Posts by Incognito

13

Grooming as a Witness

by Jules Saturn in

growing up as a teenager, i would occasionally get some counseling for having my hair a bit too long by a couple of elders in the congregation.

one time i cut my hair shorter than usual and one elder said i was cutting it too short!

so it made me feel like anything i did wouldn't satisfy them.

Incognito

I'm sure if it's done, this person would probably be disqualified from going out on field service or participating.

Sounds to me, this would be an incentive.

42

To Fade or Disassociate

by Jules Saturn in

hello to all, so i did want to talk about this topic because i think it is very important to me.

i have a grandfather who faded several decades ago.

he occasionally attends an assembly and the memorial but no longer attends meetings or goes on field service.

In fading, the decision by the fader's family to shun him/her remains the choice of each family member. By disassociating, the family will have little choice but to shun him/her if that family member wishes to remain in good standing as a JW.

Fading will generally work for most people, but DA'ing will then remain an option if needed. Once the person DA's, that is an ultimate Black or White position, with no further options available.

WT want everything to be technical and legalistic for their benefit. They label everyone, even when they are not certain that label is justified. In declaring that you wish to DA will clearly define your position without further doubt, so they can and will officially place a DA'd label on you and treat you in the manner dictated. A DF'd or DA'd label, that is a distinction without a difference.

Although many JWs may proceed to shun even if you fade, they really won't have an official reason to do so. Since you are technically still a JW, some may continue to be friendly. Unless you say something against the Org or GB, they will typically label you as weak, lazy or having been stumbled.

As none of the labels they will provide are positive, does it really matter what label they place on you?

How you as the person wishing to leave views yourself, is what matters most. Once you decide to leave, you should consider yourself out either way. You can then define your own label such as 'Former-JW', "Ex-JW" or whatever you want.

29

JWs Ban TRUE RELIGION!

by Cold Steel in

the governing body of jehovah's witnesses, known for its aggressive worldwide proselytizing efforts, stunned many of its 12-million members by declaring war this week on a los angeles denim and designer jeans organization that goes by the name “true religion.”.

“as members of jehovah's one true religious faith we have no business of associating with any organization that claims to be jehovah's true religion!” a letter from the gb states.

it was dated july 20.. in its opening salvo, the seven-member gb directed believers to not “shop at, buy, nor even wear” true religion's products.

Incognito

These jeans make great gifts for elders - CS

That depends. How 'tight' are the pants they sell?

21

reps of the JW.0rg kiosk looking very Sea.0rg'ish

by oppostate in

amazing how cults end up looking so similar.

have you ever wondered how budhist monks and catholic monks look and behave so similarly?

or why mormons and jw religion have so many parallels?.

Incognito

Looks to be pretty dead for a youth fair which is intended to be a place of fun. The few teens who walked by near the end of the clip, didn't even glance at that booth. Maybe they are a long ways away from the fun stuff.

I wonder who paid for that booth and registration fee? I expect the workers had to supply their own clothes.

The size of the booth and number of workers, implies they are expecting a huge number of visitors at one time. Have they learned nothing from the cart work? Perhaps WT will try almost anything to boost membership, of any age.

Easy FS hours for booth workers.

30

Had twin babies with a married JW?!?!?!?!?!?! advice & thoughts

by Gokumonkey in

before i begin i just wanna say, im not proud of what i did, it was wrong but it happened now im just trying to do the right thing.. ok so im a "worldly" person and i meet a jw women at my job.

i had no idea she was married due to the fact that she hid her wedding ring.

i even ask if she was in a relationship and she denied it.

Incognito

From your description of events and her deceitful actions, it sounds as though she may not have really wanted a relationship, but used you as a means to become pregnant.

Perhaps the problem with her marriage was her husband was not capable of impregnating her. Maybe a pregnancy was her means to restore her relationship with her husband, OR, maybe he was involved and OK with using someone else to get her pregnant as opposed to using (and paying for) in-vitro.

If she was actually disfellowshipped, do you know why? Maybe you are not her first attempt at pregnancy by another man, so you are well advised to obtain a DNA test on the children.

If the twins prove to be yours, have you considered pursuing full custody? In consideration of the events, it seems something is not be quite right. Perhaps there is reason to pursue full custody, for the children's welfare?

33

My parents found out

by BlackWolf in

jw
friends

so in my last post i talked about how i had told my younger siblings how i didn't plan to get baptized or ever be a witness.

i thought i could trust them but i guess i was wrong, they're just kids after all.

my oldest brother (who's 11) told on me today.

Incognito

I don't know how I missed this thread previously.

When you say your Aunt(s) live a long way from you, how far would that be? A reasonable distance for someone with their own transportation, can be an extreme long distance for someone without.

Since you haven't even met your aunt(s), that somewhat reduces staying with her/them right now. Although related, they are strangers to you, as you are to them. Perhaps, you could arrange to meet them a few times to get to know and spend time with them before living with them, even temporarily, becomes an option.

I recall you have already turned 18, thereby implying you have or nearly have finished high school. Even if home schooled, you will need a HS diploma so ensure you obtain it by whatever means necessary.

Even as an adult, as long as you wish to remain living in your parents home, you will need to continue to (mostly) follow their rules.

As a JW man is expected to the spiritual leader for his family, your opposition places your father's elder position at risk, which will likely be why he wants you to play along. Your father is probably not only worried for his position, but also his failing to provide adequate spiritual headship for his daughter and his other children.

Since your thoughts are now known, perhaps you and your parents can compromise as to which JW activities you can agree to vs those which will act against your conscience, such as recruiting new members.

Reaching a compromise will require you to initiate some calm discussions. When either parent becomes increasingly short tempered and demanding, that is when you need to become more calm, stand your ground but remain in control.

I would be tempted to blame your decision against becoming a JW, on being pressured by your parents to become baptized now, as opposed to waiting until ready to make that decision on your own. Hopefully, that may force them to reconsider forcing your siblings to be baptized before they are each ready, and maybe, cause them to back-off in forcing you to do anything JW related.

Obtaining a FT job, even if only for summer, will permit you to earn some money and get you away from the house for extended hours each day. In addition, you gain some independence and experience while showing you are a reliable worker. It also may provide your parents with an excuse as to why you will not be available certain days such as for Saturday FS. Once you are away for extended hours each day, it will likely become easier as time advances, to miss more meetings, especially if you need to find another job in the fall.

We are all unique in not only who we are but also our situation in life. There are no answers that anyone can tell you, which will work for you in every situation. Part of becoming an adult, is the need to consider in advance, the pros and cons to every decision.

105

Subliminal images - why and who are the individuals behind it?

by UnshackleTheChains in

i remember about 5 years ago reading on another site about subliminal images in wt literature.

i honestly thought it a load of bs until i checked out one glaringly obvious image of a creepy skull in clouds within the knowledge book.

i was shocked and even showed my wife at the time who thought it was creepy.. so my question is why?

Incognito

Cold Steel,

Your comments on page 2, presuppose the GB would be against inserting hidden images. What if they not only are in favor of them, but actually sanctioned their inclusion?

Some here seem to have an opinion the WT continues to be a honest religion which makes mistakes and is not truly the religion chosen by God as claimed. Others view the WT and GB (or whoever actually controls WT) as something far more sinister.

I think opinions of valid artists do hold some additional weight. Many of these people have been trained or have developed skills the average person does not possess. Just because we may not personally recognize who these artists are, does not signify their statements are invalid. In the end, opinions are just that as WT will never honestly admit to anything.

105

Subliminal images - why and who are the individuals behind it?

by UnshackleTheChains in

i remember about 5 years ago reading on another site about subliminal images in wt literature.

i honestly thought it a load of bs until i checked out one glaringly obvious image of a creepy skull in clouds within the knowledge book.

i was shocked and even showed my wife at the time who thought it was creepy.. so my question is why?

Incognito

dropoff, there have been claims of the D-mouse organization also insetting additional hidden images. I believe a search on YT will reveal a video.

Before anyone jumps to conclusions, it's best to evaluate all evidence thoroughly. Many of us in leaving this org have sworn we would never allow ourselves to be suckered again. This works both ways on any topic, both for and against.

105

Subliminal images - why and who are the individuals behind it?

by UnshackleTheChains in

i remember about 5 years ago reading on another site about subliminal images in wt literature.

i honestly thought it a load of bs until i checked out one glaringly obvious image of a creepy skull in clouds within the knowledge book.

i was shocked and even showed my wife at the time who thought it was creepy.. so my question is why?

Incognito

CC,

I acknowledge certain shapes or combinations can suggest a face or random item to a viewer. Anyone viewing clouds will often remark on how the shape 'looks like 'the Queen', 'a Bat signal', 'a giraffe', whatever.

Some of the things suggested to appear as ' ...' within WT literature, I agree to being a stretch, very vague and difficult to be consistently recognized as being the item claimed. We all are unique in both experience and in how we view things. One person in ten may see something which the 9 others cannot, even when the person seeing it tries to point it out.

There are however, too many images which are too obvious to ignore. It's one thing to see portions of something such as a human eye or other facial part, but it's another matter when it's a complete face or other object which is plainly recognized, even if after being pointed out to a casual observer.

I recall my father (an elder) had possession of a published book on WT hidden or subliminal imagery, given to him by another elder. That was over 40 years ago. I remember that book was filled with examples, many of which were plainly evident. I also recall, there was a certain 'appearance', 'style' or 'emotion' to each, which seems to be consistent even to the more recent ones I've seen.

I won't speculate on reason(s) why images would inserted, but this has been going on for too long and with a high enough frequency, for it to be a matter of coincidence.

While some may foresee someone from the illustration department leaving bethel and 'spilling the beans', who is to say the entire department would be involved. Perhaps there are a few 'special' illustrators who are trusted to review and modify the work of others. This now could easily be done anywhere in the world, compared to the past.

With regard to images in other publications, what other publications are these types of hidden images consistently observed?

105

Subliminal images - why and who are the individuals behind it?

by UnshackleTheChains in

i remember about 5 years ago reading on another site about subliminal images in wt literature.

i honestly thought it a load of bs until i checked out one glaringly obvious image of a creepy skull in clouds within the knowledge book.

i was shocked and even showed my wife at the time who thought it was creepy.. so my question is why?

Incognito

Take any publication with artwork and scrutinize it meticulously and you're bound to see images of faces and other creepy things due to confirmation bias and pareidolia - Island Man

Examples?