thanks, I had missed Mathew 5:48, i'll bookmark that one for future reference
dustin_adam
JoinedPosts by dustin_adam
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27
thoughts...
by dustin_adam inplease note!
this is more of a philosophical question, and i am posting it merely to get feedback on what i like to term doctrinal circular logic (ie.
the bible is true because the bible says it true) i have tried to remove my own conclusions that i made from this, so if they shine through somewhere, i apologize.
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27
thoughts...
by dustin_adam inplease note!
this is more of a philosophical question, and i am posting it merely to get feedback on what i like to term doctrinal circular logic (ie.
the bible is true because the bible says it true) i have tried to remove my own conclusions that i made from this, so if they shine through somewhere, i apologize.
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dustin_adam
thanks, i downloaded the webpage to read at leisure later. get back with a reply this afternoon or tommorow
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27
thoughts...
by dustin_adam inplease note!
this is more of a philosophical question, and i am posting it merely to get feedback on what i like to term doctrinal circular logic (ie.
the bible is true because the bible says it true) i have tried to remove my own conclusions that i made from this, so if they shine through somewhere, i apologize.
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dustin_adam
The Age of Reason.... sounds interesting... my Encarta Reference Library 2003 DVD edition had the following quoute from the book:
"It is necessary to the happiness of man that he be mentally faithful to himself. Infidelity does not consist in believing, or in disbelieving, it consists in professing to believe what one does not believe."
Thomas Paine (1737 - 1809)
Microsoft® Encarta® Reference Library 2003. © 1993-2002 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved.Thanks for the tip, i'll pick up a copy!
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31
New to the site, but got me on a train of thought....
by dustin_adam ini got ahold of the latest watchtower cd-rom (2001) from my grandmother, who is still an active jw.
i've added below a few direct qoutes from various publications... in one instance below the watchtower says that the bginning of christ's thousand-year reign will begin in 1975 with noted exception in error of "weeks or months, not years" then in 1975 they say that "it does us no good to speculate" on the date his reign will start!
because after his creation adam lived some time during the ?sixth day,?
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dustin_adam
!!!!! Great Scott, with replies at this rate I'll have to ask Dell for a new keyboard for my laptop! I sincerely appreciate your replies, the support i have recived after having been a member of the site for less than two days now is unprecidented (sp?) I posted another topic this morning, less focused on their publications but more on their doctrine and teachings, and the conclusions drawn from them. I would really appreciate some feedback on that one.
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27
thoughts...
by dustin_adam inplease note!
this is more of a philosophical question, and i am posting it merely to get feedback on what i like to term doctrinal circular logic (ie.
the bible is true because the bible says it true) i have tried to remove my own conclusions that i made from this, so if they shine through somewhere, i apologize.
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dustin_adam
Please note! This is more of a philosophical question, and I am posting it merely to get feedback on what I like to term Doctrinal Circular Logic (ie. The Bible is true because the Bible says it true) I have tried to remove my own conclusions that I made from this, so if they shine through somewhere, I apologize.
I have enjoyed using the Societies own Watchtower Library CD-ROM as it allows for fast searches of words, text strings and article references, as well as cross-examinations. This morning after reading all of your replies to my posting on the 1975 issue, analyzed through their own pubs, I did some thinking and came up with a hunch.
We were always taught that ?God is perfect? and that he is unwavering. So, I queried the entire database for the text string ?God is Perfect? and came up with 15 instances throughout various Watchtowers, and one instance in the Greatest Man book, none in the Reference Bible.
The string ?Jehovah is perfect? found only one scriptural match, and it states ?The law of Jehovah is perfect?, not the creator himself. (Psalms 19:7) There were many more instances in other publications for this string, although most of them were merely quoting the Psalms passage, there were a fair number of independent statements of God?s Perfection.
Indeed the only scripture that I could find that even closely alludes to God?s perfection without blatantly stating it was Deuteronomy 32:4 which says: ?The Rock, perfect is his activity?? and Deuteronomy was the only time that I could find that Jehovah was described as a Rock. (although I may be wrong, and forgive me if that is so)
In any case, this whole train of though that I had ran all the way back to Genesis where we were taught, again, that Adam was created perfect. Yet not anywhere in the Bible are the words Adam and perfect found together. However, if we allow ourselves to adopt the JW reasoning for a moment as I did you come up with the following train of thought:
?God is perfect?
This means that everything he does is perfect, without flaw, never.
?Adam was perfect?
This means that Adam was perfect, perfect mind, perfect body.
?Adam sinned?
Adam?. Made a mistake? His reasoning was flawed?
?Yet god is perfect?
does anyone else see the conundrum in this? or if MY reasoning or research is flawed, I would be happy to learn more from your opinions and/or knowledge.
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31
New to the site, but got me on a train of thought....
by dustin_adam ini got ahold of the latest watchtower cd-rom (2001) from my grandmother, who is still an active jw.
i've added below a few direct qoutes from various publications... in one instance below the watchtower says that the bginning of christ's thousand-year reign will begin in 1975 with noted exception in error of "weeks or months, not years" then in 1975 they say that "it does us no good to speculate" on the date his reign will start!
because after his creation adam lived some time during the ?sixth day,?
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dustin_adam
well... what a warm welcome! i must say this is fantastic, never expected this much response to my posting. well indeed! and as far as doing homework and earning an honor role, my nickname to friends and family is "Dr. Adam", i guess i've always been studious in nature.
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31
New to the site, but got me on a train of thought....
by dustin_adam ini got ahold of the latest watchtower cd-rom (2001) from my grandmother, who is still an active jw.
i've added below a few direct qoutes from various publications... in one instance below the watchtower says that the bginning of christ's thousand-year reign will begin in 1975 with noted exception in error of "weeks or months, not years" then in 1975 they say that "it does us no good to speculate" on the date his reign will start!
because after his creation adam lived some time during the ?sixth day,?
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dustin_adam
i appreciate the precaution, although personally i don't mind, but if it's more of a site policy thing then kewl, i'll not add it in there from now on.
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31
New to the site, but got me on a train of thought....
by dustin_adam ini got ahold of the latest watchtower cd-rom (2001) from my grandmother, who is still an active jw.
i've added below a few direct qoutes from various publications... in one instance below the watchtower says that the bginning of christ's thousand-year reign will begin in 1975 with noted exception in error of "weeks or months, not years" then in 1975 they say that "it does us no good to speculate" on the date his reign will start!
because after his creation adam lived some time during the ?sixth day,?
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dustin_adam
just south of me.... well... fel free to email me at edited and we can exchange more detailed info there, but thanks for the offer for research data, i'll most definitely use it, i suppose that it's being rather vindictive but i'd really like to shake the foundations of some of my more zealot family members who 'still believe'... and rather shocked at how easy it actually is with their own data.
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31
New to the site, but got me on a train of thought....
by dustin_adam ini got ahold of the latest watchtower cd-rom (2001) from my grandmother, who is still an active jw.
i've added below a few direct qoutes from various publications... in one instance below the watchtower says that the bginning of christ's thousand-year reign will begin in 1975 with noted exception in error of "weeks or months, not years" then in 1975 they say that "it does us no good to speculate" on the date his reign will start!
because after his creation adam lived some time during the ?sixth day,?
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dustin_adam
yeah, sorry about the first formatting, i fixed it afterwards by using HTML, which solved the 'one big sentence' problem.... there must be tons of people on here, lol, i didn't expect a reply so soon.
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31
New to the site, but got me on a train of thought....
by dustin_adam ini got ahold of the latest watchtower cd-rom (2001) from my grandmother, who is still an active jw.
i've added below a few direct qoutes from various publications... in one instance below the watchtower says that the bginning of christ's thousand-year reign will begin in 1975 with noted exception in error of "weeks or months, not years" then in 1975 they say that "it does us no good to speculate" on the date his reign will start!
because after his creation adam lived some time during the ?sixth day,?
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dustin_adam
I got ahold of the latest Watchtower CD-ROM (2001) From my grandmother, who is still an active JW. i've added below a few direct qoutes from various publications... in one instance below the Watchtower says that the bginning of Christ's thousand-year reign will begin in 1975 with noted exception in error of "weeks or months, not years" then in 1975 they say that "it does us no good to speculate" on the date his reign will start! i'm sure that many if not all of you are aware of these and many other discrepancies, but i thought on the off chance that someone here hadn't read this before i'd post it, i plan on posting more article segments on various other topics as i research them.
1967 October 1 st Watchtower (page 587):
? As the canon of books of God?s Word was expanded and the Christian Greek Scriptures were added to complete the Bible, each book was written directly to the Christian congregation or to a member of the Christian congregation in its behalf. Thus the Bible is an organizational book and belongs to the Christian congregation as an organization, not to individuals, regardless of how sincerely they may believe that they can interpret the Bible. For this reason the Bible cannot be properly understood without Jehovah?s visible organization in mind .?
May 1974 Kingdom Ministry:
" Reports are heard of brothers selling their homes and property and planning to finish out the rest of their days in this old system in the pioneer service . Certainly this is a fine way to spend the short time remaining before the wicked world's end."
1968 August 15 th Watchtower (page 494):
? Are we to assume from this study that the battle of Armageddon will be all over by the autumn of 1975, and the long-looked-for thousand-year reign of Christ will begin by then? Possibly , but we wait to see how closely the seventh thousand-year period of man?s existence coincides with the sabbathlike thousand-year reign of Christ. If these two periods run parallel with each other as to the calendar year, it will not be by mere chance or accident but will be according to Jehovah?s loving and timely purposes. Our chronology, however, which is reasonably accurate (but admittedly not infallible), at the best only points to the autumn of 1975 as the end of 6,000 years of man?s existence on earth . It does not necessarily mean that 1975 marks the end of the first 6,000 years of Jehovah?s seventh creative ?day.? Why not? Because after his creation Adam lived some time during the ?sixth day,? which unknown amount of time would need to be subtracted from Adam?s 930 years, to determine when the sixth seven-thousand-year period or ?day? ended, and how long Adam lived into the ?seventh day.? And yet the end of that sixth creative ?day? could end within the same Gregorian calendar year of Adam?s creation. It may involve only a difference of weeks or months, not years .?
1975 October 1 st Watchtower (page 579):
? SINCE a new Jewish lunar year began in September 1975 a significant point in human history was reached. What was that? According to the Bible?s count of time, mankind then completed 6,000 years of existence on earth . Yes, the first man Adam, if he had chosen to remain obedient under God?s rulership , would have still been alive and 6,000 years old in September of this year.
Does this mean, then, that mankind has now reached 6,000 years into the 7,000-year period that God ?blessed and made sacred? as his great ?rest day?? Does it mean that Christ?s millennial Kingdom rule, as the final 1,000 years of that ?rest day,? is to be reckoned from September 1975 ??Gen. 1:27, 31; 2:2, 3; Rev. 20:1-6.
No, it does not mean that . Why not? Well, the Bible record shows that God?s creations on the ?day? just preceding that 7,000-year ?rest day? did not end with Adam?s creation. It shows a time lapse between the creation of Adam and that of his wife, Eve. During that time, God had Adam name the animals. Whether that period amounted to weeks or months or years, we do not know. So we do not know exactly when Jehovah?s great ?rest day? began, nor do we know exactly when it will end . The same applies to the beginning of Christ?s millennial reign. The Bible provides us no way to fix the date, and so it does us no good to speculate when that date may be ?
1980 October 15 th Watchtower (page 31):
? And if the wicked system of this world survived until the turn of the century , which is highly improbable in view of world trends and the fulfillment of Bible prophecy, there would still be survivors of the World War I generation. However, the fact that their number is dwindling is one more indication that ?the conclusion of the system of things? is moving fast toward its end.?