Posts by gonzobear

138

Jehovah God is Real

by TakeOffTheCrown in

there are many on this site that do not believe that jehovah truly exists; that he is not a real being.

but, he is as real as next breath you draw into your nostrils.. some of you say that there is no evidence that he exists.

yet, none of you can prove that he does not exits.. cofty, (you come to mind), i appreciate that you have stated, without reservation, that you do not believe that god exists.. yet, you cannot prove it.. hope in jehovah..

gonzobear

If you cannot prove God doesn't exist, then by extension of the same logic, you can't prove he does exist. Caught in this state of uncertainty, unable to either prove or disprove - although I believe there's far more evidence God doesn't exist than does - all we are left with is choice, the choice to choose to follow a God who largely seems to be a fiction varying between religions, with varying degrees of severity, or to not follow God. I chose and would make the same choice time and time again, not to follow the God of the witnesses, in good conscience I couldn't follow a God that harsh and severe who distorts the idea of all godly qualities beyond recognition. Nor would I want to follow a religion who have disseminated the bible in the way they have.

I believe all Gods were invented by early humans as a way to explain things they didn't understand, but science and knowledge easy replace these early ideas, and so now, there is no need for God.

Whilst you might feel you've put burs under seats, there's certainly not one under mine.

101

HELP needed from folks in UK, esp. in Scotland!

by WTS Archive in

jw
friends

tl;dr: if you live either in scotland or in other parts of uk and you don't mind traveling, you might be able to help a fellow ex-jw by being present during a courtcase where she alone has to face more than two dozens of jws who have ruined their business.

please contact me directly for details on when and where the court case will be held (i will know these details in few days probably).

ps.

gonzobear

They obviously have differently bible trained consciences to that of my ex-husband who just tried to take me to court over access arrangements with my daughter, he did take me, but I didn't contest the motion, but he's a witness as are his family who submitted affidavits.

Surely this is a matter of employment law? Did the witnesses employed have contracts, you can't just not turn up for work.

Even a link to the trial date and what court it's in - those should be on the court of sessions' website - would help.

16

Publisher death nail.

by Chook in

i have done this exactly as quoted more than once.

i ask elder if it's better to hide serious sin or reveal, of course we know the answer.

then i ask them to explain elders book page 38 paragraph 19, which say it's sometimes ok for elder who has committed immorality and has kept it secret to continue serving as elder.

gonzobear

Sorry, this 'e. For example, the sin may involve past child abuse, and this would likely disqualify him for many years' - the language indicates that even a past sin of child abuse wouldn't necessary exempt an elder from serving, only that it likely might. Wow. So much wrong with all of this. Does anyone know if the charity commission have seen this paragraph?

3

BBC Radio Four Comedy Centering Around Leaving the Witnesses.

by gonzobear in

i heard this on the radio last week and thought it was really powerful, amazingly radio four referred to the witnesses as a religious cult, which i thought was progress.

it's a strangely tough listen, i'm sure many of you have been through similar, i know i was, and to hear it presented as comedy seems to add an extra punch.

it's great to see true life stories gaining some media traction.

gonzobear

I couldn't find it on here when I searched, thanks for the heads up. It was amazing, really brave for Radio Four too.

10

Week 16 Since My Disfellowshipping - Update

by pale.emperor in

hi guys.

i could really do with you advice regarding my current state since being disfellowshipped 16 weeks ago.. since being given the boot (i did try to fade but it failed) ive been on a rollacoaster of emotions.

lately im getting frequent headaches, tiredness and i have about 3 or 4 thoughts running through my mind at all times.. im passed the sadness phase of discovering it's a cult.

gonzobear

I am so so sorry and sad to read what you're going through. As with all things this pain you feel WILL pass. I left when my daughter was 3, and it was terrifying. It's terrifying to be so alone. I faded and so had occasional contact with my mother - that's gone now she has branded me an apostate, and honestly, it's easier without her - but it was the worst time in my life. You are strong for leaving, and for seeing it as it is. Firstly, keep this knowledge you're strong close. You're loving for not rejoicing in other's pain. You're also seeing the good in others, seeing that people with true Christian values help others.

Your worries about your daughter - she will see them as they are. Your influence and experiences will open her eyes, she won't want to join them. She might be conflicted for a few years, and that's going to be a tough one. My daughter is now 11, and she detests the witnesses - her father is still in - she sees the hypocrisy and lack of love and has made her own conclusions. Kids are smart.

It does get better. Try and find ways to make new friends. I volunteered for a charity after I left and it changed my life, opened my eyes to the good in the world and helped build a new set of friends. Now my life is good, you'll get to that stage too, you just need to hang in and I know it'll be painful and awful at times, but you've done the hardest part and there are lots of people here who have your back as well.

There are lots of phases people go through, it's not dissimilar to post traumatic stress at times, and you've lost your family, so there will be the stages of grief too. I was numb, sad, angry, doubted myself, distrustful of others, but gradually have learnt to let it go, and in the main, it's ok now. You'll get there too.

3

BBC Radio Four Comedy Centering Around Leaving the Witnesses.

by gonzobear in

i heard this on the radio last week and thought it was really powerful, amazingly radio four referred to the witnesses as a religious cult, which i thought was progress.

it's a strangely tough listen, i'm sure many of you have been through similar, i know i was, and to hear it presented as comedy seems to add an extra punch.

it's great to see true life stories gaining some media traction.

gonzobear

I heard this on the radio last week and thought it was really powerful, amazingly Radio Four referred to the Witnesses as a religious cult, which I thought was progress. It's a strangely tough listen, I'm sure many of you have been through similar, I know I was, and to hear it presented as comedy seems to add an extra punch. It's great to see true life stories gaining some media traction.

51

Can’t cope with being disfellowshipped…..Need some advice

by xxBettyBoopxx in

this site is great, i have been lurking for a while now.

but i can’t get reinstated and have used some of the advice already given.. i was df’d many months ago and go to all the meetings and do all the preparation for the meetings, but the jc committee keep refusing me.

tomorrow at the clam meeting i am puting yet another letter in and will be called for another dreadful jc meeting.. 1. what can i say to the elders to show that i am truly repentant?.

gonzobear

All of the above advice is very good. If you can try and sit tight for a while.

Ask yourself what love is. This is what the disfellowshipping arrangement claims to hang on. Ask, is it loving to cause you as much mental distress as you're currently undergoing? Is it loving to shun people at the drop of a hat, and to only show them conditional love. These are hard questions, and leaving IS hard, but you've done the hardest part already.

If you're experiencing really bad depression please go to your doctor, or call a helpline, leaving can cripple people, and the sooner you're able to talk to someone and to build new relationships with people who accept you for who you are the better. Opening up can be terrifying, but people tend to be sympathetic, and empathetic and surprised too at the way you're being treated. Talk, think and rest, and try to imagine a life away from the organisation. How do you want your life to look, what does a good life mean to you, what's your purpose? Ask these things, seek help from others outside, and slowly you can build a life for yourself outside of the witnesses. It's not easy, doesn't happen over night, but believe me, in years to come you'll look back and see how brave you are, and how strong you've been. So many people here have been through the same things.

7

Witnesses and the UN Declaration of Human Rights.

by gonzobear in

i'm researching a piece on the witnesses, as an ex born in witness now writer, and would really appreciate any thoughts.. as most of you all know the witnesses rely heavily on article 20 of the above act - everyone has the right to peaceful assembly and association.

but they also contravene several other articles of the act with their policy of disfellowshipping, causing mental distress to people who leave, they split up the family - a protected unit- and don't allow members to vote or to partake in national service, things protected by the act.

here's the link to the act, read it though and see if you can spot things witnesses aren't allowed to do that every human should be allowed to do freely - .

gonzobear

I've been looking into it all day, I'm in the UK. What's interesting is they use the EU Convention on Human Rights as a means of gaining religious freedom in countries that have tried to restrict it, but the second article of the very section they use states people should have the freedom to leave a religion, so it seems they pick what they want but are not called out for the way they treat others. They can't be taken to the EU court of human rights, since they aren't a public organisation, but there's still the charity commission and I think it's important to create conversations around it as much as possible in the press. So many people just think the organisation's a little bit nuts and that people are in the main benign, as oppose to it wrecking lives and destroying families, something the more people know about the better.

The right to family, to privacy and to vote are all ratified by the UN and the EU, and therefore the organisation absolutely violates human rights over and over. I do agree that such violations pale when compared with so many civil violations, but on the level of the individual who's been wronged and denied basic rights then it's still an abuse, no organisation should wield that level of control.

It's only legal for countries who have ratified it, and some can agree to certain sections and others to not, but it's an ideal many organisations uphold, and are there to uphold, PEN and Amnesty being amongst some. Anyway, rambling!

7

Witnesses and the UN Declaration of Human Rights.

by gonzobear in

i'm researching a piece on the witnesses, as an ex born in witness now writer, and would really appreciate any thoughts.. as most of you all know the witnesses rely heavily on article 20 of the above act - everyone has the right to peaceful assembly and association.

but they also contravene several other articles of the act with their policy of disfellowshipping, causing mental distress to people who leave, they split up the family - a protected unit- and don't allow members to vote or to partake in national service, things protected by the act.

here's the link to the act, read it though and see if you can spot things witnesses aren't allowed to do that every human should be allowed to do freely - .

gonzobear

I'm researching a piece on the witnesses, as an ex born in witness now writer, and would really appreciate any thoughts.

As most of you all know the witnesses rely heavily on Article 20 of the above act - everyone has the right to peaceful assembly and association. But they also contravene several other articles of the act with their policy of disfellowshipping, causing mental distress to people who leave, they split up the family - a protected unit- and don't allow members to vote or to partake in national service, things protected by the act. Here's the link to the act, read it though and see if you can spot things witnesses aren't allowed to do that every human should be allowed to do freely -

http://www.un.org/en/universal-declaration-human-rights/index.html.

So my questions are firstly, does anyone know if ex-witnesses in the past have tried to use this in a legal setting to question the legality of the organisation's policies? And if not then what to do with this information - there's certainly a lot out there in public to undermine the witnesses, but i'm increasingly thinking that what they impose on people - because I guess the whole thing they would say is it's a choice the individual makes - is illegal, and they should be taken to task for that.

3

Jehovah's Witnesses and language worlds.

by gonzobear in

i was born in as a witness, left at the age of 28, and have been out for many years now.

i'm a writer and am writing about witnesses but from the perspective of how they control followers through the use of language.

it's only after studying a lot of literary theory that i've realised a lot of their mechanisms of control are through using language in a particular way.

gonzobear

Hi,

I was born in as a witness, left at the age of 28, and have been out for many years now. I'm a writer and am writing about Witnesses but from the perspective of how they control followers through the use of language. It's only after studying a lot of literary theory that I've realised a lot of their mechanisms of control are through using language in a particular way. For instance world doesn't mean the planet, it means everyone who's not a witness, which sets up a false binary in which witnesses fear everyone, or judge everyone who's not them. I've also been thinking how when we leave you've got to really relearn how to use language in the same way many others do. I'm working on a piece just now and would be really grateful if any of you could add to my thoughts with specific uses of language being used oddly in a witness setting.

Also, I got rid of all my 'literature' ages ago, and am now trying to research apostates, but can only find instances going back to 2012 - really?! - if any of you can find uses of the word in a derogatory way then please also let me know. I think many people who leave are so afraid of being labelled an apostate that they then don't speak out - again language being used to control.

Obviously any information is totally anonymous and is only being used as background research. Feel free to PM me too as I know this is on the public part of the forum, just wasn't too sure where to post it. Thanks in advance.