here is another paradox resulting from the wts stand on the flood:
1. jws seriously believe in 2370 bc as the date of the flood
2. they also believe that by the 1st century ad racial differences had been well developed (i mean differences in the outward appearance of course, and not their early racist views for instance).
Something tells me pole doesn't know many black families...
LOL. I see your point. But we'd need a black-caucasian-oriental-indian-semitic-whatever family situation here, right? For instance could you have three sons, each of them of a different race (same parents)?
Darn it! I knew I didn't read the Genesis carefully enough!
Pole the Ignorant
here is another paradox resulting from the wts stand on the flood:
1. jws seriously believe in 2370 bc as the date of the flood
2. they also believe that by the 1st century ad racial differences had been well developed (i mean differences in the outward appearance of course, and not their early racist views for instance).
czar
I have read some interesting papers on higher speed evolution; and the earth does have amazing recuperative powers from natural disasters.
Yes, I guess evolutional leaps are conceivable, but you'd not believe thousands of new species could evolve over less than 4000 years, would you?
And even if you believe it, the point is that the WTS has tried to ridicule a more moderate version of evolution. It's like saying you don't believe there's any form of Jewish conspiracy, but at the same time you claim to have evidence of alien conspiracy.
Pole
here is another paradox resulting from the wts stand on the flood:
1. jws seriously believe in 2370 bc as the date of the flood
2. they also believe that by the 1st century ad racial differences had been well developed (i mean differences in the outward appearance of course, and not their early racist views for instance).
Leolaia,
So, despite their strenuous efforts to deny evolution, the Society ends up assuming evolution after all! And this is evolution on a scale far beyond that proposed by "evolutionists" -- instead of such changes arising over millions of years, these changes must have arisen after only a few thousand years, or less! The genetic diversity within the human species (roughly categorized socially into "races") is truly a pale reflection of this amazing process of genetic change that the Society is forced to assume occurred after the Flood.
Very good point!!! I was actually hoping someone would draw this conclusion and put it more elegantly than I could. And the final conclusion is worth repeating:
The WTS is either dumb or hypocritical enough to implicitly support hyper-speed evolution, despite the fact that it explicitly denounces the more reasonable versions of this theory!!!
DUH!
Pole the Gullible Inquirer
here is another paradox resulting from the wts stand on the flood:
1. jws seriously believe in 2370 bc as the date of the flood
2. they also believe that by the 1st century ad racial differences had been well developed (i mean differences in the outward appearance of course, and not their early racist views for instance).
Here is another paradox resulting from the WTS stand on the Flood:
1. JWs seriously believe in 2370 BC as the date of the Flood
2. They also believe that by the 1 st century AD racial differences had been well developed (I mean differences in the outward appearance of course, and not their early racist views for instance). This is evident in some of their publications with illustrations showing the baptism of the Ethiopian eunuch who could pass for a black guy by ?modern standards?
3. They also estimate that the Tower of Babel incident took place around 2180 BC. Between 2370 and 2180 BC mankind must have been racially homogenous, so the different groups of humans could have been separated only after the ToB
4. Now it?s not really possible that Shem was black, Ham was oriental and Ja´pheth was a blond white boy (or whichever way you want it), because they had the same parents and anyway their offspring must have started ?mixing? at some point.
As a result the WTS ?bible-based? anthropology asserts that:
A) Only 2200 years are allowed for all the racial differences to develop by the 1 st century AD
B) Although racial differences had been developing rapidly before the 1 st century, little has changed since the 1 st century until now , although the period of time in question is only 200 years shorter. This process stopped rather miraculously around the 1 st century AD!
What a pile of horsesh**t!
Or am I getting something wrong?
Pole
jw doctrine teaches that the 1,000 years of christ corresponds to "judgment day," and everyone who has not already been judged will be resurrected from the dead.
the exceptions would be those who died during the flood, the destruction of sodom and gomorrah, and a few odd individuals.
but that's only the people living today.
Leolaia,
Yes. You're right. I only looked at the population figures (same website, diferent page), because I asumed they would include births (1 year old and younger babies were humans so even if they wouldn't reach adulthood I thougt they'd be represented in those statistics).
However, as we have agreed, JWs wouldn't recognize those stats because they are totally out of keeping with their chronology and the idea of just three couples who could have children just after the Flood. Oh well, four, if you think Noah was a robust old man :).
The problem is that, as you showed, if you stick to the WT chronology, you end up having a paradox which is probably worse than the overpopulation of the paradise.
I guess every ancient woman living between 2370 BC and 1990 BC must have had quintuplets twice a year for twenty-five consequtive years of her adulthood :).
Edtied to add: Wait! Wouldn't that be the fulfillment of God's gloomy prophecy ? ?I shall greatly increase the pain of your pregnancy; in birth pangs you will bring forth children, and your craving will be for your husband, and he will dominate you.?
Pole
jw doctrine teaches that the 1,000 years of christ corresponds to "judgment day," and everyone who has not already been judged will be resurrected from the dead.
the exceptions would be those who died during the flood, the destruction of sodom and gomorrah, and a few odd individuals.
but that's only the people living today.
Leolaia,
Sorry to be the devil's advocate, but I'd be interested in the sources of your statistics, especially as far as the number of people born before the 20th century.
The answer I had as a JW was this:
My impression was that the world population has been growing exponentially and that it only reached the 1 billion mark in the late 19th century.
Check out this link:
Now, assuming that you believe in the WT chronology, you have to start some 4,000 years ago (?) with the 6 survivors of the Flood. That would do it for me.
Of course at that time I accepted their chronology and stuff. But that's how easy life gets for JWs. Either you accept the entire doctine or you refute it all as crap.
Pole
Danny,
Can we keep up Pole?
If you mean keep up to date on this story - sure. If you mean something else, please explain. My comprehension of English is poor, I know.
I'll try googling for more reports on this in the next few days. I'll also edit my posts so that the actual text of the story is here and not only the link (in case they take it down from their servers).
http://www.canada.com/calgary/calgaryherald/news/story.html?id=15dc2aa1-a700-4df3-9429-90ce861b99c0
Father files lawsuit against Jehovah's Witness'
Calgary Herald
Friday, August 27, 2004
CALGARY -- A lawsuit claims Jehovah's Witness members used the fear of damnation to convince a young leukemia victim to shun blood transfusions.
The suit has been filed by the dead teen's father.
It alleges the influence exerted on Bethany Hughes by her mother and other Jehovah's Witnesses directly led to her death two years ago.
The lawsuit was filed Wednesday by Lawrence Hughes on behalf of himself and Bethany's estate.
Hughes, split with the religious group and his family and sought conventional treatment for the teen while she was ill.
The statement of claim names the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society of Canada and several Jehovah's Witnesses as defendants.
Also named is the Cross Cancer Institute in Edmonton and doctors there who treated Bethany up to the time of her death on September 5th, 2002, when she was 17.
YEah, I noticed that. It's fixed now.
Thanks Danny, I'm pasting it in:
http://calgary.cbc.ca/regional/servlet/View?filename=ca_hughes20040827
Father sues church, docs over daughter's treatment
Last Updated: Aug 27 2004 07:53 AM MDT
Calgary - A man who waged a bitter battle to have his daughter receive a blood transfusion ? against her wishes ? is suing his former church bretheren and doctors at an Edmonton cancer centre.
Bethany Hughes died of leukemia two years ago, after making a public stand for her Jehovah's Witness faith, which prohibits blood transfusions.
Her father Lawrence broke with his church and his wife over treatment for the 16 year old. He fought a lengthy court battle, trying to have Bethany given blood, which she finally received after being made a temporary ward of the province.
Now he is suing his former wife, the Watchtower Society of Canada and doctors at the Cross Cancer Institute. In a statement of claim, Hughes alleges that Bethany's mother and other Jehovah's Witnesses misled his daughter about the merits of blood transfusions.
He claims they exerted undue influence by telling the teen she would be eternally damned if she agreed to the transfusions.
Hughes also says in his statement of claim that they moved Bethany to the Cross Cancer Institute, where she could be given an alternative treatment.
Bethany Hughes was moved to the Cross after being discharged from the Alberta Children's Hospital in July 2002, where doctors said she was too ill to continue being treated with chemotherapy and transfusions. She died less than two months later, just after turning 17.
In his statement of claim, Lawrence Hughes says the Cross Cancer Institute gave her an alternate treatment without proper consent.
None of the statements in the claim have been proven in court. Those mentioned in the lawsuit ? some of whom haven't been served notice ? weren't prepared to comment.
From Danny's News Alerts:
