IslandMan: this notion .....has been long studied and shown to be blown greatly out of proportion at best and total pseudoscience, at worst.
Huh.
Sounds like it would be right up the WT's alley. Perfect fit
OrphanCrow
JoinedPosts by OrphanCrow
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105
Subliminal images - why and who are the individuals behind it?
by UnshackleTheChains ini remember about 5 years ago reading on another site about subliminal images in wt literature.
i honestly thought it a load of bs until i checked out one glaringly obvious image of a creepy skull in clouds within the knowledge book.
i was shocked and even showed my wife at the time who thought it was creepy.. so my question is why?
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OrphanCrow
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110
How many remember the 1969 8 day convention?
by seek2find inanybody remember the 8 day 1969 international convention.
i was at the braves stadium in atlanta all 8 days with a sunburn and then wet clothes after the rain storms.
if you were there (not necessarily in atlanta) do you remember anything about it?
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OrphanCrow
Yeah...a blast from the past.
Someone had mentioned travelling to Winnipeg from Chicago for the 1966 assembly. I was there too!
And the Peace on Earth assembly - Vancouver BC 1969:
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53
The saddest song of all time?
by Bad_Wolf ini would pick this one https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=th2w6oxx0kq.
i don't know how so many are happy or fine if thinking this life is it.
haven't lost parents yet, but when with them, sometimes i'll think of this song.
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10
JW Properties in Russia - 1.9 billion rubles
by OrphanCrow inaccording to victor yarofeyev, who publishes a blog for a radio station in moscow, echo of moscow, the total value of the jw properties in russia is 1.9 billion rubles.
which converts to $31,956,955 us.
almost 32 million dollars.. yarofeyev speculates that, if the supreme court refuses the org's appeal on july 17, some of the jw's properties may prove difficult for the russian government to seize.
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OrphanCrow
According to Victor Yarofeyev, who publishes a blog for a radio station in Moscow, Echo of Moscow, the total value of the JW properties in Russia is 1.9 billion rubles. Which converts to $31,956,955 US. Almost 32 million dollars.
Yarofeyev speculates that, if the Supreme Court refuses the org's appeal on July 17, some of the JW's properties may prove difficult for the Russian government to seize. The org, in anticipation of the seizure, transferred much of the property ownership to foreign JWs.
This is a google translate of the article - original Russian at link:
http://echo.msk.ru/blog/cur_blog/2009356-echo/
CENTER FOR INVESTIGATIONS :: BLOG
29 June 2017
"Witnesses" do not leaveIf the July 17 "Administrative Center of Jehovah's Witnesses in Russia" will not be able to appeal their elimination, then enter into force on the decision of the Supreme Court recognized the extremist organization and its property - subject to forfeiture. About 175 thousand depositors have invested in the earthly "kingdom", will remain with nothing. Center of Investigation Department estimated the scale of the largest post-Soviet nationalization - the Jehovah's Witnesses have at least 211 houses in 57 regions of the cadastral value of 1.9 billion rubles. The state will receive the most expensive part, but to take away all have to work hard.
From 1993 to 2017, religious organizations of Jehovah's Witnesses (*) has collected 438 addresses registered in Russia. We checked all the owners of these houses, and 211 addresses were associated with Jehovah's Witnesses. Of us found the property, according to USRRE, Russian and foreign associations 'witnesses' own 118 objects, 93 more are owned by the leaders and founders of the local branches and their relatives. The cadastral value of the property, located in 57 regions of the country is 1.9 billion rubles.
The most liquid assets are Jehovah's Witnesses in St. Petersburg - 11.4 hectares of land with several buildings with total area of 9625 square meters. m. Thus, in the village of Sunshine on the Gulf of Finland on 10 hectares located now empty headquarters of Jehovah's Witnesses with residential and technical buildings. There also has been registered "Administrative Center of Jehovah's Witnesses in Russia" - an umbrella organization of Jehovah's Witnesses. Another commercially attractive plot size in hectares - on Kolomyazhsky Avenue 21. There Jehovah's Witnesses built Congress Hall for 2000 people, used for large events and lectures. Cadastral value of all objects of a religious organization in St. Petersburg - 780 million rubles, the market may be twice as much.
The Moscow branch of Jehovah's Witnesses held modest - in the capital of "witnesses" belongs to only one building. But it is on the estate "Mihalkovo" Panin at Golovinskoye ponds, its area - 3194.7 sq. m, cadastral value - 297 million rubles. In 2010, the prefecture of the Northern District said that the building was illegally privatized JSC "Moscow Tonkosukonnaya factory named after Petra Alekseeva" and sold "Administrative Center of Jehovah's Witnesses in Russia." However, to take away property from the Jehovah's Witnesses did not work - now owned by the Austrian home community organization.
Most real estate, we found in the south in the Stavropol and Krasnodar Territories - 31 object cadastral value of 202 million rubles. Stavropol adherents of "witnesses" were among the first subjected to severe pressure from the law enforcement officers. In March 2016 during searches of worship of Jehovah's Witnesses in the building found the literature made to the Federal List of Extremist Materials. Jehovah's Witnesses claim that the literature they were planted. At its channel in Youtube, they published a video from surveillance cameras, which illustrates the masked men take out of the pockets of some papers and put them on the table. At the same time, searches took place in Karachaevo-Cherkessia in the building of the local branch of Jehovah's Witnesses, which also have been found extremist materialy.God later for distributing banned literature Court liquidated the Karachai-Circassian organization and gave it to the state property. According USRRE, now belonged to her house (298.5 sq. M) and land (857 sq. M) bailiffs imposed a ban on alienation.
Now the government must withdraw all the property of a proscribed organization. However, in six months the assets "of the Administrative Center of Jehovah's Witnesses in Russia" and its divisions have decreased significantly - as soon as the threat of liquidation became a reality, the Russian religious organizations have started to give or donate property to the foreign missions of the Jehovah's Witnesses. From January to the end of April 2017 foreigners managed to pass the 74 property cadastral value of 402 million rubles. The main donee steel community of Jehovah's Witnesses in Sweden, Austria, Spain, as well as "the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society of Pennsylvania", which belongs to (with the encumbrance of law in favor of the "Administrative Center"), the headquarters of Jehovah's Witnesses in St. Petersburg since 2010.
The state has already begun to stop attempts of real estate transfer. The local organization of the Stavropol region Jehovists tried to give the ground (2851 sq. Meters) and Kingdom Hall (1 161.6 sq. M) in the village Nezlobnaya "witnesses" from Denmark. Regional Rosreestra management refused to register the transaction. Danish community in the beginning of June, tried to challenge the refusal of the Court of Arbitration of the Stavropol Territory, but the court has not issued a statement considering the dispute itself incompetent. Back in March of 2017 in the Stavropol region deal with foreign organizations "witnesses" were recorded, and the local communities had to give three property Jehovah's Witnesses from Austria.
As a result, as of June 2017 the foreign community of Jehovah's Witnesses own most of the property found us. They own 65% (16.4 hectares of land and 25,072 sq. M of buildings and facilities, only 78 objects) cadastral value of more than 500 million rubles. 93 objects are owned by the managers, founders of Russian departments and their relatives, but it is the most modest assets - 11.5% of the Russian real estate (2.7 hectares of land and 6020 square meters of buildings.) Worth 175 million rubles. Only 23.5% of the property (5.4 hectares and 13,989 square meters, a total of 40 objects.) Belongs directly to Russian legal entities "witnesses", but it is the most expensive - not less than 660 million rubles. This distribution can allow Jehovah's Witnesses to keep most of the property - if the transaction on its transmission will not be challenged.
The state is such an opportunity, according to a senior partner of the Bar "Yukov and Partners" Irina Adamova, "Since the property was transferred under the contract of donation, it will be possible to prove that this sham transaction for the renewal of the title of the owner is to avoid forfeiture of the property . If the prosecutor proves that the transactions were concluded in order to avoid enforcement of the judgment, and not for gratuitous gift, the State will be able to assign the property. "
On the property, which is owned by the managers, founders of local organizations and their relatives, the state is unlikely to be able to claim. According to Irina Adamova, prosecution will have to prove that the building was bought with the money of this religious organization, rather than the owner's agent. Do it and to confiscate the property will be much more difficult than in the case of donation of foreign organizations.
This is a map that shows the locations of JW property in Russia:
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56
Would You Outlaw Jehovah's Witnesses If You Had Your Way?
by minimus ini still believe in freedom of religion even if i disagree with the beliefsof the religion.
what about you?.
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OrphanCrow
And another thing I think should happen with religions.
Regardless if they lose their tax status or not, all religions should be levied a flat tax to be used for survivor recovery programs. All monies from that tax would be directed to religious/cult recovery, shelters, suicide help, mental health programming, etc.
The notion that religion holds a special status in society based on its "helpfulness" needs to be balanced with the acknowledgement that religions/cults also do harm. Religion itself has to start chipping in to pay for the damage that it does. Just sponsoring soup kitchens and giving away used clothing doesn't cut it.
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Favorite/least favorite CO's and DO's
by HereIgo ini posted this thread sometime last year but thought i would revive it due to the new ones on the board, and to change things up a bit.
my favorite?
bro murikami, from hawaii, very humble, kind bro.
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OrphanCrow
LongHairGal: ORPHAN CROW:
I don't know how you can sit idly by and hear that your 80 year old many-years-out mom is being regularly visited by the CO and an elder.....That is because you don't know my mother. Or the situation. My mother is more than capable of handling those guys and I wouldn't doubt it if she is setting the CO up. She will bide her time and when he least suspects, she will attack. That is her modus operandi. I know that.
So I armed her. I gave her lots of stuff to put in her arsenal. She is up on the ARC and all sorts of other things. The child abuse stuff really makes her angry and she remembers what the local elders did to my sister when she was raped.
My mother has a bone (or two or three) to pick with the WTS that goes back years and years and I am going to let her do it. I certainly will not be the one standing in her way.
This isn't funny
Actually, it is. What will be even funnier is when the CO finds out that my mother isn't a vulnerable old lady - she is vicious. She has only been playing with him and the elders up to this point
...and I'd do something about this.
Nah...I just hope I get to hear the story when she finally lets loose on them. I might not - I do not have any contact with my mother except through a sibling. She is so hard to handle that I no longer visit her or even speak to her.
Thanks for the concern, LongHairGal, I do appreciate it. But if anyone needs to be warned or be concerned...it should be the CO and his elder buddies
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book advice about the 'jw experience'
by cobweb ini'm looking for a book recommendation about the jw experience for the audience of a non-jw friend.. here is a scenario: you have recently left the jw religion and have made a friend who has little knowledge about your old religion.
you would like them to understand more about you but at this point you feel awkward about explaining your religious background and don't feel confident that you can make them 'get it'.
you decide you would like to give them a book that will do the grunt work of explaining it all; one that will give them a deeper insight into your former world than you feel able to provide, which will additionally explain why it is that you are now in the position you are, friendless, unsure of many things and adrift at an age where most people have got their life sorted.. if someone were in this situation and needed such a book, what you recommend?.
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OrphanCrow
WakeMe: I'm Perfect, You're Doomed by Kyria Abrahams...
I have never read her book either but I am a big fan of her youtube videos. This is Kyria discussing her book:
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Favorite/least favorite CO's and DO's
by HereIgo ini posted this thread sometime last year but thought i would revive it due to the new ones on the board, and to change things up a bit.
my favorite?
bro murikami, from hawaii, very humble, kind bro.
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OrphanCrow
Doc: However, in the last decade or even two decades, I'd say they have all been Company Men committed to watch over WT$ CA$H as the Prime Directive.
Ah. So that explains why my elderly mother (who owns a house, etc) has been getting visits from the CO whenever he is in that territory. She told me that the local elder and the CO have been to see her several times over the years.
It made me laugh. My mother was disfellowshipped way back in 69/70 and has held a heart of bitterness towards the org ever since. When it happened, she was shunned badly. It was traumatic and left lasting scars.
And now. Now. when she is in her 80s, the CO big shot, along with one of the elders, come to visit her for regular "shepherding calls". I asked her why she even would let them in but she is cagy and just said that she wants to know what they will say. I guess the CO's standard thing is to ask her if she will return, blah, blah, blah....bible verse, etc. Haha! My mother and I both know what they are after. Her estate.
They don't stand a chance and I think my mom is getting some sort of pleasure in making them squirm and come begging with a bible in hand.
He is going to have a hard time on his next visit. She lost almost all of her hearing recently. And she is 80% blind. But, she won't give up a nickel. That I know. Not a nickel. And, she is armed with all the ARC stuff about child abuse, etc. He might have quite the visit. She is getting really cranky. The older she gets, the worse she gets.
I don't know the CO's name. But he is doing his job. Bag man for the org.
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Would You Outlaw Jehovah's Witnesses If You Had Your Way?
by minimus ini still believe in freedom of religion even if i disagree with the beliefsof the religion.
what about you?.
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OrphanCrow
That is somewhat helpful, Dsp. But, the link you provided is a link to stories about Norway's tax return. In spite of the government grants that the org receives being revealed, it still doesn't list the big contributors - the ones who could and do influence org activities. And the information that the Norwegian branch sent Germany over 300 million during those years still doesn't reveal where that money actually was spent. Putting $$$ in another country's bank does not quailify for knowing how the money was used.
It appears like the link gives a reader a summary of that information but it does not give details.
The tax return that has never been revealed, and likely never will be, is the BIG one - the American one.
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Nursing exam question on JW blood beliefs
by adjusted knowledge ini had a similar question on my nclex exam for my nursing license.
in the rapid changing beliefs of jws what is the correct answer?.
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OrphanCrow
SAHS: .... if the medical profession ends up having to kowtow to the parochial mandates of extreme fundamentalist cults such as the Watch Tower, then all the efficacy of the accumulated scientific knowledge goes right out the window.
But in our modern enlightened and civilized society, such purely superstitious behaviour – as apparently interpreted by certain self-serving pseudo-religious outfits – really has no place, and should be discarded along with all other such relics of pre-homo-sapient society.Yet, in the face of all that, the world now has to deal with the establishment of Blood Management (or PBM, depending on context). A medical discipline (endorsed by WHO as the "golden standard of care") that unabashedly claims "Holy Scripture" as the ethical basis for their approach:
