The hearing's complete now other than Jackson's evidence. Jackson will have to convince Stewart that he shouldn't appear. The commission's already said that his father being very ill is not going to be sufficient on its own to excuse him. There'll be a report out relatively soon from the commission, and McClellan has said that at some point in the next 2 1/2 years the JWs will be called back to demonstrate that they've made changes. So this part is pretty over other than Jackson, but it's not the last of it.
Mephis
JoinedPosts by Mephis
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6
Jehovah’s witnesses hearing adjourned
by InquiryMan indoes anyone know if this is a temporary decision?
will it continue?
or is the hearing completed?.
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Questions Regarding All Those Lawyers
by Magwitch inapologies if this has been addressed elsewhere.. has every elder called to the stand had his own personal attorney?
it certainly appears this way.
if this is the case, how are they able to afford this?
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Mephis
There was a senior counsel for the WBTS and the branch staff, and one for the still-in elders. Monty Baker had his own. As did each of the survivors. Angus Stewart was counsel for the commission.
There was some tag-teaming (judging by a couple of whispered 'thank yous' between counsel) by the counsel for Baker and the survivors when they were trying to get the points made onto the record.
Believe that the commission provides counsel, or at least financial support to employ one for individuals. Not sure on how it works for organisations and whether the two used by WBTS and the local elders were provided for them or whether one or both were paid for by the WBTS.
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ROYAL COMMISSION: ARE JWS TAUGHT TO REFRAIN FROM SWEARING ON THE BIBLE OR NOT? JW.ORG PLEASE EXPLAIN!
by steve2 induring yesterday's rc proceedings (wednesday 5th august 2015), one of the victim's lawyers questioned mr vincent toole, the jw organization's legal counsel for the australian branch office.
she asked him why at least two of the jw elders who gave evidence last week refused to swear on the bible.
mr toole appear puzzled by her question and said he did not know.
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Mephis
It's not directly named as theocratic warfare in the 15th November 2004 WT which covers being able to say anything but the truth when under oath and it would "cause needless harm" to the borg.
Just to agree with Diogenesister. Swearing on bible was taught to me as wrong in 80s and 90s Britain because of Matt. 5.
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Attorney General: JW congregation didn't report child abuse
by betterdaze indelaware attorney general: sussex co. jehovah's witnesses congregation didn't report child abuse.
by associated press 1:47pm, august 5, 2015. the delaware attorney general's office is suing a jehovah's witnesses congregation in sussex county, claiming that elders failed to report an unlawful sexual relationship between a woman and a 14-year-old boy, both of whom were congregation members.. oral arguments in the civil action are set for november.. authorities say elders learned in january 2013 that katheryn harris carmean white was having sex with the boy and failed to immediately call a child abuse hotline.. the congregation's attorney argues that the elders are protected by clergy privilege from the reporting requirements, similar to the confidentiality of a church confessional.. carmean white, who worked as a teacher's aide at seaford middle school, was later convicted of rape and child endangerment and sentenced to six years in prison..
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Mephis
Darn that Satan wanting criminal matters reported to the police so criminals can be caught and punished without delay. -
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Did you hear that!? His Honour is insisting that Jackson attend the Royal Commission
by umbertoecho ini actually started clapping at that point, as his honour explained to the wt type creep sycophantic slithery lawyer that........" i understand that we all have issues to face in life and .....that is a part of life...........however it has become obvious that this man ....is in such a position to assist with this investigation.....".
it boils down to the fact that stewart outright accused the latest witness of misleading the royal commission and this lead to some document searches which led his honour to conclude that they had been protecting mr jackson.
this was a warm and fluffy moment folks.................brilliant stuff!!!!!
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Mephis
@sir82 - in Britain, there's not really a right there in the first place (bar for CofE clergy - and that's not been tested for a few hundred years). Courts will generally try to work with the religion to avoid having to bring out the stick to get them to testify. In the US, it tends to be the other extreme, although I think Zalkin has been pressing against its application for JWs in recent cases on these grounds? -
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Did you hear that!? His Honour is insisting that Jackson attend the Royal Commission
by umbertoecho ini actually started clapping at that point, as his honour explained to the wt type creep sycophantic slithery lawyer that........" i understand that we all have issues to face in life and .....that is a part of life...........however it has become obvious that this man ....is in such a position to assist with this investigation.....".
it boils down to the fact that stewart outright accused the latest witness of misleading the royal commission and this lead to some document searches which led his honour to conclude that they had been protecting mr jackson.
this was a warm and fluffy moment folks.................brilliant stuff!!!!!
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Mephis
JW claims to ecclesiastical privilege very different to Catholic one in relation to secrecy of confession. That's the part which Stewart absolutely ripped into. They lose it because it's not between penitent and one elder. It's because it's between penitent and the elder, and all the local elders, and the CO, and the local branch and mother in Brooklyn... oh and then anyone who then gets access to the file at a later date.. If they did have any hope of trying that defence in Australia again, Stewart's just given the template for ever prosecutor in Australia to have it dismissed. I'd imagine they'd have found it quite handy given the consequences of not reporting criminal matters... -
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My thoughts on Geoffrey Jackson
by thedepressedsoul infirst off, i don't think that dude is going to show face.
he's most likely on a plane already.
if he shows it's bad pr and if he doesn't show it's bad pr.
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Mephis
I don't think he gets the option to run away? Wouldn't he be an Aussie citizen with an arrest warrant in the States for refusing to testify in court? Not sure that works out well for him, let alone the GB?
Never heard Jackson speak publicly, let alone met him so no idea how it'll go. I'd imagine he'll just read scriptures and miss the point at every opportunity whilst disowning any responsibility for anything other than interpreting the bible for fellow workers who then apply it in their own lives. There's a moral cowardice at the heart of the WBTS.
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Geoffrey Jackson's powerful role in the WT
by Splash inif anyone knows which committees gj sits on or what some of his responsibilities are, can you please post here with supporting quotes.
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Mephis
Can't edit, but just to confirm he's still on the teaching committee too. (O'Brien's testimony to counsel for the commission today.) -
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Australian branch co-ordinator Terrence O'Brien gets called out for lying to the Royal Commission
by Mickey mouse inwatch from 1:47:00 as angus stewart of the royal commission investigation into child abuse calls out the australian branch co-ordinator for lying about geoffrey jackson's role on the governing body.
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Mephis
Absolutely agree with that Listener. O'Brien was asked about how long he'd been in country. Answered 'one or two weeks'. It's been three weeks. Any member of the GB could have accepted the invitation and so allow Jackson to attend to his father. But as they're happy to hide in Brooklyn and pay multiple millions in damages rather than turn up to a court, well, I think McClellan is right that there's room here for Jackson to attend to the responsibility of being in charge of a religion which fails those inside it. -
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Geoffrey Jackson's powerful role in the WT
by Splash inif anyone knows which committees gj sits on or what some of his responsibilities are, can you please post here with supporting quotes.
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Mephis
Bio given on his appointment. WT, 15th March 2006, p.26.
Brother Jackson started pioneering in February 1971 in Tasmania, the island state of Australia. In June 1974, he married Jeanette (Jenny). Shortly thereafter, they were appointed to serve as special pioneers. From 1979 to 2003, they served as missionaries in Tuvalu, Samoa, and Fiji—island nations in the South Pacific. While in the islands, Brother and Sister Jackson also contributed much to the work of translating Bible literature. Beginning in 1992, Brother Jackson served on the Branch Committee in Samoa, and from 1996, on the Branch Committee in Fiji. In April 2003, he and Jenny became part of the United States Bethel family and began to work in the Translation Services Department. Soon thereafter, Brother Jackson was made a helper to the Teaching Committee of the Governing Body.
What the teaching committee does, WT, 15th May 2008, p.29
TEACHING COMMITTEE: This committee oversees the instruction provided at assemblies, conventions, and congregation meetings. It arranges spiritual programs for Bethel family members and has oversight of various schools, such as Gilead School and the Pioneer Service School, as well as of the development of audio and video programs.
According to O'Brien, today, in testimony to counsel for the commission, Jackson is now on the Writing Committee, which does cover translation work but also a lot more.From WT, 15th May 2008, p.29
WRITING COMMITTEE: It is the responsibility of this committee to supervise the putting of spiritual food into written form for publication and distribution to fellow believers and the general public. This committee answers Bible questions and approves such material as drama scripts and talk outlines. It also oversees the translation work done worldwide.