under watchtower mind control.. for 29 years, i let the watchtower tell me how to think, tell me how to interpret scriptures, and that was painful for me, coming out of mind control, is an unpleasant experience, dealing with cognitive dissonance, having your whole life turned upside down,.

when i found out the watchtower is a false prophet, i warned my family the best i could.

and for that i was rewarded by the watchtower bible track society with disfellowshipment, with subsequent shunning by many close family members and close friends.. .

frankiespeakin

I first got the "trufh" when I was 19. Knowing little about the Bible being a Catholic, I was searching for God, and was too trusting and too naïve to see that I was being brought under watchtower mind control.
For 29 years, I let the watchtower tell me how to think, tell me how to interpret scriptures, and that was painful for me, coming out of mind control, is an unpleasant experience, dealing with cognitive dissonance, having your whole life turned upside down,. When I found out the watchtower is a false prophet, I warned my family the best I could. And for that I was rewarded by the watchtower Bible track Society with disfellowshipment, with subsequent shunning by many close family members and close friends.

Governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses you and I have a score to settle!!!

I am willing to leave it in God's hands, and pray to the judge of all the earth for justice. Does that mean I will not use what is ever at my disposal, to see I get justice? God's word tells me to be patient, I think I am, but there's always room for improvement(I'm imperfect).

Wisdom, from God is what I pray for, to be used by him, to sink a stone in the forehead of Goliath(WT) like little David did. Am I dreaming? Perhaps. Or maybe God put it in my heart. These things are always hard tell, I pray to God often that he will help me neither be too hard nor too soft on this false prophet who destroys lives, who uses people like toilet paper to wipe their excrement with.

I think there is such a thing as righteous indignation, you just have to make sure you don't go overboard. One good thing about indignation it makes you concentrate. I pray to the Lord and I think he's impressed in my heart, that the reason my family is still under control of this cult is to give me concentration that comes from indignation. Because if my family were all out I might just forget about this cult, but because they're still in and shunning me I have indignation and with indignation comes concentration. It is a serious thing when someone claims to be God spokesman and misleads those wanting to have fellowship with God into bondage, and service to them free of charge, (cheap labor to make your organization grow).

I know many here, don't want to lose their families. And I feel so sorry for you all, the more time you have invested in this organization, but the deeper their hooks in your life to control you, to shut you up. I can understand why you would want to be silent to friends and family about the miss-deeds of the watchtower. You have my deepest sympathy and I wish you all well. It is a terrible thing to lose family and friends, practically all the friends you've ever known.

This is why I pray that all the governing body get to feel, the actual pain of shunning, through personal experience or impressions from the Holy Spirit convicting them of there sins in their consciences. I think that's a fair request of God, will he grant it? He is so much wiser than me, if he doesn't he has a good reason I trust him.

I feel this in my heart.
Pray with me for God by his Holy Spirit to carryout justice in our legal case against the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses.

37

Will the Internet bring down the watchtower Bible and Tract Society

by frankiespeakin in

jw
friends

in the united states i keep hearing about how nobody sees the witness is going door-to-door and more, or at least not as often as they used to.

i also heard a report from england recently which stated to the same effect.. what do you think?

do you think the internet is the watchtower society's worst nightmare?.

frankiespeakin

In the United States I keep hearing about how nobody sees the witness is going door-to-door and more, or at least not as often as they used to. I also heard a report from England recently which stated to the same effect.

What do you think? Do you think the Internet is the watchtower Society's worst nightmare?

I mean when you use a search engine and type in watchtower, or Jehovah, or Jesus, or witnesses, Jehovah's Witnesses, 99% of yuor hits are against not for the watchtower!

You think the governing body is shi++ing in its pants? Overall this information and bad publicity on the Internet. Do you think they are losing sleep at night worrying about who the next traitor could be inside the organization? They must worry about lawyers going bad that work for them? Or some disgruntled, disfellowshipped person going berserk seeking revenge?

Judging from the District convention's talk on " beware of the voice of strangers" I think they are plenty nervous, and are wondering what their final outcome is organization, will be.

9

Difficult moment in service

by Drew in

jw
friends

i was out in service last week and a gentleman (mid 40s, i'd say) asked me about 1975. i answered that it was overzealous brothers, etc... he was very insistent with me and i ended up telling him that i would get back to him after speaking to an elder for further clarification.

have you guys ever encountered that?

i heard about a similar situation once but i am wondering what the best way to handle it is.

frankiespeakin

Wow how everybody must have changed, this is bring back old memories or what?