Posts by Alive!

44

Why Do People Become JWs?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i was born in the religion but why on earth do people join this religion?

?.

Alive!

By the way.....back in the 80s it was different.

Full and comprehensive answers were welcomed from the brothers and sisters.....not the pared down sentences lifted up from the publications.

Again....impressive.

44

Why Do People Become JWs?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i was born in the religion but why on earth do people join this religion?

?.

My initial intro to a JW was an intelligent, articulate and kind woman, successful in business, creative and a knock out sense of humour. She then introduced me to a small group of her friends....it would be hard not to like them.

Our studies were interesting....we talked for hours. When I went along to my first meeting I was impressed by the articulate and meaningful answers given at the Watchtower study, and the 'talk' would have been excellent. (Can't remember the title, but I know I was absolutely intrigued)

The congregation was mixed race, very well groomed and I was introduced to brothers and sisters who were clearly smart, successful and yet earnest and eager about the Bible.

My own 'worldly' friends and extended family were also entirely comfortable with meeting and mixing with my JW friends and had nothing bad to say about them.

Believe me, it's a powerful mix.

Think of the many forum members here who write with sincerity, who capture our attention....who are respected - well imagine such characters being JWs....imagine being taught 'what the bible really teaches' by some of the clearly fine folk here.....such 'teaching' in such hands is highly persuasive....and impressive.

Dont underestimate how 'good' it looks and feels from a non-witness perspective.

There are some darn good people who were/are teaching God in the JW way - Some of those people are here in this forum.

I know many, many JWs who would really impress.....and by their very manner and apparent way of life would disarm immediate suspicion.

Think about it.

44

Why Do People Become JWs?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i was born in the religion but why on earth do people join this religion?

?.

Alive!

stillin28 minutes agoOnly speaking for myself, I saw value. Principles that weren't really honored in the churches, like honesty, and pacifism, and loyalty. I really felt that these people were taking a solid stand against the "darkness" do the world. Like the ones who stood up to Hitler. This seemed like just the thing. The Bible seemed to be the key, the people were friendly, etc, etc ad nauseum.
So I joined, let myself be separated from my friends, I had new friends now. And I toughed out the details for more than 30 years until my bullshit meter started howling, "too much invisible shit! Too much invisible shit!" And I realized that knowing the "party line" to answer any questions is not true wisdom. Knowing when to say "I don't know" is the beginning of wisdom.

My experience practically to a T.

Like you my 'bullshit' meter was screeching.

Since fading away, the madness seems to have intensified in the whole 'production'.

And after I had 'faded' I followed the Australia RC, watching each video.

I felt sick. I felt justified in walking away....I coukd not uphold this kind of behaviour, manipulative language and ducking and diving and 'recruit' hopeful seekers into this organisation.

Clearly something as terribly wrong.

44

Why Do People Become JWs?

by minimus in

jw
friends

i was born in the religion but why on earth do people join this religion?

?.

Alive!

I was close friends with several 'converts' and then myself....about five...two in particular were my closest friends.

Each of these close friends were above average intelligence (successful careers, management roles etc)

I'd say each of them was kindness itself, but looking for answers.

'Born-ins' flocked around them and became their encouragers, inviting them to every social function...and back in the 80s and early 90s, it seemed like indeed the JWs had a special insight into scripture.

i hated churches and religion.

JWs said 'religion is a snare and a racket'

I could read the signs from a world perspective that our planet and society was heading for big trouble.

JWs said read Mathew 24 and 1Timothy 3....and try Revelation 'He will bring to ruin those ruining the earth'

It's all heady stuff......and of course there was so much more that 'struck a ring of truth'

Sadly, it revealed to be something else, but at the time, giddy with the pressing 'love' of everyone (born-ins) and overwhelmed with the prophetic evidence.....we wanted to do what seemed to be right.

We had no idea what lay in store behind the smiles and the out stretched hands.

We didn't realise what folk were hiding.

I'm still the half way decent person I've always been - I don't consider myself a 'sucker' for trusting such a extraordinary performance by a global crowd.

And I can tell you that my 'worldly' friends and extended family members (again, successful and socially adjusted folk) were mightily impressed by our witness friends and said they really were special people.

So there you go.

26

My Introduction

by Ray Frankz in

this is my first post and i'm feeling like i'm doing something bad big time!

i know on my mind it isn't, but the feelings are less manageable.. well, since i'm still a jw it's better not to give too much info, but i'm from brazil.. i've grown-up in the religion and practicly all my family, my closest friends and my girlfriend are loyal jws.

i used to be a regular pioneer but i still have a service privilege on my congregation.. i've had questions about the teachings of the wt since i was 10, but naturally i always pushed it away as it were "questioning the holy organization".. i started a friendship with some people in a course i took and we talked about a lot of subjects.

Alive!

Welcome.

Quoted the above .....spot on.

26

My Introduction

by Ray Frankz in

this is my first post and i'm feeling like i'm doing something bad big time!

i know on my mind it isn't, but the feelings are less manageable.. well, since i'm still a jw it's better not to give too much info, but i'm from brazil.. i've grown-up in the religion and practicly all my family, my closest friends and my girlfriend are loyal jws.

i used to be a regular pioneer but i still have a service privilege on my congregation.. i've had questions about the teachings of the wt since i was 10, but naturally i always pushed it away as it were "questioning the holy organization".. i started a friendship with some people in a course i took and we talked about a lot of subjects.

Alive!

- The organization fosters a kind of Darwinian spirituality, so-to-speak, as a survival of the fittest

47

Are JWs "mind trained" to be habitual liars?

by nonjwspouse in

i don't mean overly obvious, or otherwise meaning to cause harm, but taught to lie for the purpose of avoidance.

this type of lying can be pervasive in areas of life that are not just to avoid discussions with people who have questions about the jw, etc.

my husband will lie/be deceitful about the silliest, simple things.

Alive!

This trait of deceit is such a strange thing to find amongst 'the most honest people' in the world....

I do think there is a critical honesty regarding things like stolen goods, finding money etc, being given too much change! most JWs I know would be very honest over these things, avoiding being caught up with anything that smacked of taking something etc.

But when it comes to communication, it's like the JW culture overall fails to act in a truly generous nature of respect where other human beings are deserving of respectful treatment....if that makes sense...in that there are smoke screens, things held back....

And then you see this permeating into the JW population. It's really noticeable.

But then, individuals and groups behave like this everywhere......its just particularly weird amongst people who spend hours studying words and scriptures on being truthful!

47

Are JWs "mind trained" to be habitual liars?

by nonjwspouse in

i don't mean overly obvious, or otherwise meaning to cause harm, but taught to lie for the purpose of avoidance.

this type of lying can be pervasive in areas of life that are not just to avoid discussions with people who have questions about the jw, etc.

my husband will lie/be deceitful about the silliest, simple things.

Alive!

And the JWs are immersed in a world of not telling it straight, avoidance, verbal dancing etc.

It's a strange thing.

47

Are JWs "mind trained" to be habitual liars?

by nonjwspouse in

i don't mean overly obvious, or otherwise meaning to cause harm, but taught to lie for the purpose of avoidance.

this type of lying can be pervasive in areas of life that are not just to avoid discussions with people who have questions about the jw, etc.

my husband will lie/be deceitful about the silliest, simple things.

Alive!

It's a horrible thing.....my husband has lied in the past on terribly serious matters.

It has impacted on our 35 year old marraige and relationship in so many ways.

In the end it changes you. Living with a partner who lies so easily can make you feel somewhat insane. Believe me!

They don't understand or know the difference I think. Ingrained from child hood There seems to be no conscience involved.

My mother in law ( not a witness) is a shocking example of verbal deceit....I love her anyway, she really tries hard to be a good person. But it's this incredibly childish lying and avoidance....ugh.

47

Are JWs "mind trained" to be habitual liars?

by nonjwspouse in

i don't mean overly obvious, or otherwise meaning to cause harm, but taught to lie for the purpose of avoidance.

this type of lying can be pervasive in areas of life that are not just to avoid discussions with people who have questions about the jw, etc.

my husband will lie/be deceitful about the silliest, simple things.

Alive!

Chipping in.....

This 'trait' of deceit was something that I noticed from early years of association with witnesses...

It started off as 'avoidance' or twisting of words and reinventing realities...all of which has been mentioned in this thread.

My own husband was not brought up as a JW, but like the OP, he absolutely cannot seem to just 'tell it as it is' - and I don't mean simply embroidering a good story for entertainment value! He chooses avoidance nearly every time, and it can be exhausting as he also has a history of lying about very serious matters.

But I know this is a family trait which developed through a dysfunctional parenting situation...and I should mention, both my husband and his family are relatively 'decent' people. Intensely law-abiding, honest in money matters....but this strange avoidance thing, keeping them 'personally' unattached and a bit of an 'island'....some of the verbal dances they perform are hilarious, if it wasn't also unsettling and uncomfortable 🤔 - one constantly had to readjust expectations when talking about things with them.

I believe JWs have a similar dysfunctional global 'family' upbringing.

So yes, this odd and unsettling deceptive behaviour is ingrained....and often done with a smile and a hug 😆

I learnt how to talk this way myself, in their company...after awhile it became second nature to not directly answer questions about the bible, witnesses etc when around the 'outside' world of people. 😞🤔