He's deliberately being evasive and McClellan's picked him up on not answering the question. I know there's a charitable view of this, but I'm more inclined to think this is deliberate. The phrasing is too careful, too ambiguous.
Mephis
JoinedPosts by Mephis
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236
Royal Commission live streamingstarting soon!
by possum inaugust.
mon 3 (cont) fri 7 .
public hearing: case study 29 into jehovah's witnesses, sydney.
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236
Royal Commission live streamingstarting soon!
by possum inaugust.
mon 3 (cont) fri 7 .
public hearing: case study 29 into jehovah's witnesses, sydney.
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Mephis
Super question from BCG's counsel. Outside of what parents tell children, there is nothing to guide children how to handle something like abuse from a parent. This idiot has just missed the point with mentioning the new Caleb and Sophia video. Which does nothing of the sort. -
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Like and Dislike buttons
by KateWild ini have been visiting and commenting on jwn on my phone and have had a lot of success.
the only thing is a couple of times i have hit the like or dislike button and can undo it.. simon could you add a way to help us uncheck a mistake..... i am not too concerned about the like button as much a the dislike....i wouldn't want to discourage any posters .
kate xx .
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Mephis
Yeah, just done it by accident here. Seems to have reset - so you thank you to whoever has done that. -
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Human rights issue
by possum inhi, i am possum and have been posting for a short time just thought i would introduce myself with much trepidation.
i am a third generation ex witness.
grandparents originally lured into cult in 1920 after the death of a precious child.
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Mephis
Sorry possum, the dislike on that last post was because I'm using phone and it should have been a 'like' (fat thumbs here). I'm so sorry you and your's went through so much inside that vile cult. I hope the commission has treated you kindly and that there will be some redress for you as you heal. Good luck with your university course. -
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Jehovah's Witnesses "Handling Child Abuse Matters" flowchart
by jwleaks injw leaks courtesy of the australian royal commission.
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Mephis
The letter signed by W.M Lloyd to be associated with this is pretty dynamite. It queries a number of instructions from Brooklyn which would seem to have been intended to try and reduce the amount of co-operation elders would give to the police in Australian states with mandated reporting. (Letter is WAT.0004.001.0014 and dated 29th October 1997).
To quote from it:
"Secondly, we are not sure why only a simple statement [recording someone as a 'known' abuser] should be placed in the file. If the matter is to be reported, it is quite likely that the elders will later be called to testify when it is brought to court. If that happens, then would it not be better to have a complete record on file of the contents of the statement made to the authorities? Is there any reason that we have overlooked for not having a complete record of the statement given on file?"
This isn't negligence, this is deliberate.
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Jehovah's Witnesses "Handling Child Abuse Matters" flowchart
by jwleaks injw leaks courtesy of the australian royal commission.
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Mephis
The document id for the file is in the top right hand corner. (WAT.0012.001.0013) It's dated 29 October 1997, and has some related notes with it.
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Jehovah's Witnesses "Handling Child Abuse Matters" flowchart
by jwleaks injw leaks courtesy of the australian royal commission.
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Mephis
Just look where they think reporting child abuse to the police is appropriate. These utter morons will send two elders to ask whether someone who has been accused of a serious crime would like to confess, and then report to the authorities. If two or three witnesses go to them, they'll report it and then go and tell the person accused that they've reported them to the police.
It would be humorous if it weren't such a recipe for very serious consequences.
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JW EXPERT WITNESS FLOORED BY COMMISSION OF INQUIRY LAWYER
by steve2 inmuch has already been written about dr monica applewhite, the expert witness hired by the jw organization.
her job was to provide "expert" testimony to the australian commission of inquiry into jehovsh's witnesses' policies and practices on child sexual abuse.
astonishingly, dr applewhite was unprepared for the inquiry lawyers' questions.
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Mephis
Applewhite's problem was that she was reviewing the literature without any understanding whatsoever of the context in which that literature would be read. Stewart's line of questioning was brilliant in opening that aspect up, and also forcing her to step away from 'defence expert who wrote a review of literature devoid of context' into 'professional child protection expert'.
But her reports have fed the JW view of themselves. That they are different, that they are God's chosen organisation, that they do everything better than anyone else. For them, that's the point they are defending. They see everything as 'one bad apple' or 'a failure of parents'. They are absolutely blind to the concept that their religious practices, beliefs and formal procedures create the climate where not only can abuse continue unchecked, but which may also contribute to abuse happening in the first place. That's going to be a very hard concept for them to grasp. I don't think they ever will. They've not even fully realised that they have a duty of care here, in spite of losing cases in at least two countries on that issue.
Instead, it's far easier to retreat into the idea that this is Satan persecuting them, trying to force them to deviate from God's written word, and to treat it as 'war' where they are required to fight against it. In what could be a collaborative process, that stands out. The commission's suggested already that they've noticed 'antipathy' towards secular authorities. To me, much of the elders' evidence has already shown that. Bowditch's comment on him telling a 'close friend, if I associated with them' outside the congregation stank of it, for instance. His comment that he hadn't read the statement of the survivor because he "wanted to be truthful" too. And Ali's failure to mention that they had a confession as well as other witnesses. But to his mind, that was ok, because the confession didn't count and the other witnesses weren't 'reliable'. They're rationing the truth until pinned down under direct questioning and demonstration that they've been misleading at best.
How do you force this cult to come to realise they have issues here? When to admit them then destroys their own self-decreed exceptionality? And to properly address the issue would require some major doctrinal changes?
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JW EXPERT WITNESS FLOORED BY COMMISSION OF INQUIRY LAWYER
by steve2 inmuch has already been written about dr monica applewhite, the expert witness hired by the jw organization.
her job was to provide "expert" testimony to the australian commission of inquiry into jehovsh's witnesses' policies and practices on child sexual abuse.
astonishingly, dr applewhite was unprepared for the inquiry lawyers' questions.
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Mephis
[edited because posted inwrong tab. Sorry.]
But persecution complex, "missed the point" said the commissioner, not a surprise the WBTS felt this report was appropriate. Not a surprise that even that was because the expert hired hadn't a fricken clue what she was reviewing meant.
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WT Lawyer trying to force His Honour to allow Miss Apple to garner more info showing how good WT is
by umbertoecho inhello to all who are watching.
his honour is being tested by wt lawyer in the last thirty minutes of day 4. the lawyer wants to bring in updates on the societies handling of child molestation cases.. his honour tells the lawyer that if he "lawyer" wants a contest between who is better than who....forget it.. his honour is slightly pissed off as wt lawyer just won't back down and insists that this evidence is very important and........"progressive" ( i think ) his honour then continues to tell nice wt jerk type lawyer, that if he thinks this will dispel all that happened to past victims..........think again.. i rough summary but fairly accurate people......god, that wt lawyer is a hateful lying, scheming son of a bitch........
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Mephis
I think she had a few moments of epiphany on the stand yesterday. Being guided through why Group Therapy was going to be a huge problem for JWs by Stewart just illustrated how ill-equipped she was (is?) to even to begin to state expert opinions upon even their literature.
Her comments at the end seemed to indicate, as Listener suggests, that she won't be repeating the same mistake as she has been making.