Posts by OrphanCrow

47

Putin presents the Order of Parental Glory to a Russian Jehovah's Witness family

by OrphanCrow in

jw
friends

http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/54643.

presenting the order of parental gloryon the eve of international children’s day, vladimir putin presented the order of parental glory to parents of large families.

the recipients included families from astrakhan and yaroslavl regions, the republics of karelia, buryatia, north ossetia-alania, perm and primorye territories, and khanty-mansi autonomous area – yugra.the order of parental glory was established by a presidential executive order signed in may 2008 and is awarded to parents (or adoptive parents) raising 7 or more children and ensuring due care for their health, education, and physical, spiritual and moral development.

OrphanCrow

I have a suspicion that this JW family receiving this award was orchestrated by the org itself.

To receive this award requires an application from the recipient themselves or someone else has to apply on behalf of the one receiving it. It isn't like Putin personally travels around Russia seeking out large families. The award process starts with an application.

So, it leaves a person questioning why now? Why would the Noviks apply now - right at the same time that the JWs are up against the Supreme Court of Russia? Why now? Why not when they were eligible to receive the award? The Noviks were eligible for this award when their seventh child turned three. The little girl pictured in the photo is three - but she is the eight child, not the seventh. The Noviks could have applied for (and didn't), this award at least 3 or 4 years ago. But they didn't. They did it now - only months after the Supreme Court ruling and just weeks before the appeal will be be held.

Which is another thing - why does the Russian website reveal that there are 8 children in the Novik family yet the org press releases only acknowledge 6 children?

I think the application process was instigated and encouraged by the higher ups in the organization and that the elders would not have stood in their way and in fact, would have facilitated the application process. Along with all the ones up the chain of command. "An opportunity to give a witness".

Aude: Two different families are pictured in this thread. The one by Freelikeabird is not the same family as in the OP.
Which is the JW family?

The JW family appears at 6:40 in the video that freelikeabird posted. The image you see is simply a frame from the full video that features several families.

freelikeabird: . Families have an opportunity to say something. The JW guy says (my wife translated it for me) "do not interfere with how we raise our children" with a surprised Putin

Really? I am going to call "not likely" on that claim. If he had indeed said that, I would think it likely that that quote would have showed up on at least one of the numerous articles and comments about this event. Not even the European and Russian apostates have picked up on that supposed statement.

Any Russian speakers on this forum? Can this statement be confirmed? Did the father say that?

47

Putin presents the Order of Parental Glory to a Russian Jehovah's Witness family

by OrphanCrow in

jw
friends

http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/54643.

presenting the order of parental gloryon the eve of international children’s day, vladimir putin presented the order of parental glory to parents of large families.

the recipients included families from astrakhan and yaroslavl regions, the republics of karelia, buryatia, north ossetia-alania, perm and primorye territories, and khanty-mansi autonomous area – yugra.the order of parental glory was established by a presidential executive order signed in may 2008 and is awarded to parents (or adoptive parents) raising 7 or more children and ensuring due care for their health, education, and physical, spiritual and moral development.

OrphanCrow

Steve: I'd be astonished if that photo makes it on any pro-JW forum

It already has.

That photo was posted on JWtalk long before it made it on here. And, it was published on jw-russia.org which has this at the bottom of the page:

Where do you think I found the photo and story, Steve? Lol! I first read about it on a very much proJW website - an officially sanctioned one, no less.

47

Putin presents the Order of Parental Glory to a Russian Jehovah's Witness family

by OrphanCrow in

jw
friends

http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/54643.

presenting the order of parental gloryon the eve of international children’s day, vladimir putin presented the order of parental glory to parents of large families.

the recipients included families from astrakhan and yaroslavl regions, the republics of karelia, buryatia, north ossetia-alania, perm and primorye territories, and khanty-mansi autonomous area – yugra.the order of parental glory was established by a presidential executive order signed in may 2008 and is awarded to parents (or adoptive parents) raising 7 or more children and ensuring due care for their health, education, and physical, spiritual and moral development.

OrphanCrow

waton: Perhaps he wants to drive home the message: we are proud of, and have nothing personally against individual jw members, only fighting their teachings, organisation.

That is possible.

Who knows the full story? Are the Noviks even JWs? The jw-russia website has claimed them as their own. But maybe they used to be JWs and aren't anymore? And why would they accept an award from the man that Sanderson insinuates is the personification of the devil himself? And let that man, who opposes JWs so much, whose government's ban has resulted in "so much persecution!" of JWs in Russia, pin this medal on you?

Note the double headed eagle - the Imperial symbol of the Romanov family, the last monarchs of Russia. And the sun rays, signifying the divine nature of the State.

I don't know what has changed, but in my day as a JW, allowing a head of state that was responsible for banning Jehovah's special people, pin that to my chest would have been considered blasphemy. Wearing it would have meant the ultimate "Jehovah betrayal". As bad as, if not worse than, eating blood.

37

Police cordon around Honiton's Kingdom Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses after fatal stabbing

by ShirleyW in

jw
friends

hey uk folks, what's going with this story?

was it an unbelieving mate that attacked and elder or something?.

OrphanCrow

konceptual: Not necessarily. The carts could have been taken out in the morning and then the publishers returned them after the murder had taken place. They would not have been allowed to go past the cordon and therefore left them outside ready to be taken in.
I don't know this is the case, just suggesting that you are simply speculating.

Yes, I am.

I thought of what you propose too. But, I put that scenario down to "that doesn't matter". Because, I will bet good money that if that was the case, those dragging the carts in after a day in the field witnessing, set them carefully by the gate and thought "What a great opportunity! Jehovah has blessed us with another chance to witness. Cameras too...!"

37

Police cordon around Honiton's Kingdom Hall of Jehovah's Witnesses after fatal stabbing

by ShirleyW in

jw
friends

hey uk folks, what's going with this story?

was it an unbelieving mate that attacked and elder or something?.

OrphanCrow

http://www.midweekherald.co.uk/news/honiton-stabbing-man-arrested-1-5051377

UPDATE: Man arrested on suspicion of murder after Honiton stabbing

PUBLISHED: 07:22 07 June 2017 | UPDATED: 11:23 07 June 2017 Sarah Howells

A man has been arrested and is in custody on suspicion of murder after a 55-year-old man was found dead at the Kingdom Hall of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Dowell Street, Honiton.
Police have arrested a 55-year-old man on suspicion of murder in Honiton after a man was found dead with stab wounds.
The investigation into the 55-year-old’s death began after he was found at the Kingdom Hall of Jehovah’s Witnesses in Dowell Street. at around 3.40pm.
Police and ambulance crews found the man dead on arrival with a number of stab wounds. His family has been informed.
A 55-year-old man was located nearby and has been arrested on suspicion of murder.
He was taken into custody in Exeter to be interviewed.
A large number of detectives from the Major Crime Investigation Team are working on this investigation to establish the circumstances of the man’s death.
Officers are carrying out an extensive search of the vicinity where this incident took place and the police drone will be used to capture footage of the surrounding area.
A police cordon is in place and scenes of crime officers remained at the scene overnight.
Superintendent Sam De Reya said: “I want to reassure the local community of Honiton that this was an isolated incident and we are not looking for anyone else in connection with this incident.
“We are appealing for witnesses. If anyone saw anyone acting suspiciously in the Dowell Street area or around a camper van parked in the Lace Walk car park in the town centre on Tuesday afternoon, then we would like you to contact us.”
Anyone who may have information about the incident is asked to contact police via [email protected] or by telephoning 101, quoting log 529 of 06/06/17.
Information can also be passed anonymously to Crimestoppers via 0800 555111 or the charity’s website at www.crimestoppers-org.uk.

This is truly awful.
And Outlaw...i confess to snickering at your post, and then feeling guilty. But I also recognize the value of humor in dealing with horror. No witnesses, indeed.
And then, I saw the photo that was taken post-event:
Scene of a fatal stabbing in Honiton.

Look at that! Compare that photo to the one that jwleaks posted. Somebody went out and set up f***ing literature carts!!!!!
Nothing like a tragedy to get in a good photo op for the org.
Ghouls.

*what are they doing?? offering literature to the ambulance drivers and first responders? To the media crews? taking the opportunity to witness but not actually having a witness to give?

47

Putin presents the Order of Parental Glory to a Russian Jehovah's Witness family

by OrphanCrow in

jw
friends

http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/54643.

presenting the order of parental gloryon the eve of international children’s day, vladimir putin presented the order of parental glory to parents of large families.

the recipients included families from astrakhan and yaroslavl regions, the republics of karelia, buryatia, north ossetia-alania, perm and primorye territories, and khanty-mansi autonomous area – yugra.the order of parental glory was established by a presidential executive order signed in may 2008 and is awarded to parents (or adoptive parents) raising 7 or more children and ensuring due care for their health, education, and physical, spiritual and moral development.

OrphanCrow

steve: I doubt this will be mentioned on JW.org - or if it is, a watered down account will be provided, with readers spared a photo of Mr Novik wearing the badge.

It is being talked about over on jwtalk. Complete with all the material I posted, including a full copy of Putin's speech. And a big photo of the Noviks wearing the medal. And everyone over there are peeing their pants...Jehovah! is working! Regardless of how or why - the reason this is happening is Jehovah!

Of course Jehovah! In time for the appeal - to show that Putin likes the JWs.

Eh...I am more inclined to think that this Russian 'ban" (kicking the organization out of Russia) is going to play out much like it did in WW2 Germany. Some of the JW$ will cooperate and align them$elve$ with the 'enemy' while others will be sifted. The poor ones - the ones who "hold fast" because they have nothing el$e to hold fast to. They will be, and are, the ones who are the WT's poster persecution victims. While other JW$ will coast through, making the mo$t of a bad situation. The ones who Jehovah will ble$$ through this hardship.

In other news in the rest of Russia...some Jehovah's Witnesses are losing their jobs. Anyone who holds a position connected to public service is in risk of being fired. Forced to retire. Laid off. Apparently. As reported on the jw-russia website.

47

Putin presents the Order of Parental Glory to a Russian Jehovah's Witness family

by OrphanCrow in

jw
friends

http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/54643.

presenting the order of parental gloryon the eve of international children’s day, vladimir putin presented the order of parental glory to parents of large families.

the recipients included families from astrakhan and yaroslavl regions, the republics of karelia, buryatia, north ossetia-alania, perm and primorye territories, and khanty-mansi autonomous area – yugra.the order of parental glory was established by a presidential executive order signed in may 2008 and is awarded to parents (or adoptive parents) raising 7 or more children and ensuring due care for their health, education, and physical, spiritual and moral development.

OrphanCrow

Steve: The Russian Supreme Court recently upheld the banning of Jehovah's Witnesses in Russia on the grounds it is an "extremist" religious movement. And Mr Putin now awards the JW parents the Award of Parental Glory! Awkward moment, Mr Putin, huh?

A little awkward, isn't it? And it raises all sorts of questions. Did Putin know that he was giving the award to an "extremist" family? If he didn't, he should have. And if he did...it might be worthwhile to consider that this is not a typical JW family.

Putin may very well be saying - "this is how a JW family should be - lots of kids instead of restricting family size in order to give service to the org rather than to a family. And...a family that allows their children to be engaged in sports." Maybe that is the message. I dunno.

Note that the father claims that his kids are engaged in athletics. Sports apparently figures prominently in their family - at least prominently enough that it is mentioned by the father in his acceptance speech. Was that made up for the benefit of the "worldly" people giving him the award? Because it certainly goes against what the org tells families to do. And yet the award was posted on an official jworg website so it appears as though the org has implicitly approved kids to engage in sports.

I am a little curious about the two oldest children - are they really away working (in a Bethel somewhere?...maybe in Finland?) or, as in so many JW families...have the two oldest been disfellowshipped or "fell away"? (note that the reports from official sources say that the Novik family has "8" children but the jworg site only mentions a family of 6)

It is rather strange that a family that belongs to a religion that practices shunning can receive an award for raising a socially responsible family. A family that is being raised to not engage in the socially responsible acts of voting and serving in the military.

*it is also noteworthy that this story comes out of the republic of Karelia - right up there next to Finland. From some of the chatter I have read online, that area of Russia boasts some very wealthy JWs. Ones who give choice pieces of land to prominent people...jus' sayin'

waton: One things the dictators have right, ( not the left) fill your land with bearers of your own genes, do not surrender it to invaders.

Russia has a problem with declining population. Quite a large problem, actually.

Russia's population peaked in the early 1990s (at the time of the end of the Soviet Union) with about 148 million people in the country. Today, Russia's population is approximately 143 million. The United States Census Bureau estimates that Russia's population will decline from the current 143 million to a mere 111 million by 2050, a loss of more than 30 million people and a decrease of more than 20%.

Russia has a very high death rate of 15 deaths per 1000 people per year. This is far higher than the world's average death rate of just under 9................
Russia's total fertility rate is low at 1.3 births per woman. This number represents the number of children each Russian woman has during her lifetime. A replacement total fertility rate to maintain a stable population is 2.1 births per woman............

47

Putin presents the Order of Parental Glory to a Russian Jehovah's Witness family

by OrphanCrow in

jw
friends

http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/54643.

presenting the order of parental gloryon the eve of international children’s day, vladimir putin presented the order of parental glory to parents of large families.

the recipients included families from astrakhan and yaroslavl regions, the republics of karelia, buryatia, north ossetia-alania, perm and primorye territories, and khanty-mansi autonomous area – yugra.the order of parental glory was established by a presidential executive order signed in may 2008 and is awarded to parents (or adoptive parents) raising 7 or more children and ensuring due care for their health, education, and physical, spiritual and moral development.

OrphanCrow

http://en.kremlin.ru/events/president/news/54643

Presenting the Order of Parental Glory
On the eve of International Children’s Day, Vladimir Putin presented the Order of Parental Glory to parents of large families. The recipients included families from Astrakhan and Yaroslavl regions, the republics of Karelia, Buryatia, North Ossetia-Alania, Perm and Primorye territories, and Khanty-Mansi Autonomous Area – Yugra.
The Order of Parental Glory was established by a Presidential Executive Order signed in May 2008 and is awarded to parents (or adoptive parents) raising 7 or more children and ensuring due care for their health, education, and physical, spiritual and moral development.

*read full text of Putin's speech at link and view photos of ceremony

For more information on the Order of Parental Glory:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_Parental_Glory

Parental glory.jpg

The following is a report from the Press Service of the Head Office of the Republic of Karelia and it describes the Order of Parental Glory being given to a family from Karelia - the Novik family. Valery and Tatiana Novik.

http://www.gov.karelia.ru/gov/News/2017/05/0531_37.html

(google translate):

On the eve of International Children's Day, President Vladimir Putin has awarded the family of Karelia
Today in the Kremlin Russian President Vladimir Putin awarded the Order of "Parental Glory" citizens of Karelia Valery and Tatiana Novik. In their family is brought up eight children of different ages.
Order "Parental Glory" from the hands of the President received in the Kremlin family of Astrakhan and Yaroslavl regions, Karelia, Buryatia, North Ossetia-Alania, the Perm and the Primorsky Territory, the Khanty-Mansiysk Autonomous Okrug - Yugra. regional leaders were invited to the awards ceremony, including the Acting Head of Karelia Arthur Parfenchikov.
- In this room a lot of really happy people. Day after day with their children you again learns the world, share with them a sense of pride in their success, see how thanks to your efforts reveal their best qualities, talents, and I am sure, are doing everything that they grew honest, decent people, decent citizens of our country.Of course, a large, large family - it's not just luck. First of all, it is a big job and, of course, is a huge responsibility. This work without breaks and weekends. Children, their needs, concerns, and their good - for you are always in first place, - said Vladimir Putin.
Novik's family - eight children. Elder sons Yuri and Boris have received vocational training and work away from home. In Petrozavodsk school № 35 study Matthew, Konstantin and Nadezhda Novik. In addition to schooling, they are successfully engaged in athletics. Nazar kindergartners and Vsevolod already showing themselves in sports and little Agatha while sitting still at home with her mother.
All his spare time, Valery and Tatiana Novik spend with their children: with clean area near the house at a volunteer, many working at their summer cottage. Valery helps kindergarten, which is visited by his children, walks with his sons on a fishing trip, the master with their bird feeders. Tatiana teaches kids to cook and often bake cakes together with them.
Family Novik is a worthy example for the others in the education of children and strengthening the family traditions.
Order "Parental Glory" is awarded to citizens of Russia, have at least seven children. This takes into account the lifestyle and social responsibility of the parents, their concern about physical health, education, spiritual and moral development of children.

*Note the date that the Novik family received their award. May 31, 2017

At the bottom of the above article, at the link posted, there is a video of the ceremony and at 6:40, you can watch Putin pin the Order of Parental Glory on the chests of the Novik parents. One for the father and one for the mother.

The above reports don't mention it, but the Novik family are Jehovah's Witnesses.

From the jw-russia website:

https://jw-russia.org/news/17060606-176.html

The family of Jehovah's Witnesses took the order from the hands of the head of state
May 31, 2017 in Moscow, at a meeting in the Kremlin, the president handed Valery and Tatiana Novik, Jehovah's Witnesses from Karelia, the Order of "Parental Glory". At the awarding ceremony was also attended by all six children Novikov.
The Order is awarded to parents of large families, who are setting an example to strengthen the institution of the family and the upbringing of children, form a socially responsible family and lead a healthy lifestyle, provide a full and harmonious development of personality of children, a high level of care for their health, education, physical, spiritual and moral development.
In reply, referring to the spiritual and moral development of children, Valery Novik quoted text from the Bible, which serves as a reference for it, both for the parents: "Train up a boy on the right path; he will not depart from it, even when you are old "(Proverbs 22: 6).

14

Can we talk confidentially?

by wheelwithinwheel in

jw
friends

the lot video shows what most elder’s offices are like.

actually it a pretty well-equipped one and with the video context is, without a doubt, org-approved.

but let’s face it.

OrphanCrow

BluesBrothers: ...a quiet coffee shop

A noisy one is better. Background noise makes it more difficult for a sneaky elder to decide to "get a second witness" in the form of a voice recording. Jus' sayin'...

16

Visiting Japan and saw one of those Carts. What is the purpose of those book carts for the borg?

by adjusted knowledge in

i'm in japan for three weeks visiting my sister-in-law and brother.

the people are so polite and i came across two female jw using the cart.

it is the same experience i noticed back in the states.

OrphanCrow

Brooklyn Brothers SignWorks

Who We Are
Brooklyn Brothers SignWorks is a small sign services business owned by brothers that serves local businesses and enterprises. Our commercial website is located here: www.brooklynsignworks.com
Where Public Witnessing Started
Brooklyn was the birth place of Public Witnessing! It all started here and expanded throughout the city. Prototype equipment and signs were tested in New York City where over 8 million people travel every day of the week. Later, public witnessing was expanded worldwide. What a joy and privilege that all publishers can now participate in public witnessing that is organized locally in your congregation!
All prints are high-resolution and goes through an 8 step professional process by hand. We understand that the high-quality appearance dignifies the message you preach. We understand how it needs to be done! OUR GOAL is to help by making it simple and easy as possible to obtain the best quality signs for public witnessing at a fraction of what others charge. Customer service is our #1 priority, so that you can make field service your priority.

$$$$$ to be made. What a joy and privilege it is to spend money on changing those literature stand promotions all the time! No need to worry about the literature - all provided free of charge! But...those signs and posters...dig deep - it is called the new and improved donation arrangement.

No longer able to charge for the literature? What? No more easy stream of money coming in from the publishers? Time to give them something else to spend their money on...tada! Literature cart signs. And make them changeable - a new promotion every once in a while will keep those sign orders coming in. Don't forget to donate back!

*edit to add:

Just been doing some simple math...

Special promotions/events generate huge $$$ in literature cart signage

Convention 2017 - a simple 18x24" sign costs $20-25.

https://www.publicwitnessing.info/product/convention-2017-horizontal-large-copy/

The org boasts that there are over 165,000 carts worldwide.

Let's say that each cart goes the cheap route and buys a $20 sign. That translates to $3.3 million. Just for the one cheap little sign. Which is almost pure profit for the company printing them. Once the set up is done, the print run is pennies. Maybe that is how the org dumped out some of their printing equipment. The literature stands are the reason d'etre for the defunct literature - and a way to keep printed material viable as well as create a huge spin off, guaranteed, support business in providing that turnover of literature carts signage for all those "special events", etc

And don't forget the 'literature stands' and store fronts that require rotating signage