Posts by OrphanCrow

19

"You wouldn't want to bring reproach on Jehovah's name, would you?"

by Esse quam videri in

what would be your reply?.

my reply: jehovah is big enough to take care of himself.. yours?.

OrphanCrow

My reply:

Yes, I do.

"Jehovah" has behaved poorly. His track record is not above reproach.

4

Reference for WT article.

by Lostwun in

awhile back someone posted a pic of the rank/ order of command within the org.

it started with a picture of earth and god sitting on his throne, then the gb body members sitting at there table, then the elders underneath them and then the r&f and so forth.. no mention of jesus in that photo.

could someone familiar with the article that it came out of provide me with the reference please?.

OrphanCrow

The illustration you are thinking of, Lostwun, is in the April 15, 2013 Watchtower.

http://www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/faithful-discreet-slave.php

16

The Watchtower Corporation's (JWS) extenuating lies .....Why and for what purpose ?

by Finkelstein in

upon researching the historical activity of the wts.

it becomes clear that the head editorial writers of this religious publishing house propagated many formative lies or unproven speculations framed within its own bible theological interpretations.. .

going right back to its earliest inception the head writers of the wts proclaimed that christ has returned and that mankind was going occur a dramatic change through this returning establishment of christ, as prophetically told though bible scripture.. the first year devised by the wts of this return was 1874 and through means of using an obscure measurement of the great pyramid of giza 1914 was to be the year of armageddon.. the 6000 years of mankind's existence was used at that time as well ( early 1900's) to support this supposed code cracking, which was used once again in the late 1960's to create 1975 as another year of significance.

OrphanCrow

finkelstein: Religion is bullshit whether its from the mouths of the ancients or the mouths of modern men, particularly those who run and operate their own publishing house, then the bullshit really flies

Finkel, this book might interest you. It was written in 1917 but much of it is still relevant today. (on a side note, Upton was liked by the Golden Age editors and was featured in some of the early magazines - the Golden Age was a pro-Socialist rag)

The Profits of Religion: An Essay in Economic Interpretation by Upton Sinclair.

20

JW Teacher Sues School District For Being Fired Over Valentin's Day

by Bangalore in

http://dailycaller.com/2016/01/25/suit-teacher-sacked-for-not-throwing-valentines-day-party/.

a former public elementary school teacher who is a jehovah’s witness has filed a lawsuit against the suburban detroit school district where she used to work because, she claims, school officials ordered her to organize a classroom valentine’s day party and then sacked her because she refused.. people who belong to the jehovah’s witnesses, a millenarian christian sect, do not celebrate valentine’s day.

thus, the teacher, yvonne lemmons, is suing for religious discrimination, reports michigan live.. the defendant in the lawsuit is the southfield public school district in southfield, mich.. lemmons, 56, says in her lawsuit that she had been a fourth-grade teacher at macarthur university academy, a public magnet school, for 10 years and had faced no issues concerning her religious beliefs prior to the valentine’s day party kerfuffle..

OrphanCrow

I am curious as to how this woman managed to teach in a secular school system for 10 years and only now her refusal to participate in holidays has become an issue.

What about all those other holidays besides Valentine's Day? How was her noncelebration of holidays handled in the past? Did her classes just have to opt out of coloring Easter eggs or Xmas trees? Did her classes go for 10 years sans celebrations or activities of any kind related to holidays?

I am with Cofty and Landy on this one. It sounds like a last straw. There seems like there is more to this than what is being presented.

I have an image in my head of all these kids sitting in their classroom on Valentine's Day with nothing to do while the rest of the school celebrated. A whole classroom doing what I was forced to do as a kid - sit and watch while everyone else got to participate and I didn't.

It's a conundrum. On one hand, it is reasonable to expect that a person should not have to violate their religious beliefs in their job, but on the other hand, it seems to be wrong that the students do not have the right to be free from the teacher's religious views.

The teacher's refusal to accomodate the classroom's freedom from her religion becomes a problem. At what point do the children's rights become paramount over her rights?

I am grateful that neither of my children were unlucky enough to draw a JW teacher when they were going to school. I would have lost my mind.

42

Trey Bundy: One Year of Reporting JW Child Abuse - Your comments please!

by AndersonsInfo in

http://watchtowerdocuments.org/trey-bundy-one-year-of-reporting-jw-child-abuse/.

trey bundy: one year of reporting jw child abuse.

it’s been one year since trey bundy first reported the watchtower’s child abuse problems.. twelve months ago the center for investigative reporting (cir) began publishing information about jehovah’s witnesses and their cover-up of child sexual abuse on their website, reveal.

OrphanCrow

Thank you for posting this, Barbara. It is your hard work that brought the child abuse issue into the public eye to begin with so that journalists like Trey Bundy could give the coverage.

People like Trey Bundy are invaluable. Too often I have heard the comment that "nobody cares about the JWs" and in reality, the JWs do not come up on most people's radars unless there is media coverage.

It is rare to find a journalist that will put the work and time into doing the indepth investigation that Bundy has.

What Bundy has done is remarkable and I have great admiration for his work.

17

Two Jehovah's Witnesses congregations abolished by courts - Russia

by OrphanCrow in

two jehovah's witnesses congregations abolished by courts.

today, 11 february 2016, an administrative lawsuit by the prosecutor of belgorod province for finding the local religious organization of jehovah's witnesses in the city of belgorod to be extremist and liquidated was granted by decision of the belgorod provincial court.

yesterday the provincial court issued a decision on the administrative lawsuit of the provincial prosecutor for liquidation of the local religious organizations of jehovah's witnesses in the city of stary oskol.. the above quote is from one of 5 articles at link.. the fourth article, doctors in court: "jehovah's witnesses died after refusing blood transfusions", gives a synopsis of the hearing in the belgorod provincial court on feb 8.. two doctors were summoned into court as witnesses in order to learn whether religious convictions have affected the state of health of jehovist patients and whether they could be the cause of the death of patients.

OrphanCrow

Thank you, Memphis. Your comments are valuable and probably more accurate than mine are.

I supplied the 'old' court case to give context to how the decision to ban the Jehovists was handled to begin with - before the current court case was dealt with.

17

Two Jehovah's Witnesses congregations abolished by courts - Russia

by OrphanCrow in

two jehovah's witnesses congregations abolished by courts.

today, 11 february 2016, an administrative lawsuit by the prosecutor of belgorod province for finding the local religious organization of jehovah's witnesses in the city of belgorod to be extremist and liquidated was granted by decision of the belgorod provincial court.

yesterday the provincial court issued a decision on the administrative lawsuit of the provincial prosecutor for liquidation of the local religious organizations of jehovah's witnesses in the city of stary oskol.. the above quote is from one of 5 articles at link.. the fourth article, doctors in court: "jehovah's witnesses died after refusing blood transfusions", gives a synopsis of the hearing in the belgorod provincial court on feb 8.. two doctors were summoned into court as witnesses in order to learn whether religious convictions have affected the state of health of jehovist patients and whether they could be the cause of the death of patients.

OrphanCrow

memphis: It is non-Orthodox religions which are targeted by the Extremist laws for teaching 'superiority of belief'

A court case in Moscow in 2000 did not examine "teaching 'superiority of belief'" as an issue when determining whether or not to prohibit the Jehovah's Witnesses.

В.П.Белянин VP Belyanin
Комплексное экспертное заключение Comprehensive Opinion
по гражданскому делу 2-452/99 in a civil case 2-452/99
(Головинский межмуниципальный суд САО г. Москвы) (Golovinski District Court of the SAO, Moscow)
г. Москва, 4 октября 2000 г. Moscow, October 4, 2000
. We, the undersigned, VP Belyanin, MM Gromyko, DA Leontiev, SA Nebolsin designated definition Golovinsky Intermunicipal Court on March 12, 1999 for a comprehensive examination of the case 2-452/99 (presentation Attorney of the Northern Administrative District of Moscow on the elimination and prohibition of a religious community of Jehovah's Witnesses), being aware of the court of criminal liability under Article 307 of the Criminal Code, were of this opinion, set out below on 16 sheets.
I: In formulating conclusions, the following expert steps:
1) study the case materials 2-452/99;
2linguistic, psycholinguistic, literary analysis presented to the examination of texts of a religious community of Jehovah's Witnesses;
3) The religious analysis presented to the examination of texts of the community of Jehovah's Witnesses, the findings of which form the basis of the proposed conclusions (Section II), as well as additional considerations (Section III) account for the complex multidimensional nature of the investigated object. II Submissions by experts 2-452/99 case suggests that the questions formulated by the court
1. Does the literature and documents of the Jehovah's Witnesses signs
a) inciting religious hatred (the undermining of respect and hostility towards other religions)
b) the compulsion to destroy the family,
c) outrages upon individual rights and freedoms of citizens,
2. Are subject to study the texts of literature and documents outlining the Jehovah's Witnesses, which is commonly used in worship place issues entrusted to experts the complex textual analysis in the context of:
a) the existing regulations of the Russian Federation on the freedom of conscience, worship and religious associations
b) the modalities of the leading (and designated in the Law of the Russian Federation) faiths of Russia
c) the specific practices of the religious community of Jehovah's Witnesses, introducing her to the relations with other religions, social institutions and the general population as a whole.
В In addition to the issues raised by the court experts on the basis of Article 77 of the RF CCP saw fit to include in the discussion of an additional question:
3. Soderzhitsya whether the test material encouraging citizens to refuse to fulfill their civic duties prescribed by law.

The Russian experts' findings and opinions can be found on this past thread.

17

Two Jehovah's Witnesses congregations abolished by courts - Russia

by OrphanCrow in

two jehovah's witnesses congregations abolished by courts.

today, 11 february 2016, an administrative lawsuit by the prosecutor of belgorod province for finding the local religious organization of jehovah's witnesses in the city of belgorod to be extremist and liquidated was granted by decision of the belgorod provincial court.

yesterday the provincial court issued a decision on the administrative lawsuit of the provincial prosecutor for liquidation of the local religious organizations of jehovah's witnesses in the city of stary oskol.. the above quote is from one of 5 articles at link.. the fourth article, doctors in court: "jehovah's witnesses died after refusing blood transfusions", gives a synopsis of the hearing in the belgorod provincial court on feb 8.. two doctors were summoned into court as witnesses in order to learn whether religious convictions have affected the state of health of jehovist patients and whether they could be the cause of the death of patients.

OrphanCrow

mephis: ....caused by one group of Biblebashing zealots not wanting competition

The reasons for the Jehovists being banned in Russia has nothing at all to do with "Biblebashing zealots not wanting competition" and everything to do with the Jehovists' extremist positions.

Russia's reasons are sound. The Jehovists are an extremist organization and we know they are - they are a suicide cult that propagates doctrines that harm not only themselves but also others. Their doctrines undermine the family unit and the unity of the state.

They don't strap a bomb to themselves and blow up other people - the damage they incur is far more sophisticated than that. They only need to go to a hospital and force doctors (like the one who testified in court) and nurses to watch helplessly while they die in agony.

The Jehovists noblood doctrine is cruel and not just to the Jehovists themselves, but also to the people around them and the health professionals that have to treat them.

This is not about competition to the Orthodox Church. This is about an American business that poses as a religion and hurts people.

8

And it gets closer to home!

by David Graham in

yet another child abuse case.

although this is closer to home.

i live in kilmarnock, this freak is being trialled at kilmarnock sheriff court.

OrphanCrow

David:
Whoops. Sorry for the repeated post folks.

Not a problem. Like Wanna said...the first post about something often gets missed.

Nathan: Is that Kilmarnock, Wyoming or Kilmarnock, Afghanistan?

No.

It is the one that has a .uk in its web address.

17

Two Jehovah's Witnesses congregations abolished by courts - Russia

by OrphanCrow in

two jehovah's witnesses congregations abolished by courts.

today, 11 february 2016, an administrative lawsuit by the prosecutor of belgorod province for finding the local religious organization of jehovah's witnesses in the city of belgorod to be extremist and liquidated was granted by decision of the belgorod provincial court.

yesterday the provincial court issued a decision on the administrative lawsuit of the provincial prosecutor for liquidation of the local religious organizations of jehovah's witnesses in the city of stary oskol.. the above quote is from one of 5 articles at link.. the fourth article, doctors in court: "jehovah's witnesses died after refusing blood transfusions", gives a synopsis of the hearing in the belgorod provincial court on feb 8.. two doctors were summoned into court as witnesses in order to learn whether religious convictions have affected the state of health of jehovist patients and whether they could be the cause of the death of patients.

OrphanCrow

Two Jehovah's Witnesses congregations abolished by courts

Today, 11 February 2016, an administrative lawsuit by the prosecutor of Belgorod province for finding the local religious organization of Jehovah's Witnesses in the city of Belgorod to be extremist and liquidated was granted by decision of the Belgorod provincial court.

Yesterday the provincial court issued a decision on the administrative lawsuit of the provincial prosecutor for liquidation of the local religious organizations of Jehovah's Witnesses in the city of Stary Oskol.

The above quote is from one of 5 articles at link.

The fourth article, DOCTORS IN COURT: "JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES DIED AFTER REFUSING BLOOD TRANSFUSIONS", gives a synopsis of the hearing in the Belgorod provincial court on Feb 8.

Two doctors were summoned into court as witnesses in order to learn whether religious convictions have affected the state of health of Jehovist patients and whether they could be the cause of the death of patients.

A toxicologist from the Stary Oskol city hospital described how in 2001 a man and his wife who had been poisoned by toadstools were brought to her department. The husband, who was in critical condition, immediately had a blood transfusion in order to cleanse his organism from toxins. But the woman, who felt better than her spouse, refused hemosorption and plasmapharesis.

"The patient was conscious and she herself signed documents refusing blood transfusion. An attorney visited her and persuaded the Jehovist not to consent to these medical procedures and he promised to move her to Moscow where there is a hospital with equipment that permits cleansing the organism of poison without blood transfusion. The husband, who is not a member of the congregation, tried to persuade his wife to do everything that the doctors were recommending, but she was unmoved. The lawyer, who promised help, did not visit the next day. The woman was not moved to the capital hospital. In the end, she died from necrosis of the liver.

"At the last moment, the woman nevertheless agreed to one of the procedures, but it was already too late. In principle, members of the congregation could have moved her to the capital by air ambulance, or have brought other equipment into our hospital which permits cleansing the organism without transfusion. But they did not do this, although the lawyer had promised. In our turn, we were not able to do anything, since we treat with the equipment that we have. And in our city hospital it is possible to remove poison from an organism only by means of pumping the stomach and transfusing blood. This incident made a very strong impression on me. After all, I could have helped this woman at the time, but I was not able to. She refused the transfusion and she died in torment, being conscious all the time," the doctor toxicologist related this sad story.

Yet another Stary Oskol medic described the death of a Jehovist patient after refusing blood transfusion. The man was involved in an accident. Doctors did a serious operation on him, after which he died.

"The patient had more chances to survive if a transfusion had been done on him, but an operation was not done because of extremely low hemoglobin," the doctor concluded.

A man was also questioned in court who had nearly become a member of the congregation. The 33-year-old citizen of Stary Oskol described how he and his spouse were approached on the street by a preacher who offered brochures with articles of religious contents. The man stated that the new acquaintance described to him how it was possible to visit the prohibited website of the Jehovists to which Roskomnadzor had blocked access. A little bit later the Stary Oskol citizen learned that the literature that the preachers had offered to him had also been declared extremist. His wife reported to the police and described for the guardians of order what had happened.

True to form, one of the Watchtower lawyers made an ass of himself.

In his turn, the Jehovists' attorney Anton Omelchenko asked how long the man had cooperated with the FSB. When the judge overruled the question, noting that it had nothing to do with the case, the lawyer rephrased the same question and tried to get an answer from the man. When the judge forced Omelchenko to stop the talk about the FSB, he suddenly asked the witness what his faith was, stating that his beard gave a sort of hint of his religious confession. The judge again overruled the question and threatened to remove the lawyer for impertinent questions. The Jehovists' attorney Alexander Filin behaved more properly and did not pose questions regarding the external appearance of witnesses. The Jehovah's Witnesses' defense tried to insist on the participation in the trial of a religious studies expert, who would be able to describe the activity of the organization as a whole, but the judge rejected the petition, noting that it had nothing to do with the present case.

*an unrelated comment by moi that has nothing at all to do with this topic - I sort of like the way the Russians have come up with an "ist" for the JWs - "Jehovist"

This made me chuckle:

"The Jehovah's Witnesses' defense tried to insist on the participation in the trial of a religious studies expert..."

Haha! Maybe they had Monica Applewhite all lined up for that appearance.