fiddler

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Posts by fiddler

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  16

  Discussion with 2 Elders about IS

  by Da.Furious in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  some will notice i was really busy during the weekend, thats true as some jws will say i was in a spiritual paradise surrounded by brothers.. my view of a paradise is everybody living in harmony and happy, my weekend experience was more like unhappy people and complaining about almost everything, not to mentioned the quite discussion in the corners (i.e.

  gossips).. anyway, during on the discussions, the is (islamic state) topic was started.

  it all started when on the elders said that he prefers to talk to muslims in the ministry since they are more open minded and accept our teaching.. i dont come from a muslim background but lived among them enough to understand what they believe.

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  fiddler

  Da.Furious, maybe if you see that elder again you can still ask the question 'what's the difference?' Way back when I was newly out my father said something that I bit my lip on and later kicked myself for not saying anything. A few years later I pointedly 'resurected' the topic and asked the hard questions. It didn't change his mind on anything but I felt better for standing up rather than bowing down to their intimidation.
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  43

  How old were you when baptized?

  by Coded Logic in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i was baptized at the age of 11. like most of us, my commitment wasnt to honor god but rather i was gang pressed into the service of the wtbts.

  and, at such a young age, it was impossible for me to appreciate the enormity of my actions.

  honestly, how could i possibly have known any better?

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  fiddler

  I got baptized at 16 in 1973 along with my new step mother who was 8 years older than me. My father stood in the back of the hall because he was disfellowshipped for marrying the 24 year old step mother a day after his divorce from my mom was granted. He got reinstated within the year and I stood by him through all that. When he was sick with cancer back in 2012 he and my stepmother shunned me like I was poisen and wouldn't let me see him once. He died never speaking a word to me because I dared to leave the religion I basically was born in and got baptized in as a Kid.
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  21

  Are Jehovah's Witnesses the only religion to teach a paradise earth?

  by rory-ks in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have tried researching, but this pesky organisation always packs out the list.

  you seem to have to drill down several layers before reaching christadelphians.. is it a recognised idea among other peoples/religions?.

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  fiddler

  I had a Muslim lady tell me years ago when I was preaching to her that the Koran also teaches about a paradise earth. There was a bit of a language barrier so maybe we misunderstood each other...
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  39

  I HAD MY BICYCLE STOLEN!

  by Terry in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  three months ago i had to stop driving my car.

  it wouldn't pass inspection and it would cost about $3k to get it up to par.. well, it's a 98 honda accord with about 179 thousand miles on it, what did i expect?.

  .. i decided i would switch to riding a bicycle instead.. it has worked out fairly well.. i put about 10 miles a day on it.

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  fiddler

  I got a bicycle as a 55th birthday present to myself a couple of years ago. I know how devestated I would be if it got 'jacked' as my son calls it. He just had his jacked a couple of weeks ago because he left it unlocked somewhere. I hope you can get it back.
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  32

  Formal Introduction - Hi!!!

  by Gustv Cintrn in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  been lurking here for yyyyyeeeeears, but was too busy with school, jw life and other interests.

  now that i'm done with education for the time being anyway, plus the jw life is under pretty good control, i can spend some time and throw my views here and there in some attractive topics.. born-in, and deeply indoctrinated, but with life experience came better comprehension of my lot in life and have come to accept that, just like the family one is born into, jws are my family, friends, my ultimate and overall identity.

  a jw is what i am; like the song 'hotel california', and like so many on this board, check out anytime you'd like but one could never leave.. remember like it was yesterday the failed 'the wolf is coming' calls of 1975, mid-80s, late 90's, y2k, 2004 or so, and same will be with the latest effort to get people overly excited about 'the end'.

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  fiddler

  I suspect that my JW daughter feels somewhat the way you do and probably doesn't take everything the GB says as absolute. However, she rabidly sticks to the shunning of her family. I don't care if she wants to stay a JW for her friends. I just want my daughter to call me up every once and awhile and talk to me, bring my grandson over for just a half hour even to go to the park down the street or get an ice cream cone....little things that are denied solely because I'm labeled an apostate.

  How do you deal with the advise to treat disfellowshipped ones? Do you talk to those who have moved on and don't believe anymore? Do you shun family members?
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  25

  AMATEURS using BAD METHODS: what possible expertise does the GB possess?

  by Terry in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  let's start with a very basic common sense question.. if you needed surgery would you go to a graduate of medical school who had been practicing for awhile,.

  or would you go to an amateur who told you god would be telling him how to peform surgery?.

  don't laugh.. it is a serious question!.

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  fiddler

  Terry, you wrote:

  "I had a very disconcerting conversation with a JW woman yesterday. I won't go into details at the moment.

  Suffice to say, no matter how many things I exposed about the GB and the false prophecies, she took the coward's

  way out; i.e. she "trusted Jehovah and told me I need to go to Jehovah in prayer.

  From this I concluded the FACTS make no difference to people who are EMOTIONALLY involved.

  She is vested by many years in a society where all her "friends" and family reside.

  By repudiating the religion, she would--in effect--cut her own throat.

  That is a lot to ask of a person, isn't it?

  Intellectual honesty is cold comfort compared to "friends" and family."

  i just was listening to an audio book this morning, 'Reading Lolita In Tehran' by Azar Nafisi, and there was a comment made about one of her students that for her to let go of her faith and the wearing of the veil which was very much a part of that faith was tantamount to giving up her life...committing suicide. It didn't matter how uncomfortable the rules were or any arguments that would show the faith to be lacking. It, the veil, everything was threaded through the entire fabric of her life.

  I have for a long time noticed the parallels of fundamental Islam and fundamental Christianity and in fact, those similarities were part of my waking up but in the very beginning of my journey out I too had the feeling that I would be, at the very least, committing spiritual suicide at the time. I had come to the 'jumping off place' and chose to jump not caring anymore about living. I just knew I didn't want to live that life which had been all I'd ever known.

  The GB ARE amateurs using bad methods but they weave those bad methods through the very fabric of ones being so that it is like almost killing oneself to get cut loose. It's almost like they attach their bad logic to vital organs (the borg really does come to mind) and so it is literally very painful to get free.

  I think at least for me it meant really Facing death.

  Of course, like the Indiana Jones movie where he had to take the 'leap of faith', it wasn't death. There was a path. The student in Azar's book did finally take that leap and all I can hope is that it gets so uncomfortable to live in JW land that are loved ones also take the leap of faith.

  I really appreciate your research and well thought out post, Terry. Thank you!
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  31

  the insanity of Sam herds talks at the convention

  by purrpurr in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i've picked up two that stood out to me but i'm sure others will have noticed more:.

  he gave an illustration about fearing god and he said it is like a wife who has spent all day preparing the evening meal for her husband and she hears him come home and perhaps she is trembling a bit out of fear that he might not like the meal she has cooked for him....!!!!!!!!????.

  the other was about verbal abuse and how it should not be used but rather than site the effect it has or the forms it can take he said that we shouldn't call each other " dumb dumb" or "knuckle head" .

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  fiddler

  I wonder how many of the 'sisters' in the audience were listening to that? I know if that had been said while I was still in, not only would I have been offended by it, my husband would have been offended as well. That is not the description of a loving marriage.

  How much more obviously SICK does it have to get before there is a massive awakening among JW's? Problem is.........a lot of what is said by GB during the last talk of the day (or any talk for that matter) at convention is not even heard. People have tuned out long before. Most would deny that anything like that was ever said.

  Is there a recording of that talk anywhere by chance?
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  69

  More apostate hating from the Watchtower

  by Igot2bme in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i ran across this post on fb-.

  the november 15, 2011 study version of the watchtower, has this to say in an article praising jehu's actions against the family of ahab.

  "the prophet elisha sent one of the sons of the prophets to anoint jehu as king and to instruct him to kill every male of the apostate house of ahab.2 ki.

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  fiddler

  Balaamsass, I just noticed that in the Shiite schools of jurisprudence that you posted about, the names all end in yah.

  

  Very interesting. I shall have to look into the history there methinks.
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  26

  I Don't Think The Witnesses Really Care If You Can Explain Doctrine As Long As You Accept Them!

  by minimus in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  gone are the days of getting into discussions about their beliefs.

  doing major research to prove a position or watchtower doctrine is a thing of the past.

  all they want from you is to surrender and accept everything they say as undeniable truth.. do you agree?.

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  fiddler

  "It seems to me that the current GB is the product of a "second generation" in the cult (no overlapping pun intended). People like Russell, Rutherford and Franz were founders. Now the ones in charge, the only ones left, are the followers -- the ones who learned from the founders but aren't made of the same stuff. There's an intellectual dilution akin to an artist who copies another artist's painting."

  I agree Apognophos. If it goes on long enough I wonder what the followers of the followers will sound like? Abstract comics maybe?

  Never mind. I can hardly deal with the dumbed down emptiness of the current situation. Mind you, I don't even believe in the infallible word of the Bible anymore but please............it is still a collection of books that can be commented upon. The Commentary on the Letter of James was probably the last good book the WT ever produced but yeah........Ray Franz wrote that one.
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  17

  Happy 4th to my American friends

  by punkofnice in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i don't care about the political shizz behind it and i am a brit as you (y'all), know.. enjoy the fireworks.

  enjoy your day.. regards paul .

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  fiddler

  Our towns 4th of July parade goes right in front of my house. This was my first year here so I sat out on my primo perch, my front doorstep, and watched the parade roll by. My dog usually puts on a pretty good 'guard dog' growling bark when ONE person steps into 'his' yard. I was wondering how it would go this morning because the street has been cordoned off all week with lawn chairs and tape. So I put him on a leash (a short leash) and walked him around the neighborhood then sat on my doorstep with him For a few minutes. There were not only people on the curb but meandering through the front yard non stop and I think Judge counted himself outnumbered and looked at me with a 'can I go inside now' look. He never barked once! Tonight will be the next hurdle ~ how he handles the fireworks!

  Happy 4th all Americans and thank you Brits for making it all possible ; )